nice job avoiding my previous post because you know im right.
You are an Attention seeking troll. Why should i react to you?
Nothing you wrote Had one Bit of truth in it. For example you complain about GM representation while GM is Not even Open yet and you purposely inflated the protoss representation.
So why should i Argue with another Troll ?
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Terran is butch cry babies
To me let’s look all broken tools Terran has over other two races.
Mule most over power tool and if think about its broken should follow same rules but doesn’t. Give Terran free pop and free money.
Every other race at least cost 50 minerals and one pop. So before that start making money on investment is 10 turns.
Stim should never be allowed pass beta let alone into game. Its main reason why StarCraft is not a real rts. It’s so power full even knowing enemy building still doesn’t help.
Hellions that cost no gas that aoe destroys mineral units easily. Then can be fully upgraded to hell bats that beats everything.
Widow mine even if burrow you own unit it still fires its missile at invisible unit.
Free stealth detection that can’t be blocked
Protoss is weak compared to Terran they can beat Zerg but has no tools to fight Terran.
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Serral is missing from EU regionals and Ukko is missing from NA regionals, people wanted their PvT clown fiesta, it’s on its way.
terrans sisies complained for years, the game itself was called terrancraft and still is, and thet cry non stop, its a reason this game fell behind and have such a low pupulation comapred to other rts`s, one bias terran babysit from the devs all this years took care of it, microsoft kicked in, and didnt change anything in any game destroyed or ruined by blizz, blizz need to be closed as a studio rn
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Mules are definitely balanced during the early game build-up (where they are a weaker economic bonus than Chronoboost or Spawn Larva). I wouldn’t oppose a replacement macro mechanic, but Mules are not pushing the game out of balance.
Bio units are balanced around Stimpacks, and they have been that way since SC1. If you take stimpacks out, you would need to massively buff the movement speed and attack rate of all of the units that have Stimpacks to compensate. Overall, the Marines and Marauders would need to be about the same strength, but they may end up even stronger since they would no longer have to spend their own health as a cost every 11 seconds to remain relevant.
Hellions are fairly bad in combat, and they have been that way since early WOL. They have range and mobility, but poor health and a relatively weak attack. Hellions can compete with a few light units and workers, but not much else. Usually, if you want Hellions to trade well, you need to convert them to Hellbats and somehow get close to your enemy. The Hellbat transformation was arguably added to allow Hellions to properly function as a combat unit, without making them overpowered as a worker harasser, since direct stat buffs to the Hellion form would only have caused problems.
As for Hellbats, they trade away the Hellion’s speed and range for increased durability and damage, which is a fair trade. Hellbats are very powerful in direct combat if they can get close, but they are so slow and short-ranged that nearly every unit that is vulnerable to Hellbats can outmaneuver them (kite or just avoid). In order to use Hellbats properly, you need to either drop them directly on the enemy (something that was explicitly nerfed by doubling their cargo size), or otherwise force the enemy to engage them by backing them into a corner or placing them in front of Siege Tanks or other units that can force the opponent to react.
Basically, Hellions & Hellbats are fine. This is a L2P issue on your part.
That is actually false. I just tested it to verify.
A Widow Mine needs 1.07 seconds to lockon to a unit before firing its missile. If a unit burrows within that window and the Terran player does not have a detector, then the Widow Mine will lose track of the target and need to repeat the process. If the Widow Mine fires the missile before burrow is finished, then it will hit the target.
At an opportunity cost of 50 energy on an upgraded command center, which could otherwise have been used to boost the player’s mining rate by 225 minerals over the next 63 seconds.
In contrast, Creep Spread gives Zerg a significant movement speed boost and plenty of constant vision. Overseers are also cheap, durable, and low priority; whereas Ravens are more expensive, inconvenient to build, and high priority because they are a caster.
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Mule allows produce military for free Zerg or toss has wait to get thier investment.
What’s makes this bigger problem how strong you two mineral units are.
Terran has defensive and offensive ability has no sacrifice in.
