Well guys, I think not a single person who loves, watches and/or plays this game regularly wants this patch to stay here forever. There are some changes that have to be done so the game stays fresh and attractive to both new and veteran players. I suggest the following ones:
1.- Increase energy requiered for battery overcharge from 50 to 100.
With this change Protoss will have to scout and anticipate any kind of dangerous moveouts from the opponent instead of just triggering the ability whenever and wherever they please.
2.- Decrease starting shield battery energy to have only half of its full capacity after being built.
Spamming static defense just for the sake of it is not the right way to go in an RTS game that doesn’t want players relying too much on it. So if they want to this it will cost more time and resources to get to its full power.
3.- Increase feedback range by 1 and decrease storm range by 1.
With this high templar can have a little easier time with vipers, ravens, ghosts and infestors, while preventing that storms just destroy everything within the same feedback range.
4.- Increase void ray time production by a little bit and decrease its base speed by not too much.
This will make them more vulnerable to queens while they try to kill a hatch, as well as making easier for terrans to defend proxy void ray allins.
5.- Decrease adaptive talons burrow speed for a little bit.
That will make easier to siege up or retreat when lurkers run and burrow too aggresively.
Then it would be nice to make glaves a little bit better so stargate stops being the no-brainer opener in zvp, but I am not sure in what form that could be buff.
I would love that the people that have taken all this time to read the post put also their own balance ideas (and of course why they came with that change). Maybe if more of us come here and communicate our ideas the people at Blizzard that are still working and caring for sc2 will feel inspired about our love and passion for the game and decide to drop by more regularly.
Don’t forget to have fun in the ladder and wishing you all the best luck in your games,
A big StarCraft fan.
Nope. HTs already have an easy time feedbacking vipers. Combined with Oracles it’s already a huge risk using Vipers for any of their ZvP friendly spells. Abduct has 9 range so HTs already outrange it by 1 there, and Parasitic Bomb has 8 range which makes that even harder. At 11 Range for feedback, Vipers would be effectively removed from the matchup which would mean the last t3 unit Zerg has in ZvP is gone. You could save both sides a lot of time and instead of nerfing vipers into oblivion by buffing HTs you could just make the game automatically resolve every ZvP in favor of protoss.
The thing is that at the highest level of play Protoss armies seem to have a hard time engaging with zerg spellcasters, and they try to delay the inevitable while vipers abduct units one by one. Below that skill level it’s not feedbacks but storms the spell that causes zerg the more trouble. To be honest is very difficult to determine what course of action balance-wise should be taken to make zvp late game more interesting.
Which is a funny observation because PvZ is at 54%, favoring Protoss.
Sorry, PvZ is actually at 58% now per aligulac! Protoss has a nearly 10% chance to win a PvZ just because they picked Protoss!
Below the competitive tournament level isn’t a balance concern. The last time Blizzard decided to help low level players we ended up with water baloons and sieged observers so that F2 abuse didn’t punish them. Awful design changes.
It requires a complete redesign of Protoss where Warp Gate is either removed entirely or altered so it’s not abusable (i.e. cd for warp in is same as unit build time but gateways (non-warpgate gateways) create units 25% quicker or something when Warp Gate is researched); which will literally never happen.
we are way past the point of needing rebalance… blizzard has proven time and time again they dont understand, care or even play this game. Just let it die, try to get some fun out of it while you can and hope for a new game and hey, there are a few coming up
My idea is to make the shield battery less effective at restoring shields of air units. I don’t think shield battery is like ridiculously OP in pro games that are still primarily Robo-Gate till the late game or they do go early Stargate just for light harass.
But the proxy Stargate Shield Battety - Void Rays seems annoying for ladder players. This strategy needs a nerf.
Really the only problem I see in PvZ is the infested terran or rather the lack thereof. Keep the shield battery, keep the void ray, keep the queen and fungal nerfs, just get rid of microbial shroud and bring back the infested terran.
Zerg needs a cost effective late-game option in both ZvP and ZvT. Terran turtling is insanely cost efficient, mass shield batteries and in general shield regen is insane, and zerg needs a way to combat that. Infested terrans filled that role perfectly.
Protoss static defense seems to be really hard to break as zerg as well. When they go for the queen march Protoss players instead of making robo units such as disruptors build a lot of cannons and bateries. I undestand that if they want to go for 2 Stargate void ray build they need to set up defensively, but it’s absourd that they rely too heavily on those structures. That shows the idea that pvz is a tower defence game, which is actually not that fun to either watch or play.
Infested terrans combined with a lot of spores and fungal and parasitic bombs were too cost efficient. Free units are not the way to balance the game. Just as static defense is not the way to approach a 7 or 8 minute game. A lot of static defense is useful once you are too spread accross the map, but considering it as the best tool when you are 2 and a half base into the game is just lame. And if someone says well it’s the only way to hold a queen march while getting a fleet beacon at the 7 minute mark then you should consider other openers that don’t go too heavily on air.
