I mean, a lot of people can have done so. I came up with Phoenix/adept all by myself before it was cool, but high masters players I spoke to said that many players up in the 5000+ MMR range were designing the strat around the same time. So it’s less accurate to say I invented Phoenix/adept than to say I derived it before it was taught. So not the first to use it, but I did come up with it without seeing it first.
Please enlighten me on how the concept of the maxpax build is any different than this: Twitch
That’s from 5 years ago. A build I did EVERY GAME, for years, and got top GM with… Even the double pylon before gateway in LotV… I used before…
Anyone trying to act like other people are creating builds is out for lunch. Every time a Toss has a macro build, it’s just some guy who played me and copied what I did. It is what it is. It’s silly. Name a single Toss player that does his own builds? Let me guess… maxpax, lmao. Yeah… should see his P vs P. Rip off build, too.
I even wrote about the build in a book and COACHED other people the proxy gateway into fast expand years ago.
It’s just amazing the impact that streamers have on this game. If those guys told you the sun was blue, you’d find every science book and change it to blue. It’s like… jesus christ. The guy streams… he isn’t walking on water.
No, lol. I’ve never tried to report anyone. I play against known hackers in WCS and don’t even say a word. I’ve never used the report function. I know it’s just a placebo thing. And now that the game is free to play… how you going to actually ban someone?
I just wish they would ban more people from WCS. I think it’s absolutely ridiculous to have pro players in the scene that you know they had to have banned at least one of their accounts for hacking, yet… has anyone heard Blizzard say they banned someone?
This game just leaves an awful taste in your mouth, if you have any integrity whatsoever.
It’s honestly pretty tragic how few people realize just how little creativity is in this game. In all my time of playing LotV… I’ve only seen one Toss do something “interesting.” Tcultimate likes to go DT drop/“contain” into skytoss.
I think he’d be better off just going dts into stalker/disruptor, but I’m still blown away by seeing something different. All one needs to know is 100% of players open double gate in P vs P. Giving anyone the benefit of the doubt for creating a build on their own, when all they’ve known is copying is laughable, while ignoring it came 6 years late.
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Have you ever had players enter tournaments under your alias? I mean, you cry that others have stolen your glory because they used a similar build to a build you claim you invented.
So, tell me, how do you know you invented it? You’ve played a bajillion games and witnessed equally as many, so how do you know you didn’t see it or something similar to it anywhere? Let’s assume that you were living on an island with no human contact for the past 15 years, and actually did invent the build purely out of your own mind - how does that prove that others didn’t figure out the same build by the same means? Perhaps they invented it first?
Claiming you OWN a build is a claim that is very bold because it almost certainly isn’t true and even if it were it would be basically impossible to prove. We are witnessing here that you subject your ego to no amount of critical thinking.
Go to bed. You’re like a political spam bot.
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He’s not the sharpest tool in the shed.
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Think about how asinine this is. The idea was so “novel” that even 5+ years later, Beastyqt is losing his mind over how “genius” the build is, because it was so counter intuitive/weird. You tell me how many people were doing this…
Everyone has been 100% sure that maxpax created this. You think he was doing this 5 years ago, lol? Beastyqt spent all that time on EU and just came across it?
You know how many games I’ve played against Terran streamers where I’ve done that build, for so many years? There isn’t a Terran I haven’t used that build against. You can’t just do a build that someone else has been doing for “6 years” and then be like “oh yeah, I totally created this on my own. I’ve totally never watched a stream before or off raced.” That’s not creating s. That’s called selective memory.
You play these guys who copy what works. That’s what they do. Then you play them and you beat them and they’re like “hmm… that’s actually better than what I’m doing or counters what I’m doing,” so they implement it… and if they’re a popular streamer, you have to hear about “their build” for the next 100 years.
As the only Toss who actually does their own builds 100% of the time, I’m just tired of it. I think it’s cool to do w/e build you want to do, whether it’s meta or any build I’m doing. I just think it’s kinda dumb to abuse that “one guy is blackballed, so I can totally act like this is my original build.”
