Blizzard trying to villainize Tyrande

Community General Discussion
446

I wanted to point out something here real quick, why is it when an Alliance member kills a Horde member its murder and when a Horde member kills an Alliance member its war? Just a strange thing I noticed especially after the Horde launched a surprise attack on Teldrissil which ended with the deaths of thousands of civilians. Something the Horde has a recurring connection to considering it originally came to Azeroth on the Path of Glory which was paved also with the bones of civilians (ie men, women and children). I don’t think objectivity should be brought up when those events are always forgotten and glossed over. Heck, its the first time in game that any member of the Horde has ever reminded people what its introduction to Azeroth entailed. Something apparently Thrall didn’t consider when calling themselves Horde would tie it too.

How they write Tyrande is probably anyone’s guess at this point and how everyone reacts to her actions will also be whatever the writers want it to be seen as. So her actions could be totally justified and still be cast as the move of a villain. My fear is that whatever she does it will be done in such a way as to make her choices appear foolish and illogical. Like vengeance cannot also be logical and clear minded. Which is really just seeking to punish someone who has done something wrong.

Teldrissil’s burning can be laid at the feet of the Horde or simply at Sylvanas’s and her refusing to forgive the whole of the Horde while Sylvanas lives isn’t that unreasonable. I just think they are wanting us to see it as such. But there’s no way she’s done anything, or seems to have planned, anything remotely close to what’s been done to the night elves. Its even stated she’ll sign the treaty in the banshee’s blood. Maybe they will have Tyrande motivate everyone to find and kill her but it seems they have set this up as some impossible task. And given the writers have promised not to kill Sylvanas I guess it is.

Tyrande’s in a bad spot when the writing team favors Sylvanas so much higher than her or really any other character in this game. Something that continues to divide and really damages the community of this game. Just like that time they really got it bad for Thrall and had him become the sole savior of the world. Only with Sylvanas they’ve made her the bestest at everything at the slightest whim of a writer while doing some very bad things (look at the number of times she planned to have her plans not work). And Tyrande seems posed to become the next character assassination they do to build up Sylvanas. Heck, Tyrande has what two whole moments in this entire expansion? And she represents the victims of Sylvanas’s treachery. Makes me thing the deaths of all those night elves wasn’t important and really its about these guys that caused it who should concern us. Tyrande why don’t you and your people go off and do an introduction to a warfront or something and get out of the way. Thanks.

All in all, this still feels a bit too similar to Garrosh 2.0 only this time he wins. And Tyrande looks to about to have a bell dropped on her. They probably want all of us to cheer when that happens because not-Sylvanas equal bad. You yourself are already starting to classify whatever Tyrande does as evil sight unseen. Is it really evil to want someone to answer for the crimes that have been committed and not so quick to forgive their associates while the criminal is still loose? But that doesn’t mean I don’t think your view probably isn’t going to be what the writers go for. I fear that’s exactly what they want to do with her. I just dread seeing it unfold.

2 Likes
447

it’s not, it only matters if peace is agreed on or not

happened during active wartime
while wrong it wasn’t some unprovoked thing, marching to silithus to secure azerite on their land caused the alliance to march to war…so let’s not pretend that it was some random assault

the path of glory occurred because the Dreanei settled on a planet with superstitious individuals and didn’t both warning them at ALL of an extremely dangerous threat they knew were capable of whipping up worse
the orcs held off until their blood ended up being demon infused and resisting simply wasn’t possible anymore

her actions…whatever they are will be, she’s not evil.

she is foolish and illogical, she has consistently been so since her introduction in WC3

…except that she fled and was to be killed
it’s like saying that if a putin fled into exile the U.S couldn’t have good relations with them until they lay the head of a guy they have no idea where went at their feet

448

than every fan of something Is a cult

449

The problem is the burning of Teldrassil, killing civilians and children. One thing is attacking soldiers because of unsettled grudges, another thing is to nearly wipe out an entire race.

