AV is officially dead

At least on my realm/battlegroup, 0 running AV games day or night anymore.

Good job, too little too late, in the way of very necessary changes to the toxic-play wasteland that was AV

Can document your total inaction over the months up as “How To Kill a Battleground”


Ofc. After they took away allies exploiting of the druids away.

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Yeah, what do you expect though.
If you had a battleground with a 99.9% guaranteed loss-rate, would you queue for it for anything other than rep?

The core problems with the pit that is AV still haven’t been addressed. This sorry excuse for a ‘patch’ fixes some things sure, but not what really counts.


Well gee. What’s the percentage of allies not playing the objectives of the map? Do ya think that might affect that loss rate?


Is that in already? I thought that the AV patch was going to be part of AQ war effort patch.

Exactly this.

It’s pretty commonly understood (I would hope) that AV has serious balance issues that drastically favour Horde at the beginning of the map. However, for the sake of argument, lets assume that the map is perfectly balanced and that Alliance are just bad.

Does it matter? Is the outcome not the same? I don’t care who you are, if you participate in an activity where 99% of the time you get absolutely smashed, are you going to keep participating in that activity? Proooooobably not… at least, not without some incentive to do so.

For Alliance, that incentive was the rep grind. Most folks would move on from AV and never return once they finished it, but at least it kept steady (if small) supply of Alliance queueing up for AV so the Horde could continue to slaughter them. That faucet has been closed off though, so what incentive do Alliance have to queue up now?

I don’t really have an answer, but without one, that’s it for AV. I hope Horde are starting to realize that there’s a balance in play here. I figure you’ve got two options…

  1. Pat yourselves on the back because you “Won AV”, and let it die; or,
  2. Get involved. Concern yourself with the fact that there are reasons why Alliance aren’t playing it and that this ultimately impacts your own ability to play AV.

Either way is up to you…


Good thing I got exalted yesterday.

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While there are a few map issues the real problem is Alliances pugs are entitled jokers. Most of them should be banned straight out for afking and leeching. NONE of the serious alliance PvPers are EVER going to step foot in a pug unless some seriously aggressive changes are put into play.


To be honest , I would like to see some sort of change in AV . Even if it means to make it so alliance are able to premade again into AV. This would be a positive thing . Not only we get to play AV again . We also benefit from reduction of premade groups into AB and WSG.


I thought it was but i could be wrong. Only reason im posting is because I had a moment of weakness and was going to play again but like an alcoholic that goes to a bar, orders a drink, but dumps it out. I subbed and didn’t even download it.
Canceled. Nothing’s changed. Blizz is Blizz in name only. The people who made that name are long gone.
All that matters is Bobby Gallywixx’s bonus.


Once we see horde queues reach 4+ hours, I’m pretty sure Blizzard is going to have to change something.

The most logical change at this point is to add 1) 3 seconds delay to horde gate opening which would give alliance a net 6 seconds of southward movement, and 2) making it so you can’t respawn in cave until you lose all your GYs on the field.

At some point, Blizzard will take action on those things, the question is how much AV has to die before they do…


Honestly it wont solve a thing. Either aggressively ban afks (which in the short term might mean no AV at all) put massive pressure on horde pvpers to switch alliance (free horde to alliance faction transfers above rank 8, faction specific server qs, bg q priority based on your servers faction balance) or revert the q changes (that never should’ve been made in the first place). Those really are the only options that have any chance of working.

At this point the reason the pugs aren’t qing is because nobody is there to carry them and the PvPers aren’t qing because they wont be caught dead enabling the extreme entitlement problem that we have on Alliance.


Who would have thought that instead of fixing actual issues with the map breaking the one reason alliance had to queue for it would result in alliance not queuing for it?


The problem you describe isn’t limited to Alliance. Entitled people exist everywhere, and people who AFK/leech exist on both sides. I do wonder why rep turn ins were addressed though while the AFK problem was not…

Maybe? I mean, it’s an arbitrary line you’re drawing here. There’s been enough noise on the forums that Blizzard is well aware of how players feel about it. It’s been 6 months? They’re choosing not to address the root problems and appear to be trying to work around it.

Those changes you propose seem reasonable. Moving the cave would also work, though perhaps would require more effort than what you said. I think the IBGY layout and bottleneck is still too strong but hey, it’s a start.

My worry is two-fold…

  1. It’s too little too late. What incentive does Alliance have to go back into AV? I love AV and have enjoyed countless games in it over the years, but I’ve been soured by Classic. I finished my rep grind and moved on. If they made changes, for nostalgia, I could be convinced to go back in and check them out, but it’s a very precarious line to walk and I fully acknowledge that I could easily be tilted towards not wanting to play it anymore.

  2. Blizzard isn’t understanding AV from the point of view of players who just want to enjoy the map. They seem so caught up in manipulating player behaviour to their ideals that they are forgetting that if they make something fun to do, people will do it. I don’t think there’s an easy answer to this, but it’s hard to have faith when all the actions taken so far are punitive.


What server are you playing on? There are no battlegroups. Everyone gets lumped together by region. AV might be a mess but NA servers have plenty of AV’s going 24/7.

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I see 12.


Blizz gets paid to favor horde with pvp changes because there are FAR more pvp focused players on horde.

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Frostmourne is an Oceanic retail server. I can buy there’s 0 AV’s going on there.

they are grouped with american servers its not dead

The real solution