Same also goes for tactical jump.
Starcraft 2 is an rts game an the devs clearly forgot that when they added recall, recall imo is one of the worst things they have added to the game. It serves 2 purposes, to get units to retreat when they are about to loose a bunch of units(this is ok i guess), and to recall units when there is a drop and you didnt leave anything behind because the prottoss is using the select all army hot key.
I have no idea what blizzard was thinking when they added this and maybe removing this would hurt toss too much. So obviously they should add a new spell to compensate, but recall makes pvt a very mechanically based, none strategic match up where you simply win by trying to outproduce your opponent.
change suggestion:
change 1: make recall return units faster.
change 2:debuff units that were just recalled so that it is hard to use it defensivly. maybe anti armor like the ravens aam
Thats just an example. Again if they removed it, prottoss would probably be at a disadvantage i just think they should replace it with something thats more skill base.
2 Likes
The way to say that “I don’t like something about the game” has become “bad game design”
17 Likes
Because protoss shouldn’t ever be allowed to leave their base without having it be destroyed, I guess.
The whole point of recall is that protoss cant split their army effectively without the whole thing suffering, and they aren’t mobile enough to react to attacks in other locations without recall.
14 Likes
well i think its bad game design because it removes allot of the complexity of multi prong aggression and drops and starcraft 2 is a real time strategy.
Well yeah you could say the same thing about terran, when i think i might get attacked i leave units behind to defend.
Bro, if recall matters to you, you’re not playing TvP right. You can’t recall a big army, so it is ineffective in base trade scenario, and if you recall to stop a drop, it will not help at all; by the time the units arrive the drop will have already done the damage and the units will fly out of there before you catch them; in addition to this, T should be hitting multiple spots, so recalling to one spot at best stops the damage in that one spot.
3 Likes
thats not true at all, if i do a double marine drop and the prottoss recalls i will have to leave, and i might have killed a few probes sure but it is basically a get out of jail free card.
Hitting multiple spots will force you too either send more units or split the units you have already sent, and if you send more units than you might loose against the push.
So he recalls to one spot, which you’re doing damage to, and you fly a way unscathed; meanwhile, your other drop is doing damage. Recall has been trash since the radius was nerfed (most powerful use was base trade scenario); recall is not a big factor at all anymore. In addition to this, it can only be used once every so often, and the base must have energy to use it.
3 Likes
keep in mind if you split up to attack mutliple locations and your attacking with too few units prottoss can simply warp in a few zealots to clean up a smaller army and recall onto the other one. and again if you send out too many units you wont be able to defend at home.
Again, no. A pack of MMM with Medivacs will crush a warp-in of Zealots. It sounds to me like your drops are just not very good. The only way to defend drop-play is with incredible map vision and extremely good unit allocation, which is difficult even with incredible vision; in addition, even if you see all the drops coming and allocate perfectly, the Terran can just as easily change course and send the two Medivacs headed to your main to your third, and you’re screwed. For example, suppose you’re lucky enough to see the main army headed to your third, two Medivacs headed to your main, and a Lib or Mine drop headed to your natural; you have a few seconds to allocate units to each location (which may not even be possible depending upon the location of your units on the map) and, even if you manage to get everything in place in time, the Terran can easily just re-route everything to his main army and wipe out your third because all your units are split up. This is the power of Terran mobility.
4 Likes
well you said that you would attack in multiple places at once, i normally do double medivacs and if i wanted to hit in two places at once i would either have to send more medivacs or split up the ones i already sent, and if i split them up than 8 marines will probably die to a zealot warp in.
A warp in that will be available because prottoss is busy A-moving on my side of the map
Yeah, because terran can actually split their army effectively. Protoss cant.
3 Likes
split their army against what? im not saying prottoss players cant micro, im saying they dont have to.
Not sure what you’re talking about; go watch the Cure vs Astrea game to see what I’m talking about. Generally the Terrans I play do what I described; they send their main army to my third or fourth, they send a double Medivac to my main or some other location, and they send a third shift-click somewhere else (either a Lib or another drop). If I’m on the other side of the map I’m just dead because he will gut my base way faster than I can his (on top of strong defenses like bunkers/tanks/etc., his buildings are very durable and can fly, and my army doesn’t do nearly as much DPS as his; this is why you don’t base trade a Terran).
2 Likes
That’s because you don’t know how to play! You’re probably losing to F2 Chargelots while you have some kind of weak drop on his side of the map. Kelthar was referring to splitting units to defend drops.
3 Likes
against the multi-pronged attacks. Are you not paying attention? Protoss cant just leave units at home to fend off attacks, they aren’t like terran where a half dozen marines in a bunker or a single widow mine is enough to completely thwart harass.
5 Likes
i think my change would actually be good, because it would allow prottoss to use recall for aggression and encourage attacks with small groups of units and would discourage select all army play, whats your opinion on that?
well instead of marines and a bunker it would be a few stalkers and shield batteries.
and again, maybe your right, maybe prottoss would be weak without recall, maybe they should buff cannons or something, but i would rather play against stronger cannons because recall is really frustrating to play against.
It depends how it is done; if the units are weakened to a degree greater than the quicker recall time provides an advantage, then it is a nerf (and vice versa). In any case, it is completely irrelevant because recall is really not a major factor in any match-up. Seriously, recall should not matter to you.
1 Like