If Zerg attacks to be aggressor it is almost cheese build because if it fails your so far behind. Terran doesn’t have worry about that.
Second 8 marines can wipe out base easy compared to 4 zealots or 4 lings.
Stim was added dps it was made fast sc1 to try brake away lings. But sc2 they added dps which makes them closest strongest unit in game
Hydras was better marines in sc1 even stim only broke engagement not to destroy anything that was alive.
Dang. Is ukko actually that relevant ? I must have completly missed it.
But yeah serral is Out of aligulac again for being inactive 
Microsoft is already stepping up to the plate and fixing issues. The new maps caused the # of games played to increase for the first time in about 4 years. With that change alone the game has reversed a whole year of decline. Imagine what could happen if they actually balanced protoss and fixed the over-emphasis on apm spam.
The fundamental issue is that the game is 99% mechanics, and mechanics are 99% speed, and speed is 99% repetition, so who is good at SC2 comes down to who is the bigger weeb / who is willing to sink the most time into honing their mechanics. There is no significant micro. There is no significant strategy. Multitasking is the game-resolving mechanism and controls the outcomes of the vast majority of games. You have to spam the same build orders on repeat, like a robot, to be good at sc2.
I have a buddy who has a severely autistic child, and this kid watches the same TV show over and over again. There are definitely some parallels there to SC2 pro play. SC2 pro play is the same builds on repeat for tens thousands of games. No sane person is going to enjoy that. Honestly I have no clue how the pro players can do it. It’s so boring and repetitive it reminds me of a kid watching Sesame Street on repeat.
They need to nuke the stale, repetitive, over-emphasis on mechanics and buff the ever living crap out of strategy. Pro players hate strategy because they are apm spammers. They like consistency, and the very definition of strategy is that there are no consistent outcomes – the outcomes depend on the situation. With strategy as the antithesis of reliability, pro players hate it, because they want reliable and predictable outcomes. What gives them reliable and predictable outcomes is their mechanical skills. They spam apm for 40 minutes and slowly eek out a lead and they can do this reliably vs 99.99% of opponents. With a bad strategical decision, you could face-plant into the concrete vs a significantly weaker player. That’s ironically what makes strategy so amazing. The inconsistent outcomes makes the game entertaining. Watching Serral bomb vs some no name and throw his keyboard out the window would be some of the most entertaining SC drama ever created. The possibility is there. Microsoft just has to step up to the plate and make it happen. But, so long as APM spam is the way to win, Serral will win every premier tournament from now until kingdom come. He’s the APM spammer in chief and absolutely nobody can match his ability to melt keyboards. Oh wow some kid clicks fast I guess he gets to win another tournament. Eye roll.
Cant take the Stryker poster seriously, is this a troll. People complained of BC jump and mines, understandable. But stim, even that MULE argument is no argument, as you need to be super late game on many expands for that to matter. And if it was such a huge advantage we wouldn’t be seeing top players like Serral banking 5K-10K minerals, which suggests other races also have their ways. It only looks so but forgets all other asymmetrical balance tricks that other have. Not gonna bother explaining how other races are advantaged in same or similar way
But the mega buffs of toss in 2018 were necessary right because protoss was too weak. When it happened what we see, one protoss cant win a Premiere. Yes it is in their skill or the design of protoss with their skill - a race of tricks that dont work anymore. Certainly I cant say Ive seen Trap, Stats or Classic in their prime be as close to best Z or T in the world, it is the race takes significantly less skill, period.
So what they do now, artificially nerf other races to help the poor protoss players win for once a premiere. Well there aren’t any top protoss players to win them all and that’s been the case for past years.
Either protoss players are lazy training as hard as others or the design of protoss from the start is so bad since the beginning of SC2 that there is just no room to improve anything more.
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We had that approach in WoL and HotS with lower worker counts. It caused build order losses which involved next to no skill and caused a homogenized meta.
