Because he’s getting lucky occasionally. Noone has ever claimed allinace have a 0% win rate.
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Because it’s unlikely that things are as rosy as he’s saying. Even if they were, the sheer amount of additional effort alliance need to win compared to horde leaves a bad taste in our mouths.
Until there are changes you’re just not going to get people to bother with AV.
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I wonder just how much extra effort it is though. Let’s ask. Scotpollard. Besides getting the Alliance players to actually play, how much extra effort is your actual strategy compared to the strategy the Horde employ?
This too, the idea that alliance pugs should have to play as good as a premade to beat horde pugs who are just zug zugging is a sign the map is fundamentally broken.
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Zero substance here. You have no idea what strategy he pushes nor do you know what his actual success rate is with that strategy. Nor do you know how many games are lost because when he goes in the Alliance has already given up. You literally know nothing about his approach, but just assume he is lying.
It doesn’t matter what strategy he’s trying to push, he’s not getting to anywhere near decent win rates. Basically he’s occasionally getting wins despite his “strategy”, which he hasn’t explained, not because of it.
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A very significant amount. I’ve played many games where alliance was actually trying and we still went nowhere.
Horde get to key spots first and dig in for the farm until they summon their big guy. They have a huge defensive advantage early and can simply wear the alliance down.
Alliance have to have a tremendous offensive push to establish past midfield and it takes too much coordination for most pugs. When there were premades some could make it happen but since those were broken there’s not much chance of winning.
And, yes, some of this is because of people not trying. But then you have to ask why they aren’t trying and it comes down to queue times as well as how much effort you have to put in for the rewards. This is also something Blizzard should address.
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That’s exactly what Horde said against premades and it was pulling teeth to get them to do anything but Lts. + Balinda. Eventually they started actually pushing back against the premades with success against all but the best premades. But somehow asking the Alliance to actually work through the incremental progress he seems to be making is too much. Get outta here.
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Again, you have no idea how his games go. You have no idea what the player make up of those games is. You have no idea what strategy he is pushing. You have no idea how many of those games he has legitimate support Alliance side and they try to win vs the AFK and rep grinding crowd. If he is winning even 10% of his games while overcoming Alliance apathy, that is impressive. If he is keeping even 30-40% of games close while overcoming Alliance apathy, that is impressive. The second one is the one that starts to lead to more wins.
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Edit: And by success, I mean not losing in 10 minutes or less. I mean having an actual game. Obviously we were still losing most games against premades.
Alliance aren’t losing in 10 minutes or less, the games still take 30+ minutes.
And no he is not having success.
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Allow me to clarify. I meant “horde success against premades” which you would know had you bothered reading the next sentence.
And what truly shows how broken the map is is that even against alliance premades horde had a better win rate than alliance do right now.
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The macros are easy, and when to call them out. The hard part is getting the alliance to recall when we are ahead, and to D GY Flags and Tower flags that we take.
The strats from Horde to Alliance aren’t that much different.
The map is a 10% advantage that has lead to a 65% player defeatist attitude give or take.
Another hard part is fighting the loser meta of “All Defense” or “All Offense” at the start. Especially when there is a wannabe strat caller begging for this.
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Yeah, we trashed the leftover scraps that were in Alliance AV pugs. Not sure how this is all that hard to understand.
I just don’t agree with this. The games where the Alliance have beaten me, it wasn’t any tremendous push. It was a strategic push to SFGY while holding SHGY which the Alliance have a built in numbers advantage to hold due to GY location. I know, literally all of that has been said ad nauseam by every player on both sides and there are reasons why SFGY isn’t easy to take. I also get that Horde generally don’t have to defend IBGY which makes it easier to simply rush wherever. But I am just saying what I have seen. And what I have seen work is this:
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Strategy 1) Hold SHGY while sending a team to IBGY to take the GY then push SFGY while Horde are taking back IBGY. Cap and hold SFGY then proceed south.
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Strategy 2) Wait for Horde to cap SFGY so they are split. Send a group to SFGY to cap and hold while maintaining SHGY. Once it is yours, push to IBGY and overrun it.
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I know neither of those are as simple as “zug zug SHGY,” but it isn’t like either are complex either. I also know a ton of players on this board who have suggested either strategy. I have also seen all the negative posts about both of them. I am not suggesting they are foolproof. The BG itself doesn’t lend itself to any singular strategy always working.
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Edit: and don’t get me wrong. Starting point respawns should be changed and I think that has maybe the single biggest impact on the map with the smallest amount of effort to change on Blizzard’s part. Honestly, I wish Blizzard would just make this change already so there might be some chance at a semblance of sanity with Horde queue times and Alliance win rates.
Outside of general apathy, I am guessing this is the hardest part. Getting others on board with doing something that requires some kind of coordination.
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Would you put gas into a car that doesn’t start? Of course not. What a stupid thing to say.
“You should farm consumables on a battleground thats extremely imbalanced and lose anyway”. Idiotic.
Which is a hurdle that horde do not have to over come as they can simple zug zug to SHGY.
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By tremendous I don’t mean volume, I mean effort and complexity. It’s more than a simple defend and collect, it’s a very active and risky process of holding one point while assaulting another.
Is it possible? Sure. But the overall effort needed is considerable compared to the simple defensive strategy the horde can follow.
Except that the one guy on this thread who has stated he has some success Alliance side specifically said that the strategies used by Horde and Alliance aren’t that different. Honestly, I have never thought of them as that different either. There is more to it at the moment Alliance side, but a lot of that is due to the “Alliance only defend” meta. Horde used to have more to their strategy too. A fair amount more actually. But now there is no need because 9 out of 10 games, Alliance will park at SHGY.
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I would also point out that Horde’s strategy when Alliance do something other than defend is reactionary. We react to whatever you do. That puts the Alliance in the driver’s seat to perform actual strategies that beat Horde because for the most part Horde is on full zug zug SHGY auto pilot until there is a reason not to be. That is one of the biggest reasons strategy 1 in my earlier post tends to be successful. Horde zug zugging everywhere while Alliance pick and choose their objective.
So you admit to not knowing what you are talking about, have never been at the lok summon spot, and your evidence is laughably wrong?
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