I think cannon rushing specifically in PvP is kind of imba but ONLY on specific maps with ledges that allow for a 3 pylon wall and a cannon to be placed behind them, preventing the building cannon from being attacked.
In those cases you can’t stop the cannon rush, even if scouted. Your only hope is to plop down a forge asap and try to cannon your main a bit further back…but your pylon and gateway by the ramp is automatically forefit. The other way to stop it is to constantly have a Probe patrol these small ledges that are highly abusable until your cyber core or a zealot finishes but that requires hard countering a build with no scouting so it’s unlikely unless your opponent always does this in their PvP MU.
I think we need better quality maps as crap like this constantly appears in one form or another and frankly, we deserve better as a player base…whoever is selecting these maps is doing a very bad job.
No it is not you can dps that with workers and prevent that in the first place, just send one probe following one probe in your base. Or if you probe scout, you know it is cannon rush, before even probe gets your base. This confirm my suspicion from another post. You are total noob and don’t know what you are talking about, no offence…
Let’s not use this as an excuse to whinge about normal cannon rushing. This is very specific to map with space for 3 pylons on the ledge and a cannon behind them. Workers cannot kill a pylon and get to the cannon fast enough to stop it. No matter what, that cannon is finishing. You cannot stop it with a probe pull due to a map flaw.
I don’t think it is a map issue. You can’t put this burden in the maps…so every time someone creates a map he has to think about this and that and this and that other issue.
The problem has to be adressed in its core! Just flat nerf cannon build time outside super conduit field as it is already done to warpgate units. 15 sec should be enough. Problem solved.
This tells me you have no clue wtf you’re talking about in this instance.
You cannot stop this specific cannon rush because the cannon gets placed beind 3 pylons that leave a perfect 4x4 square behind them for a cannon. Even a following Probe can’t stop this. Your literal only choices are to forfit the gateway and pylon at your ramp and cannon your Nexus to prevent cannons from inching forward, proxy a robo or SG, accept your main is going to die and base race, build your stuff in this nook, meaning you’re now vulnerable to Adepts or you can have 1 Probe constantly patrol this area until you have a Zealot or Stalker out. Scouting doesn’t stop it, trying to kill the probe doesn’t stop it, trying to kill the pylons before they finish doesn’t stop it.
This cannot be stopped by a probe pull. At all. And it only happens on 1 or 2 maps. In WoL we had a similar issue with a map being poorly designed and it had to be changed because cannon rushers would cannon the low ground and take the main base gas near the nat for high ground vision of the mineral line. The main had to be adjusted to prevent the cannons on the low ground reaching the high ground. Certain maps just need to be adjusted because they have unintended features. This should be one of those cases.
No. The problem isn’t with cannon rushing. The problem is with specific maps. Most are fine but a few have little nooks which allow for a 3 pylon wall followed by a cannon behind it and that is the issue, bad map design.
This is why cannon rushing isn’t an issue. The only 2 times cannons have ever been imba, including this time, are because of bad map design enabling some goofy play that’s bogus to vs.
PvP is lowkey the worst matchup in this game that no one talks about. It’s a coinflip and absolutely nonsensical experience from start to finish. The problem is, there’s only so much we can do about it. Cannon rush has been a thing since the beginning of the game. It’s an imbalanced strategy, especially in pvp, but no one cares enough to fix it bEcAuSe iT’s FuN tO sEe ThE sAlT xDD
There’s a desert map in the 2v2 pool where if you cannon rush your opponent’s natural, you basically win the game. It’s an uncontestable spot unless you pull 3 workers to deal with a probe that might be scouting. I think mapmaking reached its peak with Lost and Found. That map was really balanced as far as I remember (1v1). The maps this season suck, and I have no hope for the next pool of maps, especially for team games. I gave up on good 1v1 maps a while ago, sorry.
That definitely sums up my opinion on PvP in a nutshell; it’s gimmicky, cheesy nonsense where Proxies are the end-all-be-all.
But that aside, I have no issues with cannon rushing outside of very specific abuses that certain maps provide. In this map pool Ephermion is the map which enables this as it has that jagged edge which allows for a 3 pylon wall+a cannon behind them between the ramp and the main base nexus.
No. The problem IS with cannon rush and the way buildings behave about land placement and collisions. As I said, you can’t blame the map design for something that is being made by abusing the way how collisions and build placements are handled.
You’re wrong. The reason why you’re wrong is because this issue only happens on specific maps. Normal cannon rushing is very beatable and if you lose to it, you were either unlucky or misplayed.
The 3 pylon wall with a cannon behind it is the issue because you cannot stop it without gibbing your economy or building placement so hard that you’re now hyper exposed to Adepts or an allin, really.
Outside of 1 or 2 maps, this in not an issue; ergo we can logically deduce this is a problem with poorly designed maps since in all the years of StarCraft 2, we only see this kind of cannon rush on maps with a very specific feature.
By holding position a probe there in PvP you’re either doing 1 of 2 things.
Hard countering a build, which means your opponent has done exactly this strategy to you before or you’re taking a massive gamble, because you’ll lose a good 200+ minerals by holding position a Probe, nevermind that the maps where this is doable usually have more than 1 nook where you can 3 pylon wall and place a cannon behind it.
If you take another nexus the issue is you have no probes unless you recall and if you recall, that’s basically telling the opponent to go hunt for the ninja expand, which gives them a free win since they have a better economy than you do.
Well then why did you start the hold position at 0 seconds in, given how probes mine roughly 60 minerals/minute, and by 3:20 you already have a stalker.