Stetmanns Forces are

Co-op Missions Discussion
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Weak as all hell.

There is not a single map where the mecha Zerg don’t get the holy living scrap beat out of them.

His primary forces are zerglings with hardened shields and hydralisks with freaking rocket launchers! with the real spine being your hydras that’ll set you back 50 gas a pop (we’ll get into that later…) Rocket-lisks and Shield-lings, How can those be weak? Enter EGONERGY this frustrating resource puts every useful ability Stetmanns forces have on crutches.
YOU NEED to place those Stetalites over the entire freaking map If you want to keep that purple nonsense a-flowin because even though "Mecha units with Egonergy are more powerful than their standard Co-op counterparts, without it, they become depleted husks of their former glory."

Oh but wait there’s more! all of the really really cool stuff that the mecha swarm can do… needs to be freaking researched! So, until you get that research done then all you have is an army of very basic zerg and the gas costs are not great…

And speaking of gas and EGONERGY there is in fact one unit that is by far the coolest most off the walls bonkers amazing thing of all time, THE MECHA BATTLECARRIER LORD! This beautiful amalgamation of a carrier, battlecruiser and brood lord is every bit as cool as it sounds except with frigging locusepters and a godamned stetmato cannon! The problem here is that it has it’s own set of research projects and a really nasty 350 gas price tag (that you will very likely not have lying around by the time you can make them…) And EGONERGY completely cripples this glorious beast… You might be thinking “so what? do without the cannon” well you see the battlcarrier lord has to build it’s ammo using freaking EGONERGY and without it they can’t do a damn thing!
plus their pools take a solid chunk of down time to recover witch blows.

Now beyond all of that we have Ultralisks, now you might be thinking “weak ultralisks, yeah right bud” but No they actually managed it at 200 gas these things don’t last terribly long in most fights and take forever to regenerate afterwards, that said they do come with a pretty nifty burrow charge and can be upgraded with their own suite of expensive research without witch your Ultralisks are deffinetly going to die…

Oh also there’s lurkers and the corrupters and SUPER GARY don’t suck.

Last but not least we have the stetalites These stupid, tedious, time consuming things are absolutely critical to playing stetmann.
They buff you and your allies, increase both of your income and are the primary source of EGONERGY. These things need to be placed over every square inch you plan to fight over because if you dont, then you are going to incur some expensive losses.

Oh and for those of you that think how about dead of night?
I hope you like the sound of constant beeping because every time these things get shot down… you’ll know it.

Now maybe I’m just being over critical or just salty for no reason but tell me this, if stetmans forces were any good to begin with why were the given a fekking recycle function?! It’s almost as if somebody counted on these terrible units dying off en masse…

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Lot of issues you talked about here are solved when you lvl Stetman a bit. Egoenergy and hand in hand with it Satelite coverage is not problem after you unlock that ability that increases satelite production. And with that increased prodution you can keep up satelite coverage as you go unless you are really rushing.

Also I think you are looking at Egoenergy the wrong way. It is not something that you should have non-stop. You have charged units, get into fight and after fight is over, you need to recharge. Egoenergy offers too powerfull bonuses so it makes sense that it they balanced it by need to take a breath after each fight instead of allowing you to push non-stop

What I agree with though is Stetmans units. They are very meh. Especialy Mecha Battlecarrier Lord is disgustingly weak before you lvl to rank 14 and even then very finicky to use.
My problem with those units is that there are only 2 usable unit compositions and both are with their own problems.

First is obviously Mecha-infestors. Just spam those, then spam roaches and win.
Second is Zergling-Hydralisks. Works well against everything even if little fragile… but they are so boring. You basicaly build 3 buildings (outside of additional hatcheries and extractos) and you are set for entire mission. Pool into (after lair) Hydraden into one Evochamber. Not really exciting I have to say.

Everything else just does not work that well for Stetman. Going full air is impossible because you will not have gas to do that. Coruptors cost ton of gas. Mecha broodlords cost even more and because they are nothing really special, you need a lot of them. On top of that with only single spire allowed, you can not properly improve their stats because you are losing time on Great Spire mutation and on other upgrades… which also cost lot of gas… and all this while completely sacrificing any upgrades for zerglings because you do not have any gas to even give them basic speed upgrade. And do not get me started on ultralisks…

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I have, the mastery perks are fairly meh.

Respectfully, I disagree.
They are certainly above average with egonergy but without they are painfully below average as far a co-op units go.

other than that I agree with ya, particularly with regards to the gas costs.

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I really wish they give us a upgrade at hive tech that could convert the gas cost of a unit into minerals. Then we can maybe pick a composition based on higher tiered unit. right now it is just endless zerglings that lags the game.

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Yet another useless topic of over-dramatic bias with a perfectly powerful commander. Predictably will spark further pointless debate regarding Stetmann’s design and gameplay. After all fancy words is said and done, nothing can convey the message more clearly than “git gud”.