Protoss is fine with their warp cool downs and all. The fact that they are encourage to only engage within battery range is the acutal problem. As a zerg you should be able to punish a greedy Protoss and capitalize on it, so your late game is more in your favor. Intead you get a 100 mineral and 50 energy structure that provides insane value. I undestand that ability is vital in pvp, but there’s no reason to make the other 2 matches more lame because of it. Nerfing that aspect will not make pvp boring again.
Factually false. Protoss had higher win-rates in the late game during that period in the pro scene. On top of that they now have buffed shield batteries, void rays, nerfed queens, nerfed fungal - the list goes on and on. So no, infested terrans absolutely would not be too cost efficient. Protoss were more cost efficient back then and since then zerg has had many nerfs and protoss many buffs.
Ask yourself why protoss needs shield battery. Ask why it needed Mothership Core. Was it because their lategame tech needed heavy support? No. Their primary early game units, gateway units, were just underwhelming in comparison to the equivalent Terran/Zerg performance. Now, why can’t you just buff gateway units and remove SB? Well, because of the warp prism. If you can reinforce units into your enemy’s main, those units can’t be too strong.
The reason Protoss, as a race, is entirely dependent on gimmicks and gotchas is because of warp gate. If warp gate were removed or adjusted to maintain defenders advantage for the opponent at their base, then you can buff Gateway units and Protoss can have a stronger basic army and the tech can be adjusted to be less boom/bust.
It’s not the warp prism that is the problem, but more the warp in speed. If ithey would make the warping in of units somewhat slower it could function sort of as a robotic nydus worm.
I think much could be sovled this way: you make the warp in speed slower but still fast enough so you can catch an army out of position, revert the zealot nerfs and buff them a bit just like stalkers , nerf the voidray speed and toss can go ground vs zerg as an alternative to skytoss. Now whenever i play PvZ i have the feeling that adept into VR into skytoss is one of the only ways to go if you don’t want to get steamrolled by zerg.
PartinG kills top terrans by blinking a few stalkers around the map but let’s pretend protoss gateway units aren’t powerful rofl. The amount of delusion on these boards is just off the charts. Protoss units are pound for pound the best units in the game. Imagine if marines could teleport and had free rapid healing when out of combat. Now imagine all of terran’s or zergs units being able to do that, and that’s just one such advantage that protoss core units have.
If you want to complain about warp-gate, it shouldn’t be that protoss core units are weak, because that would make sense design wise (weaker units but the advantage of being able to produce anywhere on the map). The problem there is that protoss units are better, period, than any of their t/z counterparts on top of being able to produce anywhere.
Imagine if overlords carried zerg larvae and you could rain ultralisk eggs inside a Protoss’ base that hatch after only a few seconds or if a barracks moved as fast as a warp prism and could make 12 marines in only a few seconds. Warpgate is a complete joke not because it weakens protoss core units but because the absurdly powerful core units get warp gate (and recall) on top of all their other benefits.
SOme like Gandhi think that weak Protoss needs buffs, OP terran needs nerfs Someone let the mentals out. Maybe when one made a hole in the goba facility building, they escaped…
It takes 3 Reapers and very good micro to kill a single adept or a single stalker.
If a 1-st Stalker comes to you and you don’t have a Bunker, its instant gg.
Stalker is INCREDIBLY strong skirmishing unit. Zealot is very strong unit as well, and after Charge is done it becomes an S-tier unit.
Blink semi-alliin is so good right now that every second Protoss on the ladder plays it right now. “Semi” because behind what is supposed to be an all-in, Protoss takes 3-d while Terran strugles to hold his natural and main.
Furthermore, even after stim and ~2-4 tank are made Terran can’t punish Protoss taking 3-d because Terran army with Stim, +1, Medivacs and said number of tanks just can’t burn through SB heal quick enough.
SB is an even worse design than MSC and should just be removed from the game.
MSC was better for a game.
Top Protoss players already Feedback every Viper before it can Abduct anything. Considering very low Zerg win rate in ZvP, another buff to Skytoss is DEFINITELLY NOT NEEDED.
Top Protoss players have no problems in dealing with EMP either, because they carry HT in WP.
Protoss need a buff to their GROUND army that would work against the Zerg, because beofre “turtle-to-skytoss” meta Protoss had to all-in Zerg every game. I
believe that energy cost of FF should be reduced, and Lurker range upgrade should be removed from the game: Lurker ATG is so good that it makes any ATG army obsolete.
Someone let the mentals out. Maybe when one made a hole in the goba facility building, they escaped…