No, that was honest. Not sure what you didn’t get of that:
{
Perfect control → zerg weakest (your data result)
+
Human control → zerg strongest (recent tournaments)
}
=> Zerg easiest. (conclusion)
Hah I was actually of another opinion just before you posted that (and I read it). lol
You clearly gave evidence and clear solution of the topic to me, which I showed you.
Thanks.
Is this really the mentality of a zerg player?
That they’re skillful?
A-move is skillful? I guess it can be if it works.
Not to mention the ease of economic growth and damaging-dealing free units that exceed the 200 supply cap. Oh and no need for unit building structures.
EZ mode for sure.
Zerg is a cool race by concept and graphical design, so it is one of the first races new comers try out when they first play SC2. And because its one of the first races played, blizz rewards the noobs with ez winnings. Platinum league for zerg is thus actually bronze.
EZPZ
Actually, that’s a pretty good point. But it only proves that Zerg has the easiest micro/macro. Also proves Zerg has higher APM requirements, not just the tools to allow them to get that much higher.
great write up, lol lol
Thats a good point. My own thought is that zerg needs to make good ingame decisions for their economy, so they are not as easy as it looks. Hence I rated them 2nd positon originally.
Game knowledge can be acquired by playing other races. I mean, on a fresh account I got to d3 Zerg in one day in about 15 games because I memorized one opener (16/18/17) and played it in all match-ups.
Ah it’s so sad that this forum will never improve. Aren’t you all tired of whining year after year, spamming the same threads with thousands ? I’ve said this multiple times - how hard is a race is completely subjective. I love how people who are barely in gold are giving certain statements for balance and what is easy and hard. Quit whining and improve. If you haven’t reached highest leagues and others have done it, then the problem is in your TV, not in the balance.
You just triggered this whole forum
Whiners will try to tell you it’s easy but Zerg is more difficult now than it was in previous expansions. Having to play so defensively while getting harassed a million different ways is difficult for casual players. That’s why low level players choose Zerg the least.
Taking a 3rd for Zerg is almost as easy as it is for Terran or Zerg. Wow, how unfair.
AlphaStar has the hardest time with zerg, bar none, and it isn’t biased like humans are.
Like your interpretation of the results?
Ez mode. Answered. 20
Lets go by the AI that doesnt even understand marine splitting to determine the difficulty of races.
The only thing alphastar results prove is wich races alphastar has the most success with, end of story.
If you want the most objective oppinion on zerg then you could look at how many of each race are in different leagues and you find the leagues with most zerg representation is diamond (around 23% of all zergs are in diamond) while terran and protoss has most players around gold, these numbers have been consistent for a long time across alot of patches so it seems to be a trend that zerg players are higher mmr on average than the protoss and terran players wich could be an indication that the mechanics are just easier for the race.
Also you could compare army management where zerg is easier by far since alot of their units only require pre split followed by attack move commands and maybe some simple box dragging, compared to terran that has a mutch more demanding pre fight setup (sieging units in proper locations), army movement is harder (your units are generally slower and you generally have less vision over the map), defending is harder (you have to be ready for attacks unlike zerg that can usually get units back to defend and not take too mutch damage) and mid engagement micro is harder for terran (proper marine micro requires you to constantly watch for banelings and box drag accordingly kinda like a zerg but its alot more punishing if you do it wrong.
Protoss has more demanding army management since they require more spellcasters for longer and force fields can be very difficult to get right.
Sure lategame zerg gets more difficult but so does the other races and there is grounds to argue zerg army becomes equal in difficulty at this point but they still have an easier time in therms of vision and mis micro is usually less punishing than the other races in general.
Obviously zerg is a bit easier than races that have to manage all sorts of production structures. Zerg only has to make hatches and tech structures allowing for very easy macro and tech switches. Its also the most dominant race at the pro level which to me makes it clear that zerg is the easiest race to win tournaments with. Doesn’t take many jumps to get to that conclusion.
Doesn’t understand marine splitting, yet has 6k mmr in TvZ while only having 5.5k in ZvT. Clearly micro is not as important as terrans claim it is. On the merits of good macro alone, Alphastar achieves a far higher rank with terran. Clearly terran has stronger macro mechanics. Nerf the mule. It’s been a long time coming.
Depends on what level of play you’re talking about.
Average Ladder player? Yeah, Zerg has pretty much always been the “ez” race. Even in periods where their performance on the pro level was poor, Zerg have had a rather dominant position on ladder.
GM/pro players? Not always. Things fluctuate a lot more with balance changes, though Zerg has, on average, had the most representation on the pro scene as well as the best win rates. They’ve had few periods of “struggling” on the pro scene, and really those periods where Zerg was in a “weak” state they still tended to maintain decent representation and place highly in events.
The only metric that could really be used to claim Zerg was the “hardest” race at most of SC2’s history would be premier tournament/GSL 1st place finishes (as Tehbatz/Rabidrone has tried to do), or using “average” elo on the pro scene - where Zerg has the highest representation by a large margin while maintaining positive win rates more often than not, and the top end seems pretty reasonably balanced…
That’s probably because Zerg is the most “reactive” race, and there was an arbitrary APM cap that was consistent across all 3 races, and playing Zerg generates more APM at an equal level of skill, (It’s not more difficult, just has more button presses that happen to happen faster because of things like creep, selecting larva, and making lings/banes) which makes that APM cap hit the Zerg AI a bit harder.
Alpha star doesn’t seem to really understand much about unit counters, when to counter-attack, etc… It doesn’t have intuition like a human does. For human players, pretty much every reasonable metric of measuring the difficulty of learning to play a race shows the opposite.
Dont really know about that one. I mean even back then ppl started to poll which race is the hardest at what league. Ofc ppl said terran and especially protoss are easier in lower leagues but back then they all agreed that zerg is the easiest at higher leagues (which is very good shown in the race distribution amongst the leagues).
There are so many reasons why zerg is easier (and or more stable). You got no real build order hence no real build order loss. You dont have to memorize 30 builds and their timings and if you delay a building your timing is way off. On top of that you can be harrassed easily aswell so you have to strictly follow your builds while being under pressure. With zerg…actual harassment is near nonexistant because you got a queen and a spore in every base and because you see everything you can react a lot quicker than the other races.
You got the best vision very high mobility and actually few units that really have abilities that need micro. Also very important is that your army is very homogeneously. If your army is caught off guard its not that bad compared to the other races. Imagine catching high temps off guard or colossi disrupter sentries etc. They alone do nothing but only if you guard them and treat them well they can destroy armies. Many things apply to terran aswell. Set and forget banelings vs splitting and hit and run marines.
But despite my believe im actually very surprised that for example pvz is only at 45% 0.o
Is this where you amove terran bio armies to 5,5k because you clearly dont need to micro them?
Zerg: easy micro hard macro
Protoss: easy macro hard micro
Terran: medium macro medium micro
Used to be true. That is before stacking injects. Last time, missing an inject used to mean the difference betw 80 to 100 units. But with stacking injects and the abundance of Queens, this is no longer the case.
It’s funny how people use this as the reason for Zerg being easy in LOTV but it’s not even true. LOL. I guess Zerg is difficult after all??