That’s because none of us are playing we are all waiting for Cata.
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Even though I do not plan on returning for Catacylsm, let’s look at this from a different perspective - Cataclysm more or less follows the exact same gearing format as Wrath. The proposed changes in this post would do the same in benefiting the PvP community and encouraging increased participation in both RBGs (which I wish they introduced in Wrath as it was a genuinely fun thing to play) as well as Arena.
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In TBC, there were BIS weapons from arena. In Wrath, there are not. I wouldn’t have played TBC arena at all if not for those weapons. And now, I haven’t done a single game of arena in Wrath.
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Cata is just so much better balanced for the classes and making all the gear available through conquest does what you want for Wrath anyway.
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Do I disagree with boosts? Certainly I do, its dishonest manipulation of the ladder.
BUT:
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Most people are also mature enough to recognize that you can’t control what other people do, and people will always find a way to cheat, in games, in life, you can’t just fall over and give up because someone used dishonest means to achieve the same or better results than you, otherwise you’ll just be crying 24/7 and never get anything done.
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The people who buy boosts know they are cheating the system, people who achieved their titles honestly know they worked hard for it. When you work hard for something and know you’ve earned it, you can take pride in what you’ve accomplished. When people cheat, deep down they know they didn’t earn what they have, they can lie to themselves all they want but at the end of the day, it will always feel hollow and they will always feel like imposters.
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The game is old, the people who still play are mainly here for the nostalgia, to hang out with old friends they made back in the day, and relive some of those good times we had back when life felt simpler. Blizzard doesn’t have an army of staff available to police all the potential different ways players can cheat, and why would they? From a business standpoint it doesn’t make a tremendous amount of sense to invest those kinds of resources in an old game.
Last, and most importantly
- You can always outplay. At the end of the day, you are still in control of what you do, as is the rest of the community, and if you queue into a boost you know at least one player on that team is going to be making rookie mistakes, capitalize on it, win, show them they don’t belong. And if they beat you? Maybe you’re not as good as you thought, or they aren’t as bad as you thought, that’s life.
So yes, for the reasons above, though I disagree with boosting as a practice, I really can’t be bothered to get upset about it.
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How about remove all gear ratings and having Title/Mount/Bragging rights. This will bring way more players in and won’t feel bad for people catching up. Ultimately skilled players will climb no matter what so this system they use that is 20 years outdated and even then had terrible esports, something has to change
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Pretty much what we’ve been asking. Rewards should always be cosmetic only, but an item or two as a carrot on a stick does a lot to encourage those who would otherwise never try it.
The 1800 weapons in TBC had a lot of PvErs dipping their toes into arena because the weapons, while not BIS, were relatively competitive and rather straight forward to get
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+1 in support of removing gear ratings or at the very least lowering them greatly. I say this as someone who had little-to-no issue getting fully geared out during S5 and this current season (I skipped most of 6 but my barrier when I played a little later in the season was arena point funds, not personal rating). I’m not looking for handouts or easier rating, I just want to see a ladder with healthy activity levels.
I’m not sure that this will help matters much at high ratings where people are already complaining about long queue times and fighting the same players repeatedly. Most people who will be playing at those heights are already playing- I’m sure there will be a few who get a taste for arena, practice hard, and develop the skills to climb high but I doubt it will be a ton of people. Despite this, I’d be happy to see more life and participation into any part of the ladder.
Some people have noted that you can climb with crappy gear if you develop the skill… this isn’t wrong, but imo it’s not healthy. It forces you to seriously outplay or develop a “script” that doesn’t apply well in games where both teams have proper gear. When you are new and playing with a gear disadvantage- or a significant gear advantage, for that matter- it hinders your ability to develop a good sense of actual arena fundamentals/strats. If your opponents are way more geared it changes how both sides play because you are pressured more easily and output less pressure in return. It becomes harder to capitalize on their mistakes, and yours are punished more in return.
When I play feral/priest with an undergeared priest I can feel the difference in game tempo when I’m fighting something like warr/pal. I have to spend way more time, energy, and globals keeping him alive instead of maximizing pressure. He has to spend way more mana and globals healing himself instead of assisting with offense. The warrior feels less pressure as a result and stays on the offensive more easily, the paladin doesn’t have to peek out as often to expose himself to CC, dispels, and burns. The enemy team burns fewer cooldowns while we have to trade ours more liberally to stay alive. Meanwhile when I play with a geared-out priest (and the enemy team is also geared) there is a back-and-forth dance between both teams making goes, exerting pressure, and going defensive- these games develop habits and strategies that are far more applicable at high level play where there are few gear disparities.
