Alternative for night elf and forsaken fans

Vanforth-wyrmrest-accord · May 25, 2020, 1:52am

I can’t come up with a single way I would have preferred this war to have been kicked off, without entirely changing the circumstances.

My own pitch was that BFA should have been Death vs. Life, not Horde vs. Alliance.

Sylvanas leading a cross faction army in service to Helya/Death, and Anduin leading a cross faction army in service to Odyn/Life/Creation.

Blizzard has proven they can’t do the faction story war right, so they should have just avoided it.

Kaileena-the-scryers · May 25, 2020, 2:01am

This was a wasted expansion. The Legion is gone and this would have been an excellent time to world build and see what the races would do without the threat of the legion having over them, plus each faction had new leadership. But apparently the only way to explore the new leaders is with another war.

Gantrithor-myzrael · May 25, 2020, 2:02am

I mean, if Alliance are going to use the “stop a psychopath from enslaving an ally.” as justification for attacking the Horde leader during a truce it should show somewhere, right?

Gantrithor-myzrael · May 25, 2020, 2:02am

Agreed.

Deathisfinal-gnomeregan · May 25, 2020, 2:11am

Telitrois:

Rather than how things played out in war of thorns/BfA, would you guys have liked better if sylvanas had her full jailor powers at the start, then gets into a death match with malfurion. Malfurion puts up a hell of a fight, unleashing his full nature powers on sylvanas but it’s not enough.

So he calls on the nature spirits like he did vs archimonde, in an attempt to destroy sylvanas, and roots her down with emerald dream ethreal roots, which prevent sylvanas from ghosting out and flying away. But she uses her jailor chains to trap malfurion down, so malfurion is within range of the explosion too. Malfurion sacrifices himself to take out sylvanas, and they both die Martyrs for their respective causes. Malfurion for night elves, sylvanas for the horde.

The explosion is enough to force the horde to retreat back to ashenvale, and the battle in BfA is at the border of darkshore and ashenvale. (Along with kul’tiras, zandalar and everywhere else.

This way malfurion dies a hero, sylvanas dies a hero, teldrassil is not lost, and the horde and alliance fight to avenge malfurion/sylvanas.

I like this because it sounds like one hell of a fight scene. Now that I think about it, their current fight scene(per the short story) would also make for a great cinematic.

Aviala-wyrmrest-accord · May 25, 2020, 2:14am

Genn’s actions in Stormheim could have led to a nuanced faction war.

I as an Alliance player have a ton of arguments I could toss out to excuse and downplay Genn’s actions, and allegories to compare them to Horde actions to push the point that the Horde is still far worse even if Genn did do wrong (which is an admittance that the first line of arguments didn’t work, but this being a fight on the internet, I will loudly deny that I had to concede anything) - but, ultimately, it was a bad (if understandable) move on Genn’s part.

…But then Blizzard decided to turn Horde villainy up to 11 in the very first act of the faction war expansion.

So the Genn argument turns into this:

The Vulpera, faction perspective, and subtext

A lot of arguments like this seem to eventually fall into the same rut:

“Look at this terrible thing the Alliance did!”
What they probably mean: “The Alliance does bad things, too. It’s not just the Horde, and the Alliance isn’t perfectly squeaky clean. It’s not a black and white fight.”
What the other side often hears: “Look at this! The Alliance is clearly just as morally bad as the Horde!”
(and in some bad cases: “Maybe even worse! I’m sure the Alliance dead deserved it somehow!”)

So, what they counter with: “Well, the Horde has done worse than that!”
What they probably mean: “Okay, yes, the Alliance does bad things. But one side kicks a puppy while the other murders people - the factions are far from equal right now!”

What the other side often hears: “Anything the Alliance does is automatically excused by this thing the Horde did! Stop whining about your piddly losses, and how dare you besmirch the glorious perfect Alliance!” ( spontaneously turns into male human paladin with a Garithos moustache )

And then this cycle repeats until everyone is too angry to keep talking to each other because they feel the other side is dismissing or ignoring their real argument.

Cassima-greymane · May 25, 2020, 2:17am

Yeah, I would’ve preferred if Sargareas’ sword was knocked out of his hand and this whole expansion never happened. The aftermath of a demon invasion that almost ended your world is kind of the worst possible time to reignite old grudges and force your battle-weary troops back into battle, after all.

Zega-black-dragonflight · May 25, 2020, 2:22am

Not really a fan of this what if because

A) Forsaken lose their main character

B) Horde is down another notable character and only powerhouse

C) It all but guarantees that the Horde will still be seen as invading the Alliances land starting the war

D) Horde will most likely bow down to alliance for peace.

Idk bout any of you, but just because your squad leader dies doesn’t mean you should shortly after give up. (With Baine on horde side though it’s practically guaranteed)

Edit: meant To reply to OP sorry aviala

Kaileena-the-scryers · May 25, 2020, 2:43am

The short story and in game depiction because for whatever reason the story gave us almost nothing.

Pellex-hyjal · May 25, 2020, 3:10am

No Teldrassil is an automatic improvement over what we got, but I still am not crazy about this version.

How is Sylvanas in any way a hero?

Katiera-moon-guard · May 25, 2020, 3:14am

Why should a character that tortures innocents be rewarded, horde players need to face that sylvanas doesnt deserve to be redeemed, and hasnt since the end of vanilla

Gantrithor-myzrael · May 25, 2020, 3:55am

Neither did Kerrigan. Didn’t stop Blizzard.

Katiera-moon-guard · May 25, 2020, 3:57am

kerrigan was literally courrpted by space parasitic Sylvanas doesnt have that excuse and like the devs been saying even recently everything she has done is from her own free will.

Gantrithor-myzrael · May 25, 2020, 3:58am

Sylvanas literally had her soul shattered by Arthas.

Katiera-moon-guard · May 25, 2020, 3:59am

Still her free will
word of god> Your opinion

Gantrithor-myzrael · May 25, 2020, 4:00am

Same with Kerrigan.

Katiera-moon-guard · May 25, 2020, 4:01am

Nope

The Queen of Blades was not a separate entity within Kerrigan. However, the Queen could be considered Kerrigan under the influence of some devastating forces, such as zerg mutation- straight from blizzard devs

Gantrithor-myzrael · May 25, 2020, 4:08am

Nah, she had all her faculties in BW. Which is why she wanted to gain power over the Zerg while the new overmind was incubating. Also why she still had all her faculties when she regained her Queen of Blades status/abilities in Heart of the Swarm.

Katiera-moon-guard · May 25, 2020, 4:09am

Post proof what I posted literally comes from the devs lol
`https://starcraft.fandom.com/wiki/Sarah_Kerrigan#cite_note-QAKindregan1-41

Elathaah-stormrage · May 25, 2020, 4:12am

The thing around Sylvanas before BfA was that she wanted more Valkyr. I mean you can argue about spin that is all selfish vs. whether she wanted them so her people weren’t doomed to die out, but that was it.

This destruction of her future could have been what hardened her even more again the living and forced her to go down a path she had been holding back from. Still turns her into a villian, but at least there is some “moral greyness to it” and Genn has to share the blame for what his “revenge” cost.

But no, they decide to recon that as her plan all along and make the Horde evil while they are at it. Not the best plan, even for Blizz.