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People have been asking for 2 things for ages:

  • Make creep spread easier and less expensive (queens)
  • Make creep spread more worthwhile

As somebody who even spreads creep as Zagara and sees the benifit in that already I think it’s funny. We finally have a Zerg commander who checks both points and instantly people spring up finding fault.

So how many years has co-op been around? Because as far as I know, researching Upgrade Caches for your units has been a thing forever and for every commander. Was the only other commander you have ever played Zeratul by any chance?

Again, it’s funny because only a select few commanders get a research discount which enables them to fully upgrade more than a couple of their units in a single match… and Stetmann is one of them.

Now maybe I’m just being over critical or just salty for no reason

This kind of nailed it.

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Yeah, so I don’t understand this much at all. When I’ve been playing him (solo games, mostly) I’ve found his army to be just as much of a powerhouse as other commanders I play often. He seems similar to Fenix in that he has a strong army that takes losses, but does so ‘gracefully’. The key difference is his army relies more on good management, but I’m happy with that.

Mecha Zerglings are absolutely brilliant. Well-designed and extremely powerful. I think Zagara’s Swarmlings with mastery are still the best Zergling, but Mecha Zerglings aren’t far off. Mecha Hydralisks are ridiculously good AA (esp. for his second best AA) and a decent generalist with amazing damage against many objectives. Mecha Banelings are devastating. Mecha Lurkers are everything you could want in a Lurker and more. Mecha Corruptors are even better AA than Hydralisks somehow. Even a single Mecha Infestor is an amazing force multiplier: try just one with Super Gary and be amazed at how much you can do – you don’t need to mass them as summoners, they’re a core support unit. Mecha Ultralisks look great to me, though I think we need different Amon compositions unlocked to see them shine. And Battlecarriers, while a bit lacklustre, still do their job fine if you’re managing Stetzones/Overcharge well.

I do honestly suspect that the difference in perspectives lies with how comfortable different players are with a) managing Stetzones, b) using Overcharge and E-Gorb off cooldown and c) choosing appropriate unit compositions.

On c), one thing I keep hearing is that people are using Zergling/Hydralisk as their go-to composition for everything, and then A-moving. You can do that, but the cost of a low tier generalist army is you suffer attrition and don’t hard counter anything. And I can well believe that players doing that, not Overcharging and not managing Stetzones well (like staying in blue constantly), are going to be very disappointed. I don’t want to assume this of the OP though.

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You make it as if Egonergy is a crippling necessity for these two units. Purple zones recharge Egonergy at 5 per second which is very fast so Hydras only need 20 seconds at the most to be fully charged. Once charged, you flip to green or blue, depending on what you need.

When attacking with Hydras and Lings, Stetellites should be overcharged and Stetzones either green or blue, preferably green given they are little squishy.

This applies to all but Zeratul and it’s been a thing since co-op started.

One way around having to make do with basic Zerg units is to rush Super Gary early. Have you tried that tactic?

Two questions:

How often, if at all, do you activate Super Gary’s own Stetzone? Using that to place Stetellites helps a lot.

How often, if at all, do you overcharge those Stetellites?

If you’re attacking enemy forces with mostly Hydras and Lings with no overcharges and mostly in the purple zones, it’s little wonder you are incurring expensive losses - you are attacking enemy forces with a self-inflicted handicap.

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They are certainly above average with egonergy but without they are painfully below average as far a co-op units go.

other than that I agree with ya, particularly with regards to the gas costs.
[\n]
I’m so glad that someone finally find out the main core problem of Stetmann. Totally agree and that’s what I am thinking exactly. Too weak compare with the other commander’s units, his units without EGONERGY is even WORSE than LADDER UNITS.

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Objectively incorrect.

His lings, lurkers, hydras, and banes are equal to ladder units without egonergy.

His corruptors are significantly better EVEN without egonergy.

His ultras and BLs are bad without egonergy, but they seem mediocre with it too.

And infestors are caster units, same in ladder.

Actually 10 per second, effect halved on allies. Plus you can get mastery for it. Yup.

Anyways, his corruptors are the best anti-air in co-op and his hydra/ling/bane is easily as effective as say marine spam raynor. Without supporting units (not just medics) even 6 orbital raynor is mediocre compared to other commanders.

And the ling hardened shield (which takes very little egonergy) works while the HUGS Barrier is up. So that makes them virtually impossible even for hybrid behemoths to kill, so that should be your bread and butter for you basically army, with lurkers and corruptors being your power units as time goes on.

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The problem isn’t necessarily Stetmann’s units - it’s that some players don’t appear to be utilizing Stetmann to his potential. If you don’t have the right setups and/or are using poor tactics, the result is a bad looking Stetmann.

HP regen is 10.

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+100% attack speed on zergling
Damage reduction on zergling
2* Antiair damage on Hydralisk
Lurkers burrowing over rather large distance allowing you to burrow outside of range of enemy and then move along with zerglings when assaulting them
…
and so on.

