Why 12 worker start broken the game?!

General Discussion
1

Game was never designed to 12 worker start! Each race is balanced differently and was designed to work on 6 worker start. However you can skip worker start at least to 9, if you do that right, but Blizzard can’t do basic math. Let me show you why:

Supplies provided per base:

In HOTS:

  • Terran had 11 supply
  • Protoss had 10
  • Zerg had 10

In LOTV:

  • Terran has 15
  • Protoss has 15
  • Zerg has 6

So in LOTV Protoss gets one more supply, than he had in HOTS! That’s already huge deal! Also did you know, that in HOTS, Protoss had to pause probe production to get pylon at 9 supply ?

Terran had 11 supply, because he is building with his worker!

Also Blizzard forget about one important thing. If you started with 6 workers, at the time you get to 12: workers would be already stacked! But in LOTV: workers start unstacked and than follow different routines, than they would, when starting at 6. Also that timing when protoss had to go build pylon at 9/10 and than go back doesn’t exist! Which pauses probe production and delay mining slightly! So 12 worker start if completely different game!!!

Also second thing: you would have certain amount of minerals at 12 workers, each race different amount! So to skip 6 worker, while not breaking the game: you would have to start also with minerals in bank!

Reason why more than 9 worker start is bad idea. Because you don’t start with production facilities like rax and supply depot. But in case of 6 worker start, rax would already started at 11 supply. Making 1st mule hit sooner, which means 2nd, 3rd, 4th mule hits also sooner! But in LOTV you start your rax at 15/16 supply! Meaning Protoss would has more probes, than he would have in HOTS, when first mule hits! Also in LOTV you start with one free chrono boost per nexus, which gives you perhaphs small early game advantage. Both LOTV and HOTS chrono boosts are same in terms of efficiency, at least until late game: because with LOTV chrono boost you get one for free. So if you wanted 12 worker start, you would have to start with depot and barracks.
Which also removes 2 proxy rax, or reapers, if you started with production facility building. SO MORE THAN 8-9 worker start is bad idea!!!

You can watch any pro game and compare HOTS TvP, with LOTV TvP and you can see difference! And yes some games protoss would have natural even massively later, in favor of MSC, but on medium to large sized maps, nexus hits at the same time!

So there you have it: mule hits much later in LOTV in comparison how many probes would Protoss have and when he gets his 2nd nexus., than in HOTS and this causes Terran is behind in economy significantly!

Also mule was nerfed from 240-270 to 225 only and also since less minerals per patches, (which was one of worst decisions in my opinion), you can break your mineral line:

  • if you mule wrong patch
  • or multiple times same patch

Also supply depot building time was nerfed from 18 to 21!

Also faster economy favors Zerg, because he can spend his bank from larvae, but other races have to establish production facilities first. In LOTV there is larger defenders advantage, which favors Zerg!

3 Likes
2

If the only explanation that the supply depot has an extra 3 seconds of production is the rax proxy, then add the 3 seconds to the rax and remove them from the supply depot. Many Terran players don’t even proxy rax but each of the supply depots that needs to be done throughout the game are 3 seconds from a worker who must collect or build and not waste time. As simple as thinking how many rax you need to build in a whole game and how many supply depot and comparing the quantities.

The mule’s last change was for him not to pick up the last ore and lose it on the way, but it keeps going, or they give him fewer seconds or add more than a second for him to finish delivering the last mineral.

1 Like
3

Lol no. 12 worker start made the game fun instead of having to sit through of 5 minutes of nothing every game or all-in 6 worker cheeses with 15 minute stalemates because of how slow bases mine out was a snorefest. WoL and HotS were the worst. LotV is heckin fun

4

Yeah it’s more fun, but Zerg can max out at 9 min 15 sec, which makes pvz even harder for Protoss now.

5

Oddly enough so can Protoss and Terran. What’s your point?

6

No they can’t, it takes around 10 min and 30 sec, but that will depend a lot on the matchup.

7

Oh I guess all the Terran and Protoss streamers I’ve watched maxing out at 9 minutes were using hacks. Amazing.

8

Man when did you maxed out at 9 min with Protoss in Pvz?

9

Rotti regularly maxes out during the 9 minute mark, same with Winter. Competent players usually max out between the 9-10 minute mark, depending on the BO of course.

10

Zerg maxes out always faster then p and t you noob

12

What is your main race?

13

I main Terran and Zerg. I don’t like front loaded production.

14

Show me how you max out with Terran at 9 min in ladder game.

15

With 6 rax, 2 factories, and a starport usually.

16

Yeah you are faster then Maru. In both tvp and tvz you have to trade some minerals so you have a chance to win

17

I mean I literally just watched Inno max out at the same time as Dark during GSL S2

And honestly it’s not a surprise that I max out faster than Maru in Diamond league for 2 reasons:

  1. Maru is a proxy Terran
  2. High level play has more consistent trading. I’d say a solid 70% of my games as Terran I watch my opponent walk into siege tank lines so I never really trade out my army supply.
18

Yes you are better than Maru.

And top 3 terrans like Inno maxed out at the same time as zerg only because, they are putting a lot pressure and trading more efficient than zerg

19

Your original claim:

A couple posts later:

Thank you for playing How To Disprove Your Own Argument, I’m sorry we don’t have consolation prizes but we appreciate your time

20

Didn’t I say around 10 min mark depending on the match up

21

You also said zerg literally always maxes out sooner.