It’s… Disgusting?
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Hard CC and kill one at a time isn’t much strategy.
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Neither is using invis pots to skip whole areas, but here we are.
Maybe the endurance mobs would have smarter ai and act more like the island expedition npcs along with hitting harder.
Thst might be interesting.
Imagine ccing a mob and it busts a pvp trinket out if it, then runs off to go get help from another pack nearby.
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Also, the moment you start looking at the clock is the moment you start screwing up.
There might be a market for that, but it seems like a good number of players feel that the relatively “simple” trash and bosses in m+ are too hard. I’m trying to imagine what a heroic+ system would look like.
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Except in this case it doesn’t because if you ignore it then it does absolutely nothing, therefore it doesn’t really limit how you play.
Also side topic, weren’t covenant marketed as “rpg” purely because of how they limit how players play the game? Meaningful and all that?
Very true. The timer is the one “affix” that can be completely ignored without making the run any more difficult.
Must have mage for spammable CC? Resto Druid meta for emergency roots?
I don’t really have any objection to an untimed way to advance keys but all the ideas seem to boil down to kill one thing at a time and trash mobs that are all mini bosses. You also run into the issue of reaching a point where you can’t finish at all a lot faster and nobody gets anything for their time. At least with the timer system we have now, finishing over the timer is almost as rewarding as making it in time.
And I’m someone who almost never finished a key in time, so the untimed versions would only be a benefit to me, they just sound boring IMO.
How many? All people or 80%? I like to know the statistic on this, unless we are able to sample the two in one expansion to find if that’s indeed a fact supported with evidence than some anecdotes. If you reply without reliable evidence whether in the form of stats or blizzard stating from a post, I’m sorry I won’t hold your claim until true until proven otherwise 
Perhaps your right, perhaps we should try with one expac test this hypothesis because what’s the popularity/impression of mega dungeons like return to kara, mechagon, and soon to be 9.1 mega-dunny has on the community?
CC was rarely used in most Vanilla dungeons. It was TBC where CC was king.
I suspect you’re right about this changing in TBC classic but mobs having nasty abilities combined with kick on the gcd might bring back ccing.
It didn’t stop people from blasting through Mechagon or leaving groups that weren’t good at it. People think it’s the timer, but people quit leveling dungeons that are going to slowly. It’s just how people are now. It’s not about the journey now. It hasn’t been for years.
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Not to mention lust isn’t the only CD.
If you don’t have a 2 minute cooldown expect to never be invited past a certain level. Because those with 2 minute CDs won’t want to wait an extra minute every pack for yours to come up.
sad trombone playing goes here
How many people were demolishing in the first month or two the return to kara, mechagon, and at what point and percentage of players participation resulted in a completed dungeon run?
Do whatever it takes to complete the dungeon that’s the beauty as long as its not exploiting some bug, mechanic, etc.
QFT
Best example are leveling dungeons where the tank isn’t yolo pulling the entire instance and AoE’ing it down. If they’re too slow they’ll just kick him and get an instant replacement through LFG.
Basically, it’s a culture shift? Instant gratification as opposed to an arduous journey having a good time with people.
Let me add a little more nuances to it, did Blizzard reinforce this cultural shift because it prevalent in other games or in society?
I will say, as long as you have tools like LFG this will usually be the mentality instant access will labor the chance for people to be toxic, leave group, dps pull or tank pulling too much, you get the idea. The same crap will happen if they implement solo queue, it will bring conveniences but never address the underlying issue at the core.
This is the difference between networking with people at a social lounge vs. twitter troll threads.
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Funny story, my rogue was leveling in cata timewalking, and got put into stone core twice in a row. First time the tank yolo charges in, no cc, giant cascading wipefest, everybody leaves.
Second time I’m put into stonecore “hey, you need some CC and nterrupts for this dungeon” same cascading wipefest, except once everyone is out of combat they kick my rogue for… being right?
I dont think that group got very far.
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101% agree that we need a non-rush version of M+.
I’ve no problem with it personally but the “go go go don’t stop don’t talk” mentality of the current M+ gets drab.
That’s raids pretty much. You got unlimited time, you got some trash, and big bosses you need to go through.
M+ is supposed to be the quick option.
What you’re asking for is 5 man raids.
Well it’s just like Dapler said it’s not about the journey anymore. Literally everything in the game is built for short, easy access and if there’s an ounce of difficulty then players will be here on the forums ranting about how this is killing WoW. I theorize that there will be players on this forum complaining that the next mega dungeon is Mythic only and demand for there to be a queue added because players just can’t be bothered anymore.
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