Most of them were chased off or took off the mask a while back around the time of the Desolate Council’s formation in the game.
There weren’t any in my old guild thankfully, before it collapsed and was subsumed into your guild, Banshih. Glad to see the Nexus still stands.
All threads belong to Erevien now, its the new way.
None of us over here want peace.
Oh please they love to hate us.
I only want a tepid peace with the Worgen.
They just look like they should be on the same side. No more brother wars. Halloween Invicta.
Seriously though them fighting is kinda cool which is why I’d want BG or WPvP objectives around disputed territory like say Alterac City and Fenris Isle.
But otherwise them being in a state of perpetual war just doesn’t make much sense with both Garrosh and Sylvanas out of the picture.
Plus the Worgen frankly need Gilneas back. I think a big part of the reason they’ve been Bob Barkered is because they look so damn out’ve place in the always sunny and pristine Stormwind. And even the Kaldorei’s fae forests don’t do them any favors.
Meanwhile they look and feel cool af in places like the Plaguelands, Drustvar, Duskwood etc. They’re werewolves. Dark woods, foggy moores and cursed villages are kinda their whole thing. I’m hopeful it’d let them get back to their horror roots.
Forsaken VS Worgen is interesting but only because they nullify eachother’s spookiness. The Forsaken can’t raise the Worgen and I’m just imagining their ace-in-the-hole tactics like Blight and Abomination shock troops would be smelled by the Worgen before they even arrive on the battlefield.
Likewise all the full moon madness ferocity of the Worgen means nothing to the Forsaken. Disemboweling a Forsaken with razor sharp claws is just going to annoy them. And likewise tearing out their jugulars with dagger like teeth is only going to get you a gush of embaulming fluid, ichor of undeath and coagulated goop. They’d do more harm to themselves than their enemy with that maneuver.
So it forces them to fight eachother more or less conventionally which is interesting as a change of pace but isn’t what they should be doing most of the time. What’s the fun of a horror themed race if you can’t;
Oh, don’t mistake me for some sort of Erevien Warmonger, I can’t stand the all-or-nothing zero-sum brainslug that infects these forums during every Horde vs Alliance conflict expansion.
Honestly it’s a travesty how Blizzard neutered the Worgen in their own Heritage questline, and I’ve just recently returned because I had to see the Forsaken Heritage questline with my own two eye sockets. My faults with Calia could be seen as a mirror to the Gilneans’ plight: Blizzard wants to tone the conflict down after making it a near-existential crisis, so instead of empowering the races that were the most invested, they took them to the vet for a snip snip.
I absolutely want the Gilneans to become the part-time inhuman monsters they were always meant to be, and I want them to rebuild their kingdom and phase it so it’s cleaned up–relatively of course, as in leave all the soot and industrial revolution paper-waste drifting down the street venues, that’s aesthetic–so that their culture and story can prosper.
Preferably, I’d see the ideal situation to be an ongoing demarcation of a boundary line between Forsaken and Worgen territory, with future questing between the two factions being more of an Iron Curtain with both sides wanting to peek and see what the other side is doing without jeopardizing the “noble-but-tenuous” peace in current age.
Perhaps a questline such as tracking down a Gilnean citizen whose transformation has been rather disastrous as his Worgen-self runs freely beyond the DMZ in a primal animalistic fury and is caught as a half-naked human in Forsaken territory and imprisoned. Avoid the guard patrols and break him out before he transforms again, leaving false evidence he was a Scarlet to avoid a diplomatic incident. And so on and so forth.
On the subject of Calia, I simply don’t care for her “Anduinisms” which is to present herself–a fully grown woman who has experienced war, plague, death and now undeath–with that of the demure, soft-spoken, timidity of a naïve fourteen year old apprentice. If there was even a rare moment when she cuts the act and actually speaks with some urgency or even intelligence in her voice, maybe I’d be less harsh on her. You can call her intentions to return Gilneas to Greymane intelligent on a diplomatic scale, but I’ll throw down every gold piece I have betting you that if you had the dialog option to ask her how or why she made that decision, she’d reply with something along the lines of “It’s just the right thing to do!” with an extra helping of mother-knows-best tone.
She’s just surrogate Anduin for the Horde. The best use of her is exactly the idea you came up with a while back, Benedikt: Just hide behind her as a shield, because anyone who punches her looks like the villain of the situation.
I agree with all of this. I also hope that the Borderline between the Forsaken and the Worgen can be a little nebulous at times to make for some conflict points but not open warfare. For example, have line between their borders in the Hillsbrad Foothills be disputed with radicals on both sides sending forces with the Forsaken and the Blood Elves holding the North and the Worgen and the Stromgarde forces holding the South.
I’m hoping that Gilneas is returned to the Worgen, its a zero sum gain for the Horde and Forsaken. Its been a resource drain, and it was a territory the Forsaken never wanted but were ordered to take by Garrosh for questionable reasons at best.
Conflict breeds story. That said, the Forsaken are so pushed back to having lost so much in BfA thanks to Sylvanas that…they need to have clearly defined and controlled territory. We need some legit wins, and a space that is clearly owned and controlled by rotters.
