Yeah I believe we can use flash heal, but likely you’re still gonna smend. Atonement application is important and Smend has some good talent support now (+2s atonement and DoT dropoff). Especially in M+, considering the standard M+ build MOST LIKELY goes down the right because wicked star sounds way too good (and you can still take purge the wicked +2 spread).
I also find being forced into PoM a little strange - cause it’s not likely any build will use it much. Too many talents wasted to get PoM feeling good.
A few thoughts perspective of a priest who plays holy 98% of the time:
-Right now as holy I have no reason to use pw:s and even with several talents attempting to force me to want to cast it I still don’t want to. Am I wrong or could pw:s and renew be a choice talent? The bonuses tacked onto pw:s like body/soul etc could work with renew instead if you take renew. I see a similar problem with holy fire / mind blast unless holy fire will replace MB.
-Cool to have shadowfiend back. I hope I can still make it into a lightspawn.
-I really miss cascade. I know the “choice” talents are currently limited to two but maybe we could have more than 2 choices? Would be nice to bring back cascade as a choice with divine star and halo.
-I’m not really sure what’s going on with the right side of the holy tree. I see a lot of damage boosts with no healing. Maybe they envision us smiting for free flash heals a lot…
yeah but PoM wont require any effort. just fire and forget but i have to say im personally glad to have it back. I miss that sound haha. I miss the sound in legion more when you hymned and it made PoM bounce around.
With them fixing the shadow cov not being able to dispel inconvenenice then it will be worth taking in keys, espcially with dark penance. Im not 100% agsint contrition. I dont lilke it but since we kinda have to take it i can live with some extra healing when i DP in keys with pwr up
I just don’t know if we can spare the global. Especially considering we’ll be ramping in raid. And in M+ PoM’s never been like fantastic or anything, and we’ve already got shadow covenant (with shadow penance) mindgames, light’s wrath, etc. We’ve just got so many tools now that I don’t know if I’d use PoM without talent support from holy.
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use it as your running in bertween packs. If it does heal xtra off atonement then nice. But its free bro. It doesnt cost us anything and in raids where we DO have down time and conserving some mana we can use it then, tho with inner will variant we have and solace, fiend, i think we will swim in mana
Yeah no. PW:S still won’t be worth keeping up on yourself for those shield talents. I also don’t see Holy Word: Life being any useful. The only thing it might do is help with Sanc resets.
Realistically, Holy’s going to be skipping Tools of the Cloth 100% of the time. Upside is Renew is almost certainly worth casting now. Basically I expect holy on the class tree to go down the left side, go down the middle to translucent image, then take the mind blast improvement and grab twist of fate, shadowfiend and improved shadowfiend from the rest.
Holy having access to twist of fate is actually kinda crazy if it happens before a hymn or something.
It’s their M+ half of the tree. The left side of Holy is all pretty poor healing for M+. Right side boosts damage and increases SoL procs, which is more useful in M+. Unfortunate news for Holy is that Symbol of Hope is over there, and likely will be wanted in raid fights soooo… That’s not great.
Yeah just, in my experience playing holy, doing that is OK, but still barely worth the mana in M+. Add in literally 0 other talent support for it, and it just seems pretty weak. Especially considering the M+ build I’m planning to run literally has Mindgames, Scov, Schism, Light’s Wrath and Shadow Covenant. I just don’t wanna find a keybind for it honestly.
i wasnt going to run lights wrath in keys. With the damage based off atonements out im not sure its worth it. I remember in legion in keys it wasnt worth it either. Wickedness was definately getting a play tho and was the only bottom talent i was going to run for keys
and PoM bro is flavor. Not everything has to be op or syergise. Its an iconic priest spell im glad to use as disc again
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In legion keys, Light’s Wrath was pretty useful. A 50% increase was still very good on it. Will have to see its damage values, but it’s certainly not bad. Consider Schism+Light’s Wrath + Mindgames, and it becomes really good.
Granted, it all really heavily depends on tuning. If wicked star isn’t a significant increase over D.star, then we’ll probably grab extra penance bolts and Smite damage instead. Silence isn’t so great an effect that it alone would make that talent worth it when there’s the possibility of consistent damage increases elsewhere.
It is worth noting that Disc has a potential 80% damage increase on Smite available through talents. That could literally make it like 30% better than Mind blast for damage, and it’s spammable.
In legion i think schism was 40%? stand to be corrected. Long time ago.
Set up my raid set up currently to run twilight empowerment. That and the swd reduction in the priest tree could see some interesting play.
Remember lights wrath wont proc off shadow cov. Not a shadow spell
First thing I’m trying is probably Improved Smite (50% smite damage) + Clerics Armaments (+10% Smite damage while shielded) + Charitable Soul (free shielding) + Lesson in humility (+20% Smite damage for 3 atonements)
It’s possible to get them all without sacrificing death throes or shadowfiend and still picking up schism/sins. It might actually be strong enough that you don’t want to cast penance offensively anymore because Smite is just better mana to damage. Which means suddenly contrition good.
Thats blasphemy. You take that back this instant.
My raid spec is mostly down the right side of the priest tree, but i dip into improved smite and enlightenment. Dont know how i feel about puppet master yet. With so much burst at our disposal things might be healed up so quick mastery might be devalued. Dipped into shadowflame, not because its great in raids but you can extend it for extra mana back and damage
It does. Purify is stated in the trees that it’s going to be baseline and something else will take that slot in disc. It’s just there as placeholder.
We are still a long way away from DF so a lot might change.
There is a lot I like in all three specs however there is also a lot I’m afraid of.
- Searing Nightmare is still in the game and if AoE is balanced around it then Spriest will continue to be bad in M+ and underperorm on AoE in raid.