Sure you have a point about SC2 being mostly mechanics and not a lot of strategy and I’d love to see some more strategic depth by doing things such as, adding line of sight for projectile units to fire at their target…but it’s just way too late in the lifecycle of sc2 to be doing major revolutionary changes. Might as well start on sc3 at that point.
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Mule: late game you can already ask yourself why the most efficient race needs a mechanic like Mule.
Stim: you mustn’t forget that a lot of things had to be adapted just because of Stim, because they wanted to keep the mechanics.
Aspects like counters were removed, see for example Bane/ marine interaction.
People complain about HotS SH just because David Kim tried to keep the mechanics in the game.
funny, zerg has the reverse problem. Thanks to Gaot Serral + 1 other top zerg player having a good day (Dark, Reynor, Solar), zerg is constantly being nerfed since 2018.
I see the point. Does Terran even have a weak phase in the game right now? unless they throw it away themselves.
No, Mules are a mining mechanic. They speed up resource gathering, but the resources still come from mineral patches. Chronoboost and Inject can both dramatically increase a player’s worker production rate. In the early and mid game, the effects of that are stronger than Mules.
Hellions are not a strong unit. Hellbats are strong, but that is only the case when they can actually get close to the enemy, which they are fairly bad at doing on their own.
Marines are strong if you properly micro them, but they can also melt like tissue paper if you don’t.
Any attack with either a large investment or losses that fails to do enough damage will put a player behind, regardless of the race that they are playing.
Comparing 8 Marines to 4 Zealots is understandable. Those are the same cost and supply, but a counter argument to that is that Zealots are specifically balanced around mobility and durability rather than DPS. You should not expect Zealots to put out as much DPS as Marines with that setup, as they would be broken if they could do so.
You have to be insane to compare 8 Marines (which are probably supported by a Medivac for a total of 500/100/10 resources) to only 4 Zerglings. Assuming the same cost in combat units, you would need 16 Zerglings for 400/0/8 resources. Trust me, 16 Zerglings can put out a lot more damage than 8 Marines, unless something is in position to kill them first.
Stimpacks has always added DPS. In Brood War it increased attack speed by 100% and movement speed by 50%, but the units that used it (Marines & Firebats) were squishier.
In SC2, the Marine’s health was buffed (+15) at the cost of a weakening Stimpacks. The SC2 Stimpacks is a 50% boost to both attack speed and movement speed. These are the stats that Marines have been balanced with since early WOL, and there is no way to replace or remove stimpacks without other changes that would keep their strength the same.
Marines with Stimpacks had higher DPS against everything with less than 2 base armor. Marines shredded Hydralisks and most other units, although they usually had to reach a minimum critical mass (as they still do now) before that would take effect.
The main issue with Marines in Brood War was that both Terran and Protoss had extremely powerful splash units that made it difficult to fight with a critical mass of Marines. Vultures were also very good at picking off Marines with limited retaliation, which made mech the preferable build if you had the micro for it.
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Stim is broken and should be reworked for balanced issues.
I hate I can micro against your counter like it’s huge skill to master spam two buttons.
Helbats are way buff and it’s broken especially since cost no gas.
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If Stimpacks were broken, they would have been nerfed a very long time ago.
The “skill” comes from kiting, splitting, and stutter-step micro, not from simply pressing the T button every 11 seconds. Simply pressing T won’t save you from Banelings, Disruptors, Storm, etc.
Hellbats are appropriately balanced for their role, if not a bit weak. I have already gone over the reasons why. You simply didn’t read or comprehend.
Compositions that can use Hellbats effectively are also very gas intensive, since they tend to need a lot of Tanks, Thors, and/or air units. Hellbats without that support are quite easy to beat.
Main reason stim broken is that only one sided.
It’s not that hard to especially if main thing you practice.
Main problem thier is no real counter play against micro marines. If they cost much as hydra then they be slightly more balanced.
Fungle is not counter play since it also can be dodged easily.
Even they switch cost between reapers and marines it be more balanced.
Take all units it can beat come pare its cost.