The Council has a good number of cut throat rotters on it, who are the types to get that job done. Calia bring a political shield to the game that the Forsaken can weaponize to legitimize their claims on their own home land of Lordaeron that Sylvanas could never offer.
Calia is the rightful crown claimant of Lordaeron, her proper title would be something to the effect of Crown Princess Calia Menethil, until she took the throne. Such a legitimate title in the world of nobility, is a powerful tool to weaponize against the likes of Stormwind trying to send up pretenders to take the land.
Even if Calia had children, those children are in line after her. She is the hard stop on Alliance land claims of Lordaeron, this only benefits the Forsaken. I look at the Gilneas move she is doing as smart politics, to buy time, and slow the carnage in Silverpine to let the Forsaken recover and rebuild instead of wasting more resources and time on a fight they didn’t want, and can’t win.
Smart politics is a dance of give and take, not hamfisted screaming of “MINE!”.
Honestly I remember seeing some theory that Lilian Voss is her daughter, but something I’d kinda like more is if her daughter is still living and just feeling very conflicted and betrayed with her mom joining the Forsaken. Thinking of her mom as a traitor, until Calia puts her foot down and asserts her feelings outright that Lordaeron is for the Forsaken and her kid needs to get over her stuff.
It’s a possible avenue for some conflict outside of the Worgens, which has cooled, puts Humans in a bad light which a lot of people seem to want, and is a good temporary, but not faction breaking conflict imho.
I don’t remember anything about Voss being her daughter; though I could be mistaken. I do remember a lot of speculation that Taelia Fordragon was her daughter. And what you brought up is an interesting idea as it would lead to showing just where Calia’s loyalties lay.
As much as I’d dread it as a story beat, there’s a non-zero chance that Calia’s daughter is a worgen. After all, she and her mother were living in Southshore up until it got blighted and they were separated, and half of the town ended up fleeing into Silverpine.
Though it’d be amusing if her daughter lived and utterly loathed her for choosing to become undead. At least, then, she’d be forsaken by somebody.
It was a good bit of a reach, but it was a theory I entertained a little bit. Calia mentions listening to Lilian’s dad’s sermons and having the nobility of Lordaeron in their hands would be beneficial to the Scarlet Crusade’s goals.
A reach I agree but not an impossible one. Though, I don’t think that is the story direction Blizzard is planning.
Yeah agreed, it kinda takes the bite out of Lilian Voss and Calia’s relationship so far if it’s like “Oh! You’re mom and daughter now.”
Plus like, imho the game needs some more female characters who are friends that aren’t like, family.
I still want to know why people picked up the faction war MMORPG / franchise then decided faction war bad and demanded it needs to change.
Fighting is fun.
I want zombies vs werewolves again. Literally one of the funnest things this gave has ever given us aesthetically.
I think the major thing is people like when faction conflict is more low-stakes. Having an entire faction war narrative just be ‘oh how terrible you are for doing this thing we’re making you do’ is both depressing and angering.
Blizzard just takes themselves too seriously in the story department to really make a ‘fun’ war narrative.
its kinda like this, sword fighting with sticks was fun until someone got seriously hurt and then it no longer is fun
I was excited for bfa’s faction war, i and some friends would even say stuff like “blight the alliance, faction war now” but then teldrassil happens and you realise the horde can’t win anymore cause they have crossed the moral event horizon, You realise “oh we are going to lose our leader over this” and just like that all fun is drowned out of the scenario cause a line was crossed
Eh, half the faction war stuff becomes thinly veiled ways for people to go about their bigoted nonsense in a thinly veiled way. Not to mention Blizzard’s done the whole ‘Horde Warchief becomes a villain’ plot twice now, which mind I think is bad writing, but as a result now you have a lot of people desperate for more bad writing just for Alliance characters this time. If it kept to low stakes stuff, y’know fighting for resources or whatever, I wouldn’t have much of an issue with it and I hope that’s the case for it. Flare ups, but relative peace compared to another full on war.
As far as the faction war goes, did anyone think maybe its as simple as it got boring for most people?
I have been playing since 2007 and LOVED the faction conflict pretty much all the way up until the end of BfA where it just seemed to get stale. Not just that but the same scenarios were just played out over and over again with BfA having a lot of storytelling directly mimicking MoP. Then you got gameplay issues tied in with trying to write the story around it, on top of that A LOT of fighting on “whos right and whos wrong” which takes the fun out of it.
Leading me to my next point where people would just spaz out taking the faction war way too far. If faction conflict evolved to be something truly unique I would be all for it, take for example the race restrictions being dropped. Have the factions actually fight for a CLEARLY DEFINED ideology instead of some pseudo-race war or land grab. Not even to mention players who would prefer to have their character identify with neither Alliance or Horde.
At this point in lore while the war may be longer in history, we presently have more events of teaming up and I really cant see a realistic escalation of full on war again or even smaller battles. And honestly, I am fine with that, the faction war had its place and made for some great and…not so great… story-driven conflict that was entertaining while it lasted.