If someone was doing this build 6+ years ago, and it wasn’t someone I coached it to, then they should just post the replay and talk about it. I’d much rather the credit go to the originator than someone coming up with a carbon copy 50 years later. I doubt the build was even possible in WoL, so I’d be impressed for sure…
In my book, I wrote about the 1/1/1 build in T vs Z in BW. That was like 7 years ago. Now… everyone is giving Flash credit for creating 1/1/1, like 7 years after the fact. There is no congruent logic in SC. Having the most success with a build doesn’t automatically equate to creating it, if it involves Playa. Coming up with a build doesn’t matter, if it involves Playa.
If we’re going to be this dumb, then the scene shouldn’t be allowed to assign credit to ANYTHING. Just describe the build and s tfu. I’ve yet to copy a single build, yet I don’t use “playa build” this, “playa build that.” If you can name a build after yourself, you haven’t innovated jack s, so stf u.
People are randomly creative like people are randomly artists. Either you are or you’re not. All I’ve seen is white people vs the indians. “Our land. Totally been here forever, says the non indian.”
I’ve noticed this about a lot of top tier players. This is why they get smashed in 2v2. The execute memorized build orders and get smashed by phoenix/tank every time.
They don’t play SC2, they try to memorize it.
I think people might be better off with reading instead of watching for a minute. Like… it’s only 10 bucks and the book talks about the advantages and cons of playing meta and creating your own builds.
It’s not a coincidence the maxpax became a fad many years after I started doing it. The book talks about “playing ahead of the meta. Basically playing as someone from the future.”
This isn’t a new thing. This happens year after year, and people always find random people to give the credit to, due to not being apart of a “boy’s club.”
It also talks about the origins, evolution and logic behind specific builds. Not just “hey, look guys… I got a new build that just came to me!” That’s so insane to me. Maybe it’s just me, but I find it so incredibly weird to “create a build” without giving the reasons/logic behind it. Something is missing…
It’s like reading a book that just says “hey guys… I created the world. The end. Yep.” It makes no sense and satisfies nothing. All it is, is suspect and for good reason.
In Broodwar, I started out copying the meta man. I kept up-to-date more than anyone. Downloaded the newest replays every day off Korean sites. There’s nothing wrong with it. If you’re a new player… you should be wanting to copy…
Once you get more experience, though, eventually you will be able to think about the game more on your own and you will realize that problems arise with meta play, thus you will have to solve problems, which, inevitably, leads to new builds/ways of playing. Anyone saying they created something yet can’t tell you why is f’ing full of s, flat out.
Keep up the good work darklphoenix. Keep me/us posted on your normal games (non cannon rush), too, as that would be really interesting to see how you make that work, regardless of the level.
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Just had a zerg player with 510 apm who was spreading creep without his camera over tumors. 0 energy queens.
I’m thinking of testing +1 armor gladept (with setnry g shield) vs bio terran. I’ll let you know how it goes.
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If you find anything that works against Terran, please let me be the first to know. I flat out can’t P vs T in LotV. I either lose to early tank pushes or liberator spam harass, if I try to play ground based.
The only thing that works with even a modicum of success for me is disruptor, tempest, carrier. But even that can lose to pure freaking bio. I hate Terran.
Atm, I’m trying to work on making a shield battery at terran’s natural to try to ensure they can’t CC on the low ground. I’m really out of ideas.
“But Playa, you created the maxpax build that is ‘super awesome.’” That’s what really baffles me… That build is meant for HotS. It is easily the best heart of the swarm P vs T build on ladder, and it’s not even close. However, I had stopped doing the build in LotV because it’s garbage – especially when your opponent already knows what you’re going to do…
I feel like I don’t even have a shot at winning P vs T unless I get way ahead in the early game. I feel way more pressure to do damage in this matchup than vs Zerg. It’s nuts.
I may have replay you’ll enjoy titled “best PvT build so far.” let me see if I can find it.
Like everything… it scales with skill. A master/gm can follow the same theory and execute it better then I do.