Heck, I played feral/rogue as my main comp S5. If we ran into undergeared teams, they melted with little chance to react. Just died. There’s not much to say about our opponents having skill issues when we’d stunlock, silence, and nuke an undergeared priest (or anyone not partnered with a paladin) through pain suppression while their partner sits a CC chain as soon as they’re in range. Opponents with proper gear would actually have time to live, get some peels, and outplay us.
I like the ability to customize what gear you are wearing in terms of mixing in PVE pieces, swapping around gems, selecting various trinkets… but the gameplay would be better and more competitive if some people weren’t stuck with strictly-worse versions of the same gear like you get with people running Deadly/Furious in Relentless season.
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Nailed it. I enjoy swapping PvE items in and out to min max things here and there as well.
I don’t think a lot of people understand how large of a gear gap between deadly and relentless is. Hell, even deadly to furious is insane.
If you’re in honor gear you need to play 3x better than the enemy team even if they’re only in furious. It’s a very large gap. It’s like trying to parse in togc wearing only naxx gear. You aren’t going to do terrible well.
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I agreed with adding Honor gear should only be 1 season behind and and they should remove the requirement for arena rating on the gear that being Said they should also enable CROSS ARENA LFG FINDER
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Cata gear system has no rating requirements and 2200 is cosmetic. It isnt like wotlk gearing. The previous season is available for honor as well. All of these changes being ask for are given in cata in an even better form.
You remember cata poorly or did not play. Cata pvp, especially s9, was the most balanced the game EVER was for pvp. Mop builds ontop of it as maybe the most fun pvp xpac with a complete class toolkit & streamlined gear system.
Unfortunately a lot of people buy into the “cata bad” mindset and almost all of the negativity surrounding the xpac has to do with the world revamp and LFR, NOT the gameplay or pvp. It’s actually one of the best xpacs for pvpers ever made.
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Cata gear system has no rating requirements and 2200 is cosmetic. It isnt like wotlk gearing. The previous season is available for honor as well. All of these changes being ask for are given in cata in an even better form.
Admittedly I forgot about the cosmetic set (as you guessed, I played very little after S9 as I was disappointed with the game and how much my class had changed and how talents were removed). IIRC there were still 2200 weapons but that is marginal in comparison to the rating based gear system (and catch- up system) that we currently have in place.
Consider my previous statement rescinded. I’d have to look into the Cata system further, but I feel if they adopted that model (or at least parts of it) and applied it to Wrath (or Wrath 2.0 if there is ever a re-run), people would be quite happy.
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100% should be a thing, no idea why they haven’t added it yet with xrealm queueing
I still maintain that, that is not how it was at all; but I’m not going to argue to that fact anymore, moving on.
Suddenly you’re fine with the welfare system in Cata but not Wrath? I’m guessing you’re going to apply a hypocritical #nochanges policy as to why you have that mindset…
Then I remembered another memory as to why you don’t have a problem with the casuals getting all the PvP gear without rating; in Cata…
To everyone else… All these ppl touting this line are trying to dupe you into playing Cata.
It’s all subjective but, you’re going to find the PvP worse in Cata; and I know why.
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That is how it worked. All conquest gear could be bought with any rating. Then at 2200 you unlocked the recolored version of that gear which was only a cosmetic change. And you also unlocked the 2200 weapon which was the only slot that was an actual stat improvement over the non-rating pieces.
Now this I completely agree. It works like that in Cata yes, but this isn’t Cata atm and it needs to be fixed in Wrath because Wrath’s arena scene is dead.
It’s not going to happen, for the reasons as to why they decided to make arena gear rating-less, in the future.
I think everyone is in agreement that furious should be for honor at the very least. Would help tremendously
The cata gear changes were done for a reason, removing all those rating reqs were a good thing.
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Even in full furious, it feels so bad to not be able to spend your points. Im not an excellent player, i usually cap out as high rival/low duelist. However, my rl buddy in classic is new to arena and frankly i dont see him improving much. So we basically get gloves, maybe legs and eventually chest once inflation kicks in. The same pieces we could get from vault of archavon if i cared enough. I dont mind rating requirements, but it shouldnt be every single item. The weapons / shoulder rating reqs only were BiS imo.
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Yup. Removing the rating reqs will encourage people to keep playing, otherwise they’d all quit after their two items which feels terrible.
It’s definitely a one two punch combo with removing reqs and changing furious for honor. Needs both done
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The hideous gearing requirements killed off pvp on DOA. The damage is already done, even they remove rating requirements