I am by no means trying to imply anything related to balance in this thread, but does anyone else find it weird that the race who’s identity is that of a ‘swarm’ usually has the lowest supply in army, due to having to have the highest worker count?
Just a bit weird imo.
nobody thinks that. There is this thing called spine spam, cancel spine spam and voila ur race suddenly got 280 max supply.
Obviously, that’s a problem since wings of liberty.Terran is the true swarm. When you play bio you have the feeling you are managing a big army, when you play zerg sometimes you feel you are playing toss because you have a small amount of units since the mid-lategame compositions require a lot of supply, while T is mostly 1-2 supply units that can hit everywhere because even on small numbers theya re good.
Unless you are playing mass ling or mass SH as supporting unit, zerg does not feel swarmy.
Not really. High worker count and low individual unit value means that they struggle to deathball their way through life and win macro games by being able to rebuild and replace losses much quicker than their enemy. Seems pretty swarmy to me.
If you’re looking at the army supply, that’s possible, depending on the MU and the Z’s playstyle. Yet global supply first place often goes to the Z ; and due to lings being only 0.5 supply and the army production being non linear, the amount of units can really skyrocket fact once the Z has reached the point he want.
So don’t worry, mass roachs or mass lings timings will always seems swarmy enough to protoss or terrans opponents. 
Nice in theory… but not working
Counter argument: Zergling is 0.5 supply per unit.
Even if they have lower army “supply”, they have equal or higher army count due to having units that cost less supply, and there are supply-less units like Broodlings and Locusts. They definitely are still swarmy when you look in the right places.
I agree with Kelthar.
fine example is what Serral said on Pig Show.
“~80-90 worker and then muta/ling/bane or Ravager/ling/bane”
vs. mech.
or Clem vs Reynor 90 workers but nostop attack.
The idea is to trade. and through your ecco you can constantly rebuild while your opponent runs out of resources.
Best case:
your opponent loses ecco/ army / tech sometime he attacks but can’t keep the push up.
worst case:
he defends everything and trades well. gets a strong army. and wins every fight against your new built army because he has more army sup.
in some bio vs Z zerg gets a lead in the general sup only late.
Is it not working because you arent doing it maybe? Ever thought about that?
To turn 80 drone into spine is 8k mineral plus whatever cost incurred for the 80 soup army… You’re looking at minimum of 12k min to do this mass spine
I never said it was early game.
Zerg can easily do it however.
It has happened allot in the past.
And can we agree that zerg is now economically stronger thus being able to reach this stage earlier?
Just because macro is a thing of the past doesnt mean macro strategies dont exist.
I don’t think it’s that easy. 12k minerals is a massive amount, especially in LoTV where the maps dry up a lot quicker.
except what are you going to spend resources on when your doing free damage with GGlords?
Lategame means you have spine crawler forests you know?
I think he’s just mispronouncing it.
The zerg over 200 sup is possible.
280, he’s probably just exaggerating.
You would have to pull all the workers from 5Base.
But the fact that you can do that at 16 has been demonstrated on a pro Ivl basis.
Oh yeah totally now I remember seeing all of the late game grounds based compositions being stopped by spine forests
Ty idk how I forgot
Zerg imba reee
Well zerg focuses on getting drones early game because they are free to do so, but once they hit 66 drones (3 base saturation) they can start maxing out. In a high level game, if there isn’t too much damage done, the zerg can get to 200 supply with around 76-81 drones by 9 minutes, and 120 army is much more than the other two races can get at that time.
this has now nothing to do with the topic itself.
mass PF/CC(aka 21 workers 40 Mule 179 army sup Terra )/ kannons /SB → late game
Absolutely, and I think this raises a good point. Zerg is at their swarmiest in the mid game. When they’re at 200 supply with mostly ling/bane and something else. I feel that identity is sort of lost in the lategame, however.
And suddenly you realise how weak protoss really is lategame.