2 Likes
450

Outside of the events on Darkshore there is nothing to suggest that she is actively, or will attack the horde out of a blind rage… yes she’s angry, but she’s not dumb either. This is going to get settled with Sylvanas and Nathanos.

1 Like
451

Ever since wc3 and the blood elves I haven’t seen alliance as good guys. Horde neither both have committed atrocities and affronts to living beings. It really wouldn’t be hard to do. They kept orcs as slaves even after the burning legion blood no longer affected them.

453

Problem is since the writers won’t let us kill either Nathanos or Sylvanas, they will probably either make Tyrande die against those or turn her nameplate red and make us kill her.

454

Yeah, I hope they don’t try this, I hate claiming victim status… but Night elves do not need to be crapped on anymore. Plenty of other alliance races for this.

2 Likes
455

After all they’ve done to the race, I don’t think they’d restrain from spitting on our graves by doing stuff like

  • villainizing Tyrande
  • redeeming Sylvanas
  • Giving Horde undead night elves
3 Likes
456

I’m not unreasonable. Horde will be forgiven after the near genocide of one of their races, innocents included. Blood elf genocide sounds decent IMO.

457

Haven’t you heard all the silly alliance asking for a villan though? Like how awesome it was all the horde heros were?!??!

Yea it’s not awesome. Hopefully they don’t kill her off to. RIP garrosh/voljin/cairne/sylvanas

458

I don’t recall much of asking for the alliance to get a story that parallels the Garrosh, and Sylvanas stories… in fact it got old after Garrosh. We don’t need that especially Tyrande, I don’t mind seeing the alliance not be perfect though. Tyrande and Glenn pushing Anduins buttons for a better deal or armistice is what we need.

459

The problem is that it is completely unreasonable and next level stupid if they villainize Tyrande for being right in everything she does and say.

1 Like
460

Except shes in the right. So…

1 Like
461

Eh there has been plenty of threads of people saying how lucky horde is to have all the heroes doing stuff… They were basically all just dying. Forgot to throw saurfang on the heap.

And plenty of threads saying they’re tired of being the good guys. Seriously the horde story lines are questionable. I liked the lead up to mop and mop but after that you guys could have had all the story and I would have been happier.

462

We did get some focus in legion, but not really to advance the alliance as a whole.

I think part of the wanting to be “the bad guys” was just that we haves been painted as something so good it was easy to mock. I’d rather be gray in this case, do some questionably bad stuff but never go over the line.

Hopefully the faction war is behind us, and we can move on to bigger things other than horde vs alliance.

463

It’s not really genocide because she didn’t kill them because they where Night Elves, she killed them because they were an obstacle in her way. Genocide implies that the people killed were targeted for due to their race or religion.

This is covered in the novels, travel in the story arc is no where near as easy as we enjoy in game. Teleportation between the capitals isn’t something always active and requires significant effort to maintain. The navy that would be used to sail the civilian population to safety had already set sail days before hand and only arrived back near the end. Which the Horde fleet already present, trying to sail out would have been crazy. Citizens don’t have hearth stones and the only way out was by land thru the Horde army, by sea thru the Horde navy or a slow evacuation thru the portals.

The biggest reason is we received such bad intelligence from SI:7 (seriously have to wonder about Shaw, he has been pretty freaking worthless the last two expansions) and it wasn’t until they were upon our borders did anyone understand the depth of their mistake. Even then, no one thought (even the Horde) that the city was actually going to fall or that Sylvanas would destroy it.

464

maybe when you lose access to an area don’t send an invasion force leaving your home mostly undefended?

the entire belief was that it was going to be weaponized…and yet it was the alliance who weaponized it first

i doubt it was shaw, he’s typically been shown to be a brilliant agent and wouldn’t do something as stupid as send a full fledged army into enemy territory to secure a potential weapon and leave the extremely close by settlements undefended

even had his intelligence been good…the reality is that by sending the bulk of your forces to intercept in such a manner you leave an opportunity that someone like shaw and the banshee wouldn’t pass up

the horde believed it’d fall when malfurion did

which is understandable…but how many nations are genuinely willing to leave their homeland sparsely defended AND with no evacuation method?

honestly though it was mostly a snarky remark about how they left their home without evacuation methods to instead launch an offensive into silithus using transports that would be faster than marching an army to darnassus…leaving this giant opening that tactically makes sense to take

knowing it’s their only remaining base of operations on the continent you’d think they’d either have evac methods always prepped…or not abandon it at the first sign an army is marching nearby

465

We didn’t lose access to an area, it is just faster for the NEs to sail down to their outpost Feralas than try and march down their directly thru Horde controlled lands.

