If you aren’t officially implementing this kind of content in your RTS in 2024 I feel like you are dooming your game out of the gate.
Ultimate Mode mod:
https://sc2arcade.com/map/1/351915/
As hilarious as this is (Python the pylon lmao), Races aren’t content; that could potentially swing games towards pay-to-win which you want to avoid, and frankly adding more and more and more races would make an already difficult to balance game nigh-impossible. Some matchups would just be brokenly favoured for one race over another.
Nah, best way to go with FTP - particularly for a PvP game - is always going to be cosmetics. Skins/skin-lines, announcer packs, HUD/Console visual changes etc.
Outside of PvP you can definitely do what sc2 did with the Co-op commanders being purchasable though, for PvE.
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Balance is overrated.
I’d rather have a lot of fun options.
Also, with so many factions it would be more difficult for players to spreadsheet to death the “I win” formula for every game.
Here’s what I would do:
Quick play would be any matchup.
Ranked ladder could swap out 4 different factions from the ever growing pool each season. This would require players to diversify their skill sets, and maybe even choosing a faction they are unfamiliar with each season. Disincentiving players from spending 16 hours a day, seven days a week, mastering a single f@cation to absurd levels of play.
That kind of “pro” game mastery pretty much killed esports, where normal people could never hope to achieve what they watch pro players achieve.
Man this is about as out of touch as you can possibly get.
People want to see that mastery. People want to see that skill. That’s why things like the olympics exist. It’s why Esports exists in the first place across multiple genres.
Generally disagree - at least to an extent. I agree that going to far with it can be problematic; removing strategical depth and diversity is bad. But all races should have a fair chance to win, otherwise players are going to leave in droves. We’ve seen it multiple times before. 2013 we saw a mass exodus of terran players because the race was genuinely unplayable in both TvZ and TvP. You would literally never find Terrans on the ladder for almost a year.
Broodlord Winfestor was another era that saw a mass exodus of players as well.
Balance is important, but so is fun.
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Do they?
Do people even watch SC2 tournaments anymore?
Does anyone even play SC2 at this point except for a few die hards?
I think so long as players are having fun balance rarely is an issue except for players who are a bit too serious for their own good.
In fact, I’d say that the level of hardcore balance in SC2 for the pro scene is specifically what killed the game.
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This is besides the fact that the mod seems to have a dedicated and growing following.
yes, the fact you got to ask something so silly shows how out of touch you are with the game, and that you dont have a clue about what your talking about.
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You missed the key words; die hard.
Even many of the streamers don’t want or like playing the current game.
I used to watch hours of SC2 every day. I barely if ever watch it now.
It’s been half a decade if not more since SC2 was a popular esport.
I’m sorry to be the bearer of bad news.
I’m saying this to you as a die hard fan myself but the writing has been on the wall for a while now.
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its not die hards that play this game. go play teams youll seen a new guy almost every other game. more people now are picking up sc2 just cause its on game pass. the player base, alone with out new people is outstanding and add them to the mix. yes your out of touch and have no idea what your even talkng about.
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I’ve played SC2 for 15 years. I’m pretty confident my statements are on the mark.
The current formula for RTS games isn’t popular and the current studios aren’t bringing anything to the table that sweetens the deal.
Why play the same boring ladder when we can play new factions that provides new and innovative ways to play the game?
First- do the Arcade and mods not have enough content to scratch the diversity itch you’re looking for? There are lots of fun games there that aren’t necessarily balanced, but still fun for people since they don’t affect ladder rankings.
Second- It seems you are portraying balance and fun as contradictory concepts.
Maybe instead of “balanced,” it would be helpful to use the term “fair.” If people believe they are losing games (especially ranked games) because of unfairness, they typically aren’t having fun.
Balance is what makes the game fair. That is why balance and fun go hand-in-hand.
Now, balance in a game like SC2 is far more complicated than what meets the eye, and it’s debatable whether certain types of balance are good or not. For example, if in a matchup one race is superior in the midgame, but another race is superior in the lategame, that may lead to cases on both sides where wins and losses feel unfair depending on the stage of the game, even if the winrates are technically fair.
Another example is cheese. Cheese is balanced by the fact that scouting and knowing how to react correctly typically allows an easy defense, but not scouting and reacting correctly often allows an easy win for the cheesing player (and of course at higher levels there are more micro-decisions involved on both sides that often go under-appreciated, but I’m mostly talking about the general ladder). However, even though this is fair by technicality, and the option of cheesing is a tool that stops game openings from just being the same every time, it can still lead to game outcomes that feel unfair.
Another one- mechanical balance vs strategic balance. If one race can do a lot with a single composition with enough mechanical skill, but another race’s strengths are focused more on choosing the right composition and ratios of various units, then players playing the first race may feel like they have to expend more effort for wins, while players of the second race may feel like with just one wrong decision they can lose outright. Again, technically fair, but it can feel unfair.
Of course there are nuances and not everything is an extreme. All races require some kind of mechanical skill as well as decision-making skill, and they each have tools for each stage of the game. Generally, though, when people feel like the game is unfair, it’s often blamed on balance when in actuality it’s more due to the interaction of different kinds of balance to make a net balanced winrate, for better or worse.
All that to say- fun and the feeling of fairness for ranked games go hand-in-hand. Balance is not the only factor in that, but if you just disregard it entirely then ranked games are not going to be fun for every race - which is important, because players spend a lot of time learning matchups and mastering their race. That’s a big part of the game, so if a race falls into obscurity, suddenly all of the time and effort spent learning that race and its matchups will feel like a waste.
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