Only one unit that marines can’t go toe to toe is ultra which all its buffs was to kill marine but every other unit micro marine can beat.
On top mule produces 5 of them for 50 energy.
Yet u still claim it’s balanced
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No, it’s not. Just because you refuse to micro or set up a basic surround/concave/flank, doesn’t make stim broken.
You’ve never tried to dodge a Fungal in your life, so how would you know how easy or hard it is to dodge?
There absolutely is - See above; Flank, surround, concaves, utilize terrain. Don’t just blindly a-move in and expect to win when you do literally nothing else.
If they cost as much as hydras, while also having to spend absurd amounts on infrastructure the way Terran does, then the marines would be absolutely the worst unit in the game bar none because the health to cost ratio would be so wildly out of proportion that it would effectively necessitate a rebalance of the entire game.
Hydras cost the amount they do because Zerg is balanced entirely around the fact that they don’t need production structures, and they have huge economies that they’re supported by. Even still, they needed buffs previously to get them to where they are now (which is genuinely a strong unit).
If you switched the cost you would literally have to rebalance the marine entirely and make it much stronger than it is now; again, see above.
It’s a good thing that cost isn’t the only balancing factor then. Production mechanics, health, mobility, necessary supporting units and their extra costs etc are what make the unit balanced (and useable).
Fun fact, marines were genuinely useless in base Starcraft because they had no form of healing, even despite the fact that Stim was significantly stronger back then. It wasn’t until medics were added in BW that they got used, and even then they’re still not commonly seen.
Chargelots are honestly very strong against bio in general, though they often need support they’re no less weak. Storm. Disruptors. Colossus. Ultras. Banes. Lurkers. All extremely good counters to the marine. Being able to counter-micro doesn’t mean they’re not good counters. And frankly, all of those are very good counters to the Marine, regardless of what you think.
Counter-micro is arguably the sign of a well designed unit. This game isn’t a rock-paper-scissor game where you make a counter and suddenly you invalidate the units it counters. It helps, definitely, but that doesn’t mean you can’t and shouldn’t be able to play around those counters, which is what you seem to be wanting.
Mules give 4 marines worth.
Because it is.
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The worst part about marines is that they are a catch-all unit. Spamming marines solves 95% of terran’s strategy. That’s why every terran from now until kingdom come will be spamming marines. There is no reason not to spam them. There are lots of reasons not to make zerglings. A terran will basically never not make marines. Every game vs terran is marine spam simulator. The same old unit comps, micro, positioning, maneuvers, on repeat for almost 15 years. When will we see a gm in terran massing only viking reaper or marauder battlecruiser or liberator hellion? It’ll never happen.
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MULE is asymmetry to Chronoboost and inject, funny to explain why something is so that has been since the beginning. It has been calculated by them how an SCV busy building, busy repairing, only 1 at a time, losing workers and Terran needing most time to restore the mineral loss is compensated by MULE. How come it is a prob only to forum plat patrol?
That is why fungal is needed too. Bio gets efficient if you micro like a pro. Without mines it is very easy to lose the bio.
Thats again because protoss players either cant improve or there is just nothing more to improve playing that race, so they cut from the other races which is stupid I know.
can it be that MMM spam damages brain performance? or why can terran players no longer read and then understand?
key word: context!
because I was referring specifically to “late game”.
less MMM spam and more Dr. Kawashima’s brain jogging, please.
there is a nice clip of a group of marine standing with stim. and killing group of banling. Remembering bane → counter marine. in this situation Fungale would be useless.
For bane to fulfill its “counter role” it needs other units to pull aggro, at best other melee units in the front.
They have less life than marine and no 5range… that’s why ling are against sim city bad.
not a good point. Remember Root Fungal has also been in the game since WOL (possibly due to stim). And was removed in LotV.
That hits hard now but things can change. Especially when you see that Burst aoe damage has been nerfed, marine benefits the most from it. so if you want to keep this direction you have to adjust stim sooner or later.