Blizzard will never admit that Survival rework is a failure

Honestly, I don’t think that’s that big of a deal. I would like for all of our specs to always perform well, but realistically I know that will not always be the case.

At any rate, I don’t think potential balance is a good reason to not give players what they want back. I think having more class themes and what not in a RPG is a good thing, regardless of whether it’s always good or not.

It doesn’t stop you from playing current SV as an example (or at least, I don’t think it does since I know you’re on EU so I don’t know your character). I highly doubt it would stop those who would like to play a RSV either.

But see I dont think it is a failure, I think it’s a massive success. I love the rework and it’s the only hunter spec I actually play and like.

At the end of a season yes. But at the start, unless you got friends, it will be very hard to get into pug groups.

Same name on Argent-Dawn. 1340 rio, KSM, 222ilvl 3/10mythic, 1800 rbg, trash in arena.

Pretty average all things considered

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While this can be the case, I just don’t see it as that big of a deal. Friends and guilds help alleviate that problem.

I do think that is a QOL issue, but I don’t really expect blizz to fix that since it’s more of a community perception thing if that makes sense.

Sorry, I wasn’t meaning to call into question your character or anything like that haha. Only mentioned it since while I know you post frequently, wasn’t sure if you were actively playing your hunter still, leveling alts, etc. Or if you felt like you had to stop playing SV for reasons I was unaware of.

Again, apologies, wasn’t meaning to call into question your character.

And the fact that you, a Paladin who doesn’t like Hunters, like the spec shows exactly why it’s a failure. It’s explicitly designed to appeal to melee players instead of Hunters meaning most Hunters avoid it, but most melee players end up sticking to their own classes like the one you’re posting from.

It might be a massive success for you because of your melee preferences, but the fact that less than 5% of Hunters are playing the spec speaks for itself.


So you are saying the game is dying in the EU too because of Melee Hunters. :stuck_out_tongue:


I always felt like Survival should have been a tank spec where your pet helps you tank and different pets can give you different buff/utility abilities.

I’m not a tanking kinda guy, but If I had to tank and it were a new class, I’d prefer my shaman. THematically it just seems cooler to me. :wink:

No. I think the vast majority of the hunter players would be ecstatic. RSV players for RSV being back, and MM players for not having to deal with blizzard trying to put RSV even a little into MM.

The numbers say you’re wrong. We’re all of agreement that despite the the 9.0.5 changes, (‘bug fix’ then returning some of the damage lost) that MM is still better than BM, yet more than 40% of hunters play BM. Even before 9.0.5, more than 1/3rd of hunters were BM.

Hunter Population - Google Sheets

Statistics -


And yet only a quarter of hunters chose to play it in raids. would be no different if sv suddenly became ranged again.

“Oh you’re playing the inferior spec?” you have been removed from the group

Already said it before, during the end of a season, it wouldn’t be too bad, but at the start?

EDIT: post #666 :stuck_out_tongue:

I just have a question for people wanting rsv to come back and this isn’t meant to patronize anyone. What about the spec do you want back for it? Just range? Traps? DoTs?

The hunter fantasy. I don’t ever think “Ahh yes. The hunter archetype of chasing people around with a polearm. Sign me up!”

Personally, I don’t even like the fact that Lone Wolf is a thing. Hunter, to me, is: Ranged damage dealer with pet; primary source of damage delivery being a ranged weapon. In my opinion (as I have said before) Hunters should be an analog for Locks. BM–>Demo, MM–>Chaos, SV–> Affliction. SV should be more DOT-ish, dealing poison/bleed/burn damage through traps, stings, burning arrows, etc.

Also, as I have said before, I don’t understand the way SV works. In PVP, you spend the vast majority of your time at range as a melee class with a 2 HANDED WEAPON. Should you not be in there jackin people up with that thing? It’s counterintuitive.


I’ll have to play devils advocate here. Considering the “Hunter fantasy” for starters I’d understand if we were the Archer class but we are Hunters. Hunters Track and find their prey using whatever weapons they have. A hunter can have a hatchet, a bow, a sword, a spear, or a gun. Chasing your prey around with a polearm isn’t a new thing for a Hunter. (Think caveman, or tribal people) I think using a variety of tools to hunt your targets is what fulfills that hunter fantasy.

Also if you want hunter specs to be analogs for warlocks then what would be so unique about being a hunter? Choosing what skin your pet has? Every class should be unique and different not an analog of each other.


Who said that? If it’s not in world first races that means it’s failed spec?

It’s in good spot. Make it better and it will overthrow other specs in a hearth beat. I always pick SV hunter for high keys , it has nice control, nice damage and even in ST damage it’s not bad. Especially if it’s Kyrian hunter. I saw hunter in +15 hiring 10K with balance druid in group pulls.

In next patch SV is getting nice buffs , it’s 15% damage increase to Single target attacks. Other classes are getting some nerfs so it brings some balance. If you think class should be ranged you have two ranged specs , already as hunter so didn’t bother with something you don’t play or like

You simply can’t ignore a spec that you don’t play and leave it to people who enjoy it. You have to say it on every post together with that beepe and lvl 10 orc?
You and other max lvl hunter got out dps by other hunters in M+ So shhhh. Let people enjoy the spec. I can’t thank enough to God and blizzard for not listening to forum comments like yours regard hunters

Who hunts with a hatchet or sword? I’ll grant a spear, but the method by which those were used is wildly different than what you’re imagining, I’d wager. Persistence hunting doesn’t exactly translate to a playable archetype, i.e., chasing something until it’s tired and then stabbing it with a stick. Further, the dudes that did that (IF they actually did it) did it in groups. I’m basing my interpretation on the archetype that Blizzard laid out in 2005, and stuck with for like a decade.


Mountain men use hatchets. Think something akin to Grizzly Adams. And a sword can be synonymous with a machete. Persistence hunting totally translates to wow IE outlasting your prey SURVIVING then stabbing them with your stick.

How do they use those hatchets? Do they track prey and then get into a scrum with them?

They hit them with it?

Go to google. Look up hunting hatchet. You can even look up the one from rdr2. I mean if you’re gonna say smacking an enemy melee range doesn’t fit the fantasy neither does throwing a trap at their face.

I liked having dot management and fast paced reactionary gameplay along with the rest of the hunter toolkit (pets, traps, and high mobility). To me, the old spec fit well with my idea of being an arcane archer, someone who specifically infuses their shots with various kinds of magic to rend their enemies apart from afar while controlling the flow of battle.

Would be my take on the idea, though the post should be updated at some point. If you’re less inclined to the magic take on things, I would recommend Ghorak’s idea instead.

To me, the gameplay that I enjoyed no longer exists, and thematically the two ranged specs we do have don’t fill a niche that I think SV could have easily have filled if they thought it was too similar to MM at the time.

The base class itself is fundamentally very different from the warlock IMO. I think there’s only so many damage profiles you can realistically have (consistent / burst / dots which sort of fall under consistent).

The same was not extended to the old spec and its players. But I don’t think Dawn was attacking SV there. A lot of us would much prefer a 4th spec to avoid the same mistakes Legion made.