Not even a patch.
How are people talking about this…
sees that these people literally think the ghost is a viable unit
oh that’s why.
1 Like
Protoss is the easiest race in the game and Zest won the GSL tournament before IEM
True. Protoss is still by far the easiest, most abusive race.
3 Likes
They were originally conceived to be anti-casters, yes. But with the advent of LotV, their design was specifically changed to deal with units like the ultra and the broodlord. This was back when the ultra had 8 armour and marauders had the split attack, which meant bio-terrans had literally no good way of dealing with the ultralisk. Snipe specifically was redesigned for it into steady-targeting, partially because snipe was quite literally a useless ability, and partially for the previously mentioned reason.
Units got redesigned during LotV’s lifespan. The swarm-host was another unit that got redesigned. The Raven also got a redesign too. The disruptor underwent several completely different iterations before they settled on its current one.
Vipers don’t care if they get EMP’d or Feedback. HTs become a powerful massive unit. Ghosts get an auto attack that’s frankly quite rubbish for its mineral/gas cost. Without one (and logically speaking not having one doesn’t make sense), the ghost is quite literally dead-weight - which before you say “but so is the infestor” Zerg has the ability to reproduce units at a rapid rate, and the best vision+mobility in the game with creep. If the terran takes a fight and has no energy, without an auto attack it’s worse than useless. With an auto-attack it’s still manages to be worse than pretty much every other bio unit other than a reaper. And it’s a very standard range AA, considering marauders, stalkers and hydras all have 6 range, and many, many units outrange its standard AA.
1 Like
Very happy there is actually a patch. Even if it’s not really a big patch, it’s kind of the rebirth of SC2 !
1 Like
The Ghost is a dead unit, just like the Raven. It has no utility, other than GM gameplay far beyond the 10 min mark. It is ridicolously overpriced at 125 Gas, has a pathetic attack, basically no HP and the worst is, it has no means of retreat, other than a medvac. 2! Ghosts cost the same amount of Gas as a CARRIER! A CARRIER!!! A CARRIER!! Do you understand ?? I am baffled how anybody can consider the ghost relevant, it must be bait, right? This unit needs to be reworked ASAP. Reduce the price, DOUBLE the damage, INSTANT SNIPES + give it some form of retreat option like EVERY protoss unit has (ShadowStride,Blink,Recall etc.) Even after that buff, it would still be worse than HT or Viper, but at least useable.
beautiful double moral.
Otherwise you always write that races work differently.
What you do is list the advantages or the necessities that the race has. Which race has a short range and has to engage the enemy to defend?
Just guesses but Harstem, Wardi, Zombie Grub, Soul aka Spirit, Rotterdam, Clem, Pig for sure. Still not highest level from casters but im sure they did. Hopefully not clueless like feardragon. And i doubt Serral or reynor would vote for these changes
Its sad that no Korean representative is in the Community Balance Council. Hopefully an English speaking Korean like Solar can put some input.
Good balance patch.
1 Like
One thing I like to add with the Infestor… yes, it becomes dead weight after it uses all of its energy (or gets EMP’d), but they can kind of defend themselves by burrow-moving away (requiring a Detector or an area attack to deal with). Meanwhile, the airborne casters, namely the Raven and Viper, have freedom of the skies to get away. Though the Ghost’s attack is pretty weak ultimately, the range does at least allow them to stay with the Marauders. I suppose that’s partly why High Templars got Psi Blast, since they are slow and defenceless if the player carelessly makes them march forward… the attack allows them to instead stay behind Zealots and Archons.
1 Like
Ghost is probably the best unit in the entire game…there isn’t a professional player alive that doesn’t recognize that. Admittedly, it’s not very good if you lack the ability to control more than just MMM.
4 Likes
Oh it definitely is. I’m not denying that. I’m just saying that to use ghosts on top of everything else is already hard enough. That doesn’t make it weak, it just means it scales with control.
It definitely doesn’t need a nerf though - at most if you were to nerf it, you’d look at reverting the EMP radius change.
Frankly removing its auto attack would be… well, stupid. Its a gun. And if you remove the AA… now that gun doesn’t shoot. What, did it bring blanks onto the battlefield against zerg or toss? Stupid and illogical, not that its AA does much with its slow rate of fire and high unit cost.
This thread is over unfortunately. Guess it takes about a day for the Terran trolls to come out of hiding after ~2 years of silence to start screeching pure nonsense again.
1 Like
Yeah the EMP range is the thing I see as OP about Ghost. It really does big damage to Protoss.
Snipe can be mitigated and I think is absolutely necessary for TvZ balance
3 Likes
The EMP’s energy drain i dont mind, Terrans should have a decent tool to counter storm, because storm is very powerfull, and cant be dodged as “easily” as disruptors.But the shield drain is atrocious with the upgrade radius. From start, Protoss gateway units are much weaker then bio. After your whole army got shield stripped by 3-4 emp, it crumbles like paper. Also thats why every Protoss clinges to disruptors in late game: without them the bio can just steamroll protoss units after they strip their shields. Including collosus , with enough marauders or vikings.
EMP and Widow Mines are why I switched to Terran. ngl. They’re just…really good once you get the hang of their control.
1 Like
A balance patch ! It’s Xmas, guys !
When some of us thought the possibility of the least balance tweak was long bygone. THANKS ! 
Now :
-
The Queen’s nerf is by far the heaviest one here, as it restricts zerg’s spellcast healing to defensive territory, spore forests and nydus’ surroundings . It would significantly reduce the power of RR ± corrus + queens pushes that were one of the responses the skytoss meta induced in PvZ. I’m a terran, and despite that I think that nerf might be too strong.
-
The Lurker’s nerf however is welcome, as it mirrors the widow mine’s one. However, the widow’ mine does most of its damage at the first shot, while the lurker continues DPSing over time. IMO it is the Lurker’s raw displacement speed that makes it overpowered compared to other siege units.
-
The Voidrays nerfs are MOST welcome, since their last buffs lead to glaring imbalances both in PvT (VR + batteries proxies) and PvZ, to the point if shifted and reduced the meta in that last MU. However, it is the voidray’s base speed buff that made them able to escape even the on-creep queens’ range, it is their speed that now prevents vikings from escaping (and even cyclone’s considering the leeway), and makes them easily able to whittle down pre-stim marines. So I would’ve traded the cost nerf for an intermediate speed between their current and their previous one for my part.
Globally, voidrays, lurkers, mines, DTs, batteries, queens are all elements members of the community pointed out as not too fun to play against. So IMO, overall this patch would definitely be a step in the good direction ; even if it could still be refined. Which is why the the PTR attribute is there for I guess. 
3 Likes
Why would it be stupid to take aa from ghost?
ghost are caster, caster have no attack.
You say even the dmg of ghost aa has no influence then you can remove it without negative effect. That’s why there are ptr servers for test…
And if you want to bring logic into the game. 1 Ghost need the gun for “Steady Targeting”, everything ok 2. Ultra are big/ strong juggernaut… but are blocked by hydra… nice logic.
When is the versus Test mode available?
Which, as it turns out, is something else I disagree with. Ultras should have push priority for the zerg army. They should be able to push out other zerg units to get to the front and do damage.
1 Like