Returning customer from years ago, I started playing Warrior in beta (2004), Dragonflight is very good. In 2 months I leveled and started doing Mythic dungeons up to the +23 range. Fury Warrior DPS is severely lacking, it is way behind other classes.
Warcraftlogs example: for +22 TOTT there is 1 fury war in the top 500. Let that sink in. Fury warrior is supposed to be a DPS specialist. It is so bad it feels like brown bias or something (person-in-charge/class-lead doesn’t like dps wars? lol). Even arms is way behind (2 in top 500 for that dungeon I mentioned above).
When fury warriors do good dps it is usually from perfect length fights that allow CDs twice (2min range) and single target (or just a few), or when they out gear everyone else. Sure I don’t have the legendary axe yet but that will only boost my damage by 5%, and the examples from WCL all have it of course.
Raid DPS is better but this is focused on M+
It feels like maybe warriors are being treated like hybrid classes because we tank? Or because of some utilities it is being kept low? I just don’t understand.
I play with a friend who plays a ret paladin with lego. We have similar ilvl. At the end of a dungeon, lego might do 20-30 mil extra. Even if I had lego, I’d still be down 15-20 mil overall damage. Now this is anecdotal, and I’d like to consider me and my friend similarly skilled (I think he’s a bit better than I am, but not 50 mil better overall…). It’s been consistent every dungeon we play. One dungeon I’d be at 220k, he’d be at 270k+. If i’m at 200k, he’d be at 250k+. I could pull 400-500k dps, everyone else will do 700-800k on the same pull. I’m doing enough to get by for 20’s but it’s not competitive against similarly geared AOE and single target pumpers.
Exactly, I picked a +22 example because that is what I’m currently doing and I wanted to compare it to other warriors doing the same. For +28 TTOT there are 4 fury and 1 arms in the top 500.
I haven’t played retail for over 10 years and I’ve only been doing M+ for 6 weeks so I’m a total noob, which is why I’m including stats from top players.
Blizzard DOES NOT CARE… As simple as that. I hope and pray that the group that was in charge of the Warriors was canned with Microsoft’s layoff, as they straight up stink.
A 22 is a dungeon where tanks can giga pull and go way past the target cap that Fury has. If you expect a target capped class to outperform an uncapped class when under ideal situations for the uncapped class, idk what to tell you.
Fury has issues, but that has to do with Warrior utility as a whole, not anything specific to Fury.
And that’s the key point with blizzard dumb design. Make all dps class/spec abilities uncapped, soft-capped, or hard-capped. Having some classes with uncapped abilities others with soft capped and others hard caped is idiotic
I don’t see how comments like this are relevant. Having played for 20 years doesn’t make you better than someone whose been playing for 5.
You’re just after some sort of weird “look at me” clout with comments like that.
It also doesn’t lend anything to the conversation beyond that. Your start date doesn’t mean anything in the context of season 3’s M+, unless you started during season 3.
1 person can hold 10 of those logs
Not all runs are logged
Spec representation plays a big part (100 Shamans have a better chance to show up more often in the top 20 than 10 warriors).
Meta heavily influences representation numbers (which Warriors are not)
We could keep going but i think you see where this is leading
My bad, I guess I didn’t communicate that well, I tried to convey that I’m a returning player from way back, not my experience or any kind of flex. I’ve only EVER done M+ in season 3, I never set foot in an M+ dungeon or even played the game while M+ was around until season 3. I haven’t played retail for over 15 years, I stopped playing wow retail at the end of WotLK, I was trying to say I am an old player returning after years away, which is a demographic that dragonflight has done a good job appealing to and seems to be interested in from business point of view. So yes, I did start during season 3.
What a troll reply. Obviously not all runs are logged, but logs are the only objective data we can look at…
And you literally validate the issue of warrior being under-tuned by pointing out they’re underrepresented in logs because they’re not meta. What do you think makes a DPS spec meta?
OP having played the class for 20 years shows that he has extensive knowledge of both WoW and Warrior. It doesn’t mean he’s the best warrior player in the world, but it does give credibility to his post showing that he isn’t a just novice complaining about damage meters.
What was your contribution to the conversation again?
Along with 33 other specs. Again, bad metric and bad confirmation bias to try to use. Representation deals a lot with a groups make up. There are no shortages of Fury Warriors in M+ in 20+ keys.
If we look at that 22 ToTT key range the OP is talking about, we can see that the majority of keys are done during Fort + Spiteful week. So ranged and uncapped target dps are going to excel (BM Hunters and DHs are shown up a lot in the top 500 for these reasons…which are/were part of the meta).
Not to mention that the number 1 log for the 22 ToTT is held up by an Aug / and PI boosting the DH
Not to mention it’s horrible being a melee during these weeks for obvious reasons.
Fury Warriors are about as middle of the pack as far M+ is concerned. If you want to discuss balancing, it should be based off that median. And if Fury Warriors are so bad, how come they’re 4th out of the 13 melee specs in keys 25+ ?
Their DPS isn’t weak.
#1 overall dps for DHT 25 = 350k dps (Hunter). #1 Warrior is 300k. Many other classes/specs coming well below that 300k (250-280k).
This is essentially the exact balance issue we’re talking about lol. You realize half the weeks of an M+ season are Fortified right?
Okay? Why bother noting this when probably the majority of top logs are the result of group synergy and external buffs? If anything that’s another indicator of warriors needing buffs as maybe they don’t gain as much out of these external buffs as other classes. Should we just look at target dummy DPS?
If you look at class balance purely in terms of DPS, you’d be right. But if you take it in full context, where group utility and CC are premium, then warrior is in a woeful state.
Class balance must take into account other factors besides DPS. There are currently several specs that provide MUCH more utility and CC than warriors while doing significantly more DPS. That is simply unbalanced.
Could blizz nerf the crap out of classes like DH, Mage, Rogue, Paladin, SPriest, etc. to bring them back into balance? Yeah, probably. But I think we’d all be playing a better game if classes like warrior (among others) were made to be stronger instead.
You are kinda making my point for me. There are downsides to being a melee dps specialist that are usually offset with very good dps when the stars align. Basically your argument is that fury war dps isn’t bad under ideal conditions, it’s mediocre. I concede, you are correct, I should have used “mediocre” in the title instead of bad, but I didn’t know how to spell it.
Also, if I didn’t make it totally clear, I’m a total noob, trying to learn to enjoy retail after 15 years away from end game content, and finding the lack luster dps in M+ as a sticking point in my enjoyment that Blizzard might want to address, since a large number of players seem to play it, myself included.
Because they used this dungeon and what not as a metric to base warriors DPS off of. When you’ve got a lot of groups set up like this, it’s going to skew the data (you can toggle external buffs on and off which changes things).
Nope, Fury Warriors love haste.
That’s what the thread is about.
No, under ideal situations, it’s fantastic. It’s fairly good at its base
Well you played in BFA, SL and now DF, wouldn’t call you a noob but people like to pretend they’re new so they can pretend to flex but that aside:
I compared your parses to other Fury warriors and you’re doing about middle of the pack to little less for damage for your ilvl (little lower based on ilvl) and key range. Which is why you feel the DPS is lackluster. Like your last Fall key logged you’re coming in at 31%
Whereas the top end are 250-275k damage for a 21 key. I’m not going to go in and break down the parse, but on average, you’ve got quite a bit of room to improve on your spec start there
start there