You seem fixated on impressing people as a goal. It shows how petty and foolish your grasp of the Story is. A childish understanding, where impressing others is your goal.
I am posting my opinion based on the lore, and the game.
You are whining that the Light might not be perfect.
No it didnt, it still had worlds of possibility.
We knew that The void lords worked to corrupt sargaras, and the two realms light and shadow still had an on going conflict over reality. They literally had all of the reality to work with, but instead they decided to go lol lets add more relams.
This goes back to that issues i have said before with wows cosmic lore, by showing us the cosmic realms, they removed the mystery of them and end up setting them in stone and removing the importance and mystique about them. The shadow lands is the example about this, by shwoing us were we go when we die, death has lost meaning in wow.
Because blizzard did not show us the void or the light in terms of their realms, it left it open to lots of possibilities. All we did was end the dark titans reign, we still had a legion of daemons that had taken over countless words.
No we didn’t?
Metzen Canon was that Nathrezim were one of the original demon races born of the Twisting Nether and they corrupted sargeras after he found them worshipping an old god on another world.
This isn’t a problem inherently
The problem was that they did so while throwing all pre-existing Shadowlands lore out the window.
I think we see things in too much of a dichotomy sometimes. There seems to be an idea here that the Light is either ONLY good, or ONLY evil. I think it’s a bit of both - there’s nuance to the Light, which I actually quite enjoy. I fully expect and hope that noble Paladins and Priests, genuinely good people who support the Light, will see the more extreme side of the Naaru and say “That’s not the Light I support.” But others will probably go along with whatever, as seen on AU Draenor. And I’m sure the Naaru will give us fascinating reasons to justify doing so (after all, how did Yrel flip so suddenly and easily?) It brings nuance to the Light - the naaru are flawed beings in and of themselves, there’s no WoW power that is all-benevolent and all-powerful, and I don’t actually think that’s a bad thing from a narrative perspective. Infallibility tends to be boring in a story.
I was initially skeptical but if it brings political strife back to the nations and peoples of Azeroth, then I’m all for a Light-crusade. Might be nice to see the Alliance have some internal strife for once… since it’s always been the Horde that’s struggled with consistent villain batting and civil wars.
So as long as we don’t go to some dumb cosmic Light realm… I’m a HUGE fan of the idea of a “Tyranny of the Light” expansion. The internal division and turmoil it would bring to the Alliance would be fascinating to witness, and maybe the Horde can be the good guys for a change.
As an Alliance fan, I think that is a better way to give the Alliance nuance than us retaliating for Teldrassil by attacking the Horde. Showing that the Alliance is susceptible to Light manipulation in a way mirror’s the Orcs drinking Fel blood.
Yeah and to clarify lest I sound like a big horde bias nerd, I’m an Alliance fan too. I’ve always loved both factions and I’ve frankly gotten sick of the trope where the Horde does evil things and the Alliance simply relaxed. From a Horde perspective, that overt evil isn’t what we were sold about the Horde from Warcraft 3 onwards, yet in WoW we keep being evil again and it’s exhausting. From an Alliance perspective it’s literally exhausting to never actually drive our own narrative because we keep reacting to a new Horde atrocity and never actually get any internal development. There’s such potential for that development within the Alliance and yet it’s never explored, which is frustrating.
I think it would be neat to have a raid in a Light Based Karabor. A light version of the Black Temple in Shadowmoon Valley.
Blizzard had shown an ability to alter old Zones for new content. BfA used both a MoP Zone and a Cata Zone for its final Raid Tier.
Shadowmoon Valley actually has a nice ring to it, as a show down between the cosmic forces that remain on the field. We have a ruined fel version in BC. It would be the perfect place to play out this “Chaos of the Lightbound” Expac the OP is clamoring for.
There is so much that they can still do with the Shadowmoon Clan. There are still a lot of mysteries to unlock with them and their connection to the Void. I agree with you I think they could expand upon this already existing lore and fill in more gaps. There’s still a lot of mysteries from Oshu’gun that the lore has only skimmed the surface of.
You are tilting at windmills, Don Quixote.
tbh, i liked the vision in thousand years of war with the light-crystalized worlds…in which the light inprisson all this kind of beings who are against the light…(self)Righteous Justice in an extremly way…it would fit the light.
I think Blizzard’s going the dichotomy route too. I think that Yrel’s “flip” would make sense if the narrative acknowledged it as a response to the Iron Horde… which it looks like, but Blizzard just swept that under the rug to make them look like mustache-twirling fanatics.
The Alliance having internal division and turmoil would make for an interesting story… but we didn’t need “Tyranny of the Light” for that from a narrative perspective. There was the more warlike members including Tyrande, Genn and now (sadly) Jaina, plus we have Turalyon who’s already talked about reclaiming old territory. Neither does “Tyranny of the Light” make sense for making the Horde the good guys, because there’s already Light worshippers among the Horde in the ranks of the Zandalari trolls and the Blood Elves (remember Lady Liadrin?).