And remind me who brought an AZ powered tank to The Undercity? The Alliance could weaponize it because they lost access to the largest deposit of it when the NE lands fell.

To be fair, even if the entire NE army had been present they would have still lost against the combined forces of the Horde.

And that would only occur because the writers think the Alliance are morons. Good luck trying to take a city nestled in the top of a world tree. With the only access being a teleport platform. You guys would have been sitting ducks when you came out. The NEs sents could have just formed a ring around it and rained arrows into the teleport platform all day long.

It wasn’t sparsely defended, even with the element of surprise (remember the Horde started with stealth attacks as deep in Astranna) it still took the Horde DAYS to fight there way there. If they actually tried to siege the world tree, it would have been weeks. Giving the Alliance more then enough time to reinforce the NE military and defend Darnasus. Honestly, the plan made zero sense even if you kill Malfurion. The NEs wouldn’t have surrendered, it would have only enraged them to fight on even more. Which is why she decided to destroy it because she finally understand that she would never be able to hold it.

466

according to elegy they did.

are you trying to say they couldn’t weaponize azerite because they lost access? or that they weaponized it because they lost access?

azerite is…insanely strong, large quantities aren’t needed to use it as a weapon or even learning to weaponize it as the story has shown a few times for both sides

it’s more arrogance that is fairly justified
malfurion is considered an extreme hero to the elves and is on par with actual demi gods
the belief was simply that killing such a being that DIDN’T have the cenarius “always alive” crap to him would crumble the defenses

possibly, even likely. but it’s not a nonsensical plan
look at the real world for example…when we want to crumble any sort of orgnization or defense we aim specifically to target the head
and this tactic typically works, when nations, groups or even radical orgnizations have their leaders destroyed the group as a whole will usually falter to a degree that makes them easier to hit

the idea wasn’t to hold it forever, just long enough to force the alliance to be a non threat
and according to the alli quest text…tyrande thought this was
A. the plan
B. possible
the Kaldorei are monsters thought and personally i don’t see it as likely it’d result in much more than pissing them off and causing an all out offensive that would result in either the extermination of the kaldorei or the destruction of every race that fought in the campaign
but since tyrande didn’t view the occupation as impossible it seems…likely the plan would’ve succeeded until something long term came about
on the condition that the druid dies, which didn’t happen because orc honor is dumber than an ogre baby

even if we take this, why were the worgen capable of retreating in mere hours? what precisely took the elves so long to retreat?

if the books are to be believed…or even the quests it was the city guard alone that was left to defend the ENTIRE region, when they set sail for silithus they weren’t even beyond the barrens yet

no, not it isn’t. it’s the easiest way sure, but there are numerous ways to get into darnassus that don’t involve funneling into a singular area
the most obvious of which is an air assault with already existing machines on the battlefield

how big do you think the city guard is?
legitimately…

let’s use a “real” example
an army is marching from mexico north and we assume they’re going to say…cali…
how long do you think the texas (chosen purely because of tropes) national guard, militias and local police force would be able to hold it off? bear in mind that the “army” in question is enough to warrent the U.S mobilizing as many troops as it can towards new mexico in defense

by all standards the darnassus guard was smaller than the army sent towards silithus at any rate, they took the bulk of their forced away from their home when the enemy was closer to ones home than the area you thought you were marching to
IF such a force was a threat…as would be indicated if you felt the need to send the bulk of your forces to intercept them in a further location
how does one expect the guard to hold out?

it either was…or wasn’t a threat