its 40% talented, and trust me I’d much rather talent that than increased fade cooldown lol. So we heal for 40% max hp, hp pool is increased for 10 sec… I fail to see how this is 20% damage reduction. Wether we get hit with a 75k with 155k hp or 210k hp we still lose 75k. I guess if you hit it before we get hit then the extra hp pool soaks up and then we go back to 155k…
Math hard, me dumb.
Shadow can’t grab that cuz it wants pwl and mindgames damage. 40% effective hp increase with a 40% heal is better than 20% Dr, I just can’t math right now to tell you exactly how much [100/(140/40)]?. 25% is already 20% Dr effectively [100/(125/25)]
You should always press desperate prayer before / during damage, instead of after.
PWL is such a waste of talents for shadow. Wasting 5 talent points for 1 heal? No thanks.
I can max out mind games, get fade + cd + buffed desperate prayer and bulwark/or void shift.
The only time I can see PWL being an option is pvp
It’s an instant 700% spellpower heal capable of doing something no other DPS spec is capable of, and it costs literally zero damage to take. It’s probably the most valuable thing on the tree right now. The amount of relevant triage healing it does, especially for a DPS, is kinda insane.
It’s void shift on a fraction of the cooldown and doesn’t nuke someone’s hp. People are sleeping on it cuz they don’t wanna waste 4 points in the holy side of the tree, but it’s absolutely worth it. Bulwark is also a complete bait at current tuning.
You’re not wrong, but multi-hit/rot scenarios this doesn’t actually work for.
When we’re talking single big raid mechanic hits, or a boss targets you with a thing that hits hard, yeah, functionally it’s a DR. But if it’s rot damage, or you’re about to get hit more times than that HP gain, it’s not actually doing anything beyond that initial extra health.
DP is not temporary health. Hit the button, and you gain health. When your health refactors, you don’t lose anything you gained. A higher max HP is higher effective health, which is essentially what DR gets you. IE: I have a 100 health, a 20% DR means I need to take 120 damage to die. If I have 120 health, it takes 120 damage to die.
But this is more complicated when taking multiple hits. IE: Hit me for 60, 40 and 20, with 120 hp I die. With 20% dr, I do not.
I believe it’s 29%. 40% is 3.5/2.5 so inverse = 29.6% But it’s also very early so I could be an idiot. 
Yeah I thought we were still on 1 big hit, but yeah it’s very early. People still underrate the hell out of it though. Equating it to nothing
Its only 700% if your target is below 35%. So an oh shot button, for someone else.
because I’d hit VE/Prayer for myself first, and heal for a lot more than PWL even with 700%, and then I’d hit desperate prayer/VE before PWL as a self-saver.
Also currently the cd doesn’t work if it’s self cast there is no cooldown reduction.
Having to sacrifice 5 points for that feels so incredibly bad, especially considering 4 of those points are throw away. This is incredibly horrible shot design.
You know how much PWL heals for at 35%? Shadow mend without the HoT.
Thats how bad spriest got nerfed for offhealing.
Not disagreeing, just saying I don’t have anything better to put those points in.
Yes, I’m not considering it a defensive. I’m considering it triage / lifesaving in dungeons for other people. Hopefully bugs get fixed though.
I mean, if you take all those points and get prayer/fade/bulwark(hopefully buffed)/void shield (hopefully buffed) you can basically make the healer ignore you in dungeons and they just have to concentrate on 3 people
I guess we’ll see next week lol .
Yeah flash of light doesn’t hold a candle to shadow mend, and I really sincerely hope they realise that and change it. Getting access to masochism is pretty solid though, but the dot becoming a hot thing makes the spell significantly worse.
I’m not even speccing into imp flash heal and masochism right now for ptr.
the mana cost means if I’m trying to flash heal it means I can’t mass dispel cause I won’t have the mana after 2 heals and a bubble lol or god forbid I MCed a mob.
They shoulda put masochism on renew self-cast imo.
imp mass dispel losing it’s mana reduction really hurt for shadow.
It wasn’t on imp mass dispel was it? It was on the conduit.
i need coffee, this is correct. imp dispel was a pvp talent, the conduit was the mana reduction. Feelsbad
Im on my 3rd before midday. I’ll probably do a writeup today of all the “Stuff you dont realise you needed til it was gone” for the beta forums
Here’s kind of my hot take on the Holy Tree.
I think that mindbender + puppet master is too strong of an interaction. I would like to see shadowfiend retain the 100% chance to proc a coalescing shadow, but mindbender’s chance be reduced to 33%.
As another point. I think you should reconsider the stance on mind games. The damage in mind games would be much healthier for the game if it were distributed into mind blast or devouring plague. Door of shadows is the capstone talent line that shadow priests would love to see.
It’s hard to balance if your 7.5s ability has the same power as Mind Games which is on a 30-45s cd.
I take Mind Games even in a Holy PvE build because it’s passively better HPS than Holy Word Life in most situations.
Mind games damage distributed to mind blast would have mind blasts damage increased by roughly 80%. It’s not that hard. Just distribute the 300% spell power evenly amongst the mind blasts you cast during the duration of mine games cooldown.
Mind Games isn’t used as a passive dps ability though. In arenas its used for clutch moments when you’re trying to burst down another player so you need that upfront damage + healing = damage conversion.
Also, Holy just had Mind Blast deleted from its bars.