These are extremely powerfull abilities.
Of course Stetman has some abilities that really dissapoint me, like having Mecha battlecarrier lord who has no attack and to be able to do something he has to use ability to create ammo. Or corruptors antiair aoe ability or Ultralisk Burrowing charge (ie something that other commanders have just on cooldown, not for energy and on autocast on top of that)

Argh now that I wrote about Mecha BattleCarrier Lord I am getting annoyed again. This unit sounds so cool. Like that it could be so much more. Something new, amazing and unique… and all we get is reskined broodlord who has locust but pays for that by having to craft his own basic ammo from the same pool of energy he uses to possibly shoot cannon.

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I’m still learning Stetmann, but:

He’s a Zerg. Race of the “disposable” army, if I’m remembering right. That’s one of the reasons he gets 6 larvae hatches that spawn the 6 in about the same time most others spawn 3. Some of his “macro” was moved away from Queen larvae injecting to… other things, like, oh, stetzones and stettelite drops.

Was I hoping for a Zerg race that would maybe be “less disposable”, so it plays more like a Terran / Protoss (watch your units and minimize losses)? Maybe. Then again, while they still have Egonergy, there’s a high possibility that this desire is actually implemented - 'ling shields, etc. But, when you combine even “near zerg” production rates with even Terran strength levels, you get borderline OP-ness, which is why the Egonergy mechanic - you’re strong “in bursts”, then need to shift over to regeneration to prepare for the next push/attack.

If I’m gonna file an (albeit early) complaint about Stetmann, it’ll be his APM requirements - for being one of the, if not the most macro-intensive commander (hatch management, zone management, controlling Gary, upgrade activation, stettelite drops, etc.), he gets what feels like zero “micro” help (still need to cast even “basic” combat powers like infestor roach summons, etc.)

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BCL has more than double the dps of battlecrusiers under purple overcharge, the problem of them is probably the upgrade costs but I believe they are actually pretty well balanced as an end game unit, only 3 of them is already unstoppable for any ground wave amon possess when they are under stetzone. You can actually support them with spores instead of overseer for detection and AA as they only cost minerals, can be rooted anywhere, survive one yamato and slaughter light air units. immune to liberators in siege once in position. Bring some drones for repair or build more.

They are nothing compared to mecha infestor though because they can’t shoot up, but corrupters are overpowered enough to protect them in that respect.

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You just made me realize that I should be building armies of drones to support my combat units. They can give all units repairs, and you can mineral dump them into static defense to serve as tanks outside Stetzones.

I’ve been using some Infestors to basically be plugged into to my BattleCarrirer Lords non-stop, and it seems like a huge help to me. The neural gives great buffs to a beefy ability-based unit.

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The first game I played stetmann was on hard cradle of death and I opened with 3 spine crawlers to support gary and siege the natural (first objective), because at level 1 you have no overcharge nor power regen it make no sense to get zerglings to just bleed minerals, I actually think this opening is obvious and later they are decent for defending the ramps with gary. The game was great I made the objectives decently, defended the attack waves with spores spines and a few hydras, took the time to clear optional quests too even with the severe handicap.

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You might want to check out Abathur if you haven’t already because that’s basically him. Take care of your units, feed them biomass and by the end you’ll have an army of units with 500 to 1000HP each plus more heal than Amon can overpower even during mutations.

Nah his macro is still a simplified version of Kerrigan who has to manage queens for larva injects and creep spread on top of everything Stetmann does.

I so want to test his broodlords more but with the current AI comp bug there is zero chance to use them properly ever. Fix asap please D:

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the only complaint I have is that his ultras are worse than Kerrigan’s, but his infestors are so blatantly overpowered that it doesn’t even matter

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Have you tried BCL on DoN or Miner Evac? Add corruptors on ME for banshees and early catching the waves and mass lings on DoN for the day. A few corruptors on DoN are also good for sniping Spotters and Nydus.

Edit: Not as good as Infestors, but does the job with less micro.

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Don’t think Stetmann’s forces are weak as hell but he can use some tweaks. This is my Wishlist.

  1. reduce cost/time to get super Gary
  2. rework infestors and broodlors. Broodlors are just way to expensive and don’t work with no energy. Infestors simply work way to well atm and this type of gameplay when massed is extremely annoying for an ally because of the pathing and lag issues. On top of that both units require 1 field only and that is purple, makes no sence to me an removes a big part of the synergie he offers.
  3. Remove the statelite cooldown mastery and make this default at lvl 15. Put a new mastery in slot that boosts the range of the stet fields. When I push and overcharge the statelites I often have a big part of the army (lings/ultra’s) outside the overcharged field. That is very bad in general with Stetmann because his biggest strength are the multiple overcharges that stack!
  4. Change the reduce cost mastery and let it apply to all upgrades not only attack and armor.

Overall pretty cool commander. Was skeptical at first but after a good amount of solo missions I begin to like him much more. I can understand why people think he is bad. Overcharging and stacking the effects make a night and day difference when pushing with him. Pretty sure many people have no idea how this works resulting in wiping a lot of units.

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