- Disc gets more variety in how they heal with PoM baseline, Masochism and Feathers being available at the same time, Radiance talents vs damage talents for Atonement and Shadowfiend talents in the Priest tree. However, if Discs throughput is simply balanced around Lights Wrath in raid then trying to Atonement heal in M+/PvP is going to feel like you’re pressing 19 buttons to do less healing than other healers pressing 3 becasuse so much throughput will be gated behind Lights Wrath with 10-15 Atonement targets.
- Holy was single handedly made strong (OP) with a single Legendary in Shadowlands; Flash Concentration and that is not coming through to DF. I doubt any of the DF Holy talents will hold a candle to FC so going foward Holy is going to have to make up for the loss of FC as well as gain power along with other healing specs to compete in DF and I don’t see that with the tree we have now. Not even close.
- Disc Divine Star Silence won’t make it live so not much to say here.
I was more excited for Discs 7.2.5 mid expac talent rework than I am for Disc in 10.0 which is disappointing. All three specs feel to me like we are making 1 step forward with these talents but will be taking 2 steps back when the same problems that plagued the specs in the past return for DF because almost all talents are just old abilities coming back.
Disc throughput being gated behind 20 target Lights Wrath, Shadow being balanced around SN and Holy losing FC and trying to compete with their 10 mediocre spells against other healers that do the same with 3 spells that are more powerful.
Written by a Holy Priest main:
So, I had the chance to try out the Talent Calculator for a bit. It’s all over the place.
- Guardian Spirit should not be in the DPS section to the right. There’s just no relation between these talents and it feels bad to waste points for more dmg just to get to an essential defensive CD. Holy lacks defensive abilities anyway.
- Same with Surge of Light and Symbol of Hope into… Burning Vehemence and other DPS heavy talents? Again, I’m just wasting points into progressing into a path I really don’t want to go, but have to to get more of healing power and utility back.
- Talents like Resonant Words and Divine Words had a strong connection to Flash Concentration, as did Trail of Light. But in a raiding environment there’s just not much gain from using Flash Heal or even Heal. Heal will be a dead spell again in Dragonflight, which brings me to my next point
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Replace Lightwell with Flash Concentration. Lightwell has never worked, not in any iteration, and it’s basically been a meme spell forever. There’s a reason it had been removed. It feels almost insulting to bring this back as an ultimate talent. Flash Concentration is something that made Holy Priest viable in SL and helped the spec with doing M+ immensely. Removing FC altogether will be a hard nerf and Holy will feel really clunky, slow and weak after that again.
My suggestion is to really cut the Holy tree into three parts with baseline spells, big cooldowns and def utility in the upper rows so everyone can get them:
- Single target/Cleave heavy healing in FC style
- AoE healing with strong enhancements to Prayer of Healing
- DPS heavy style for questing or other purposes
For the general Priest tree:
- Angelic Feather should be baseline already after all these years. Holy lacks mobility anyway and it’s always been a must-have talent. Keep Body and Soul as a talent for the lower rows as an additional talent for shielding specializations, as an extra reward so to say.
- Power Infusion in the talent tree? Please don’t. It feels extremely bad to, again, make some weird talent decisions to get to a spell that will be mandatory for group activities. If you don’t want to remove it, at least transform it to a personal CD so the talent becomes a real personal choice, not something you’re pressured to take. Or keep it as baseline.
- To the left, again, I have to make some weird niche DPS choices like Cleric’s Armaments and Tools of the Cloth to get to some strong healing talents like Unwavering Will and Blessing of the Renewal. There’s just no relation or synergy.
- Holy Word:Life is a horrible spell and should be reworked or thrown out completely. If you want, then put Lightwell in there instead the Holy tree. The spell really missed the mark because especially in a raiding environment players usually don’t stay under 20% HP but get focussed by other healers really quick. Before you know it the player is over 20% again and then the Priest gets punished. That’s not really fun design.
Maybe rework it to a raid-wide utility spell that increases healing received by 30% for 8 sec. or something like that and rename it to “Symbol of Life”.
Sadly it doesn’t feel like someone with great knowledge and experience on Holy Priest worked on this. It feels like an afterthought and just throwing everything into a tree, just unstructured and not really thought out.
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um, mind games, longer schism window, castigation, twist of fate, improved smite and improved mind blast. You can’t cheerry pick one dps spell and say that.
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Some of these talents will have to be nerfed I think.
Some probably but that to my mind is why they get them out early. so they can be gone over and thought about closely
I actually like this spell. First of all it is another holy word that interacts with some talents.
It’s on a very low cd and it sounds like it heals for a good number.
It could be a life saver in some situations even if the target is not under 20% hp.
I can see it as a good spell for PvP or M+, not everything can work for all types of content.
I really don’t understand how people think FC in Dragonflight will execute the same as in Shadowlands. It’s like when people thought we would still be using Prayer of Healing in Shadowlands because it was broken in BFA.
Not having FC does not mean Hpriest is getting nerfed, there’s tons of balance changes still to be done for that statement to actually be valid.
If flash heal gets buffed and mana cost reduced you won’t ever need FC again in your life…
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In my wishlist is keeping Ascencion + matching conduit and unity
as well as baseline fae guardians (unity optional)
I love the different purposes of both of these abilities and I think they are fun and excellent complements for the priest kit. It’s crazy that only mindgames made the cut.
Other than that the talent trees are quite solid on paper, I am still unsure about disc in 5 mans but there are some cool toys in there.
I don’t think the loss of FC is the end of the world, I know many became dependent on it but I’ve done several 20+ with HA instead and frankly it works better. FC is low effort high reward which I understand people value, but I’ve had better contributions with HA.