This whole hostility to a cosmic force being all good or infallible sounds like Tall Poppy Syndrome. Some people don’t want to look up because it strains their necks. Instead they look straight ahead at the compromised heroes in front of them and say “That’ll do just fine”. As if to say “who they are is just fine and how dare anyone suggest they can improve themselves?”
Those warlike members of the Alliance are suddenly acting out of character without development, as if someone flipped a switch from “war” to “peace”. For all you RPG fans, this is railroading. Plus Turalyon is never mentioned as doing expansion it in the name of the Light, more the Alliance… but some people assume that because he’s a paladin saying these things, there “must” be a religious angle.
Morally grey has become boring from overuse these past few decades, and villain-batting or adding bad apples to a good group is a lazy way to introduce conflict in a story, just to “keep the ‘War’ in Warcraft”. Because who’s next if we get this Light expansion? They’re running out of villains and people to hit with the villain bat.
I also strongly suspect that there will be a comsic Light realm involved, given Blizzard’s track record.
I’m posting my opinions based on the lore and game and the reasons behind them.
You are trying to undermine my argument by any means possible - even if you have to strawman - and make puerile personal attacks against me.
The Light cannot be an example of Tall Poppy Syndrome. That’s very poor use of this comparison. It has not achieved anything nor does it fall outside of the sphere of criticism. It is inherently good, but the debate here is not if the Light itself is morally grey, because it’s not.
Light wielders are fallible just like any other mortal, that’s not just an opinion, It’s fact. Because Light wielders are fallible, they can be criticized.
I think you have to separate the power force of the Light in WoW from a religion using light derived from an omnipotent god. It just isn’t going to be an “objective” anything by comparison. True Light and Shadow in WoW appear to be something better described as animal instinct rather than sentient thought.
The power force is not going to have omnipotent vision and authority to order the cosmos like a god would. Which prevents it from having the wellspring for “objective” good and evil.
With WoW spinning around these fallible pantheons which are not single source origins of all creation, finding true benevolence would likely be a writing error.
They’re currently very likely to cycle us through beating up all the pantheons until we come to The Dreamer. And then Blizzard has a crisis on their hands; OMG WHAT NOW!?
WoW chasing the major character stories, and making players bow to the narrative, is a problem right now. They need to back their character story out and free players to be the center of their own stories.
This was an advantage of vanilla, it was loose enough that players filled in a ton, and that worked well.
Vitiating what our characters do for the next “and now the plot says…” moment, sucks.
None of the wars in WoW have actually allowed the Factions to be making their own decisions. It always spins into someone else pulling the strings.
And now that we’ve gone to the extreme of blowing up cities only to be patsies, where is there to go with a war? We all expect it’ll be a joke.
While I think Blizzard will just go too far in the other direction if they go this route, you have a valid point.
The Tall Poppy syndrome, as I clearly stated in my comment, isn’t referring to Light worshippers. They aren’t infallible. I was referring to certain people’s hostility to an all-good or all-powerful cosmic force, quote (bold for emphasis); “This whole hostility to a cosmic force being all good or infallible sounds like Tall Poppy Syndrome.”
I don’t think I understand who you are refering to when you say “The whole hostility to a cosmic force being all good or infaliable.” I have not seen anyone being hostile to the idea that any cosmic force is all good or infaliable. I haven’t seen anyone who is hostile to the Light or thinks it’s not all-good. Can I ask you where you got this idea?
Several fans in the comments section for this thread have opposed that sentiment (Cursewords, Zahirwrite and Sarestha to name a few), reducing concepts like “nuance” to buzzwords and dog whistles. Given that you said the following to me after one of my comments to Cursewords…
…I think you’re playing dumb with your latest comment.
We have literally already had south seas expansion it was called bfa. Also had ship stuff in garrisons. Nerubian crap we did with wrath and we’ve already had 3 or 4 cot raids and dungeons dealing with the timeline. Plus the war of the ancients story and books.
You know Don Quixote? It’s a story about courage and conviction in the face of ridicule.
That phrase, about tilting at windmills, is usually told to someone who’s fighting invisible enemies of his own making. I haven’t been in this forum long, but just by this thread I can see you think everyone is attacking you but they are not. Therefore, you are just like Don Quixote seeing Ogres instead of windmills.
I never said everyone was attacking me, I just named a few of the people who act they like they have Tall Poppy Syndromes towards a story concept (plus Cursewords clearly includes personal attacks in his comments here, which you can see if you actually read the comments).
I’m no Don Quixote, and you’re no Sancho Panza.
I meant no hostility, man. Life is too short, lighten up a little.