See, the thing here is, IF blizzard wanted simply to prevent high ilvl groups pushing floors to not abuse cooldowns, they could simply prevent cooldowns like heroism/bloodlust from refreshing more than once per floor.
This is another case of the motivation put forth being false.
Truth is, this is simply mythic plus being shoved down everyone’s throat…the keys, the timer, etc.
And I’m terribly sorry Blizz, but you won’t get away with that…People can see right through your ruse on this one. And I’ll be damned if you’re gonna force me to play a game mode i’ve already rejected two expansions in a row.
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Because every single one of your replies prior to that post were nothing short of ignorant about Torghast and its design, and your first thought was “oh wow timers xd” and the “oh I was completely wrong about everything else” was an after-thought.
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If this were true then these torments would kick in on lower floors, not the floors specifically for groups and players pushing high levels.
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Because you’re intentionally being obtuse.
Bosses have enrage timers. Warpstone said, “just like a pig with lipstick is still a pig, a timer is a timer no matter how you dress it up.” Dungeons and raids are full of bosses. Ergo, dungeons and raids are full of “dressed up pig” timers.
Nothing, because that’s like standing in the safe room of a Torghast floor. As soon as you’ve exited the safe room, you’re “pulled” the “boss” that the floor is and are actively fighting it. Going AFK in the middle of a Torghast floor is functionally equivalent to going AFK in the middle of a boss fight.
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Why not have the mobs become progressively more difficult to the point that the cooldowns won’t even help? Isn’t that the point of pushing to the limit in content like Torghast?
Isn’t Torghast incredibly undertuned right now? Why throw in these Torments as a band-aid to a problem that may not even really exist?
Mobs already become progressively more difficult with each floor.
It’s part of continuous tuning. If, as they tune the tower more, the torments become unnecessary, they can be removed. I don’t understand the outcry of using them as a testing solution, particularly when we’re, what, a month into alpha?
Really? I didn’t know that there were floors specifically assigned for the creme de la creme of the community, i thought all of us had access to everything, since we all pay the same sub every month.
You didn’t know that each floor gets more difficult than the last, and so better players will reach higher floors? Or, like, what’s your argument here? You have access to, say, floor 30, in the same way you have access to Mythic Raiding. That doesn’t mean just anyone can get to floor 30.
We did ask for mythic plus rewards without a timer.
Timers are being added when it was told to us it was to have NO timers.
The rewards have not fully been sorted out yet - no one really knows them.
But you like to fling the large insulting words around and enjoy telling us that a timer is not really a timer. I’m generally cool even with people who don’t agree with me, but I do not enjoy being scolded at by someone who can’t even realize what a timer is!
Are apples still apples because that sounded like confirmation that there are timers…
No experience w/ it but I’ll give the tower a shot when the expac launches. If it sucks for me I won’t play it, done deal.
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You’re kind of all-over-the-map here. Maybe this thread is.
What do you want to be accomplished by these Torments?
Is it to prevent people from cheesing cooldowns?
You did ask for this, but Torghast was never proposed as the answer to this.
They never promised you any content that would give m+ rewards without the timer, so the indignity that blizzard has ripped such a thing away from you, as you claim, is entirely invented.
This never happened, because Torghast was never going to be that one place to begin with.
The fact that I have to explain to you that I can be a casual, a soloer, and still push past the 10th floor shows the very nature of the community divide here.
What I am saying is the the restriction should not be based on the floor you are at, since you seem to defend it so vigorously, but to the type of advancement (solo/group) and ilvl.
In other words, if I solo up to lvl 11 in quest greens or with whatever gear i can acquire playing by myself, I shouldnt face the same restrictions as your mythic+ guild.
You can’t take away a class’ ability while claiming it should be “played like normal”.
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There’s a huge problem here where they seem set on the idea this is something they can tune. No matter how mediocre the debuffs are if the fix is to scale something over time it will ruin the experience because of the mental implications. People don’t need to experience the soft timers to know the guilt and anxiety associated with going against one.
They can limit cooldown usage per floor and fix both those should and shouldn’t problems. It’s so damn simple and if they focus too much tuning around this it’s going to waste time and end in failure. There’s simply no way to tune this because it’s a pace feeling not a balance issue.
I didn’t say otherwise. All I said was that these torments kick in only for players make a concerted effort to push high levels. If you don’t want to feel pressure, if you want a more relaxed, casual experience – don’t push high floors in the first place.
Item level is irrelevant in Torghast because of the way anima powers and such modify your abilities; everyone becomes so overpowered that where they start from doesn’t really matter, so tuning Torments to only apply to, like, 480, seems silly. The instance already scales based upon whether or not you’re solo or in a group, and based upon the spec you are. The difficulty already varies based upon who you are and what you’re doing.
Spare me the indignant outrage, please, and stop inventing claims I’m not making.
I don’t want anything to be accomplished by these Torments. As I said in another comment, I don’t even like Torghast at all. The foundational concept is not something I enjoy.
Exactly. timers have an inherent psychological consequence that detract from the core experience of what torghast was sold as. They take away the pleasure of exploration and looting, and taking your time to strategize.
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I think this is where I would fall on the issue. If people and Blizzard are arguing in good faith that this is about not abusing/cheesing cooldowns rather than just being a “hurry up and get it done” mechanic, then limiting the cooldown use per floor seems the most fair way to do it. It’s like when they made it so you could only pot once per fight.
Then you can balance the floor/engagement around the idea that some of the pulls will be much harder than average for that floor, thereby preserving the need for the cooldowns without cheesing them.
Anything else feels bad or like a punishment. Might as well just have the Reaper…err…Tarragrue appear just for staying on a floor too long.
Best approach IMO. Even if I’ve been arguing for it I have no clue if it’ll actually feel good for me. I’m not going to pre-judge it though.
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Yep, I will not step foot in mythic+ and if a timer is added to torghast I will not step foot in there either.
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