W/e you got show it. Seriously. I can’t play this mu for the life of me. I beat Epic, top 5 GM. I beat kiwian, whether playing normally or sky toss. Anyone below 6k MMR? No chance.
Right now, I’m at a single cannon “contain” into blink dts. Yo, I never even research this blink dt ability no matter how many dts I have or economy late game. This race is crazy.
I can only surmise that every opening that doesn’t involve blink stalkers sucks. About the only thing I haven’t tried so far, due to hating that unit.
Playa this isn’t rocket science. You were doing this build on NA. Beastyqt first mentioned it on the Pylon Show which has a much further reach and influence than most other creative outlets in Starcraft and he first discovered it on EU.
EU by its very nature is more influential to SC2’s overall scene than NA is.
Basically, if you’re doing a build in NA’s Master league and it’s working well that’s cool and all but that’s not the same as you doing it against pros on EU. You might think that’s unfair and it probably is but that’s just the reality of it.
If you really want to claim credit for it (not like it REALLY matters since who gets credit for what specific build isn’t actually WORTH anything other than e-peen bragging rights) why not contact Cobra from the Pylon Show and ask him to set the record straight. Send him all the relevant info you can, and TRY your best to be as polite and as professional as possible and who knows, maybe you can get your case heard.
Crying about it on the NA General Forums the way you are is definitely not going to get anything done, and isn’t helping your image here at all.
I was watching Beastyqt’s stream live when he lost his mind. You guys are idiots/discriminatory. That’s what it boils down to.
I wasn’t “doing this in NA masters league.” I was top 10 GM and top 16 season after season, while DOING THIS BUILD EVERY GAME FOR YEARS. I had the best P vs T win rate, every season, after doing this build.
I wrote a book detailing it… I used it in every tournament game. I used this build in like 10 games in a row in the FINALS of a midwest tournament.
I beat Bunny and other EU GMs on NA when they were the top EU Terrans. I went at least 4-0 vs Kelazhur with this. I’ve already BEATEN nearly every non Korean Terran with this very said build years ago. It’s so f’ing stupid.
If a guy tries to hate and is like “nah man, no way…” and you show the ample evidence, what happens? Crickets. Cause… at the end of the day… gotta pump the tires of random white guys or guys in the old boys club that rules SC 2.
It’s like Rifkin freaking out over Wardi not getting a casting gig. “But guys… we control this scene. You scratch my back, I scratch yours. We don’t let outsiders into our scene to jeopardize our dominance.”
You guys have a streamer obsession. You guys think everything must suck until a streamer says “guess what’s awesome.” Gullible lil sheep.
Most EU players have played on NA. Heck, I even played Serral on NA. The max guy is using old builds. It’s not a one build thing. It’s every year. Non stop. I’m just finally stepping forward and being like… look… when the guy starts copying w/e I do next… can we finally call a spade a spade?
It’s just so tilting. I can’t even post a thread asking for help in a matchup without a guy linking me to a maxpax build and telling me if I just did this build, I’d own life. I came back from years of not playing and my first f’ing opponent won’t stop harassing me for using the “rotti build.” Like wtf is that?
Bunch of clown copiers, that think they’re doing their own build if they copy something that wasn’t meta. Streamer this, streamer that. Who gives a f. For crying out loud, Rifkin casts games. Big freaking deal.
It’s a freaking HotS build. It sucks donkeys in LotV. I just wish people would stop being dumb. It’s like if I started doing a cannon rush + immortal build vs Zerg and was like… “came up with it on my own…” Anyone with 30 IQ or > would be like “who gives a f, it’s a build that has been out for years.” That’s the normal mentality. But anytime someone just copies something I did… it’s like… well… “streamer said Playa sucks!” Yeah!
lol over a year later I finally saw someone using this hack again.
It actually works against them
its rare but me and my freind vsed a guy who had 600 apm which is clearly a hacker because noone can get 600 apm
you didnt beat bunny or anyone shhh troll
Did you ever get any results back from Blizzard if they banned the hacker?
It looks like it’s a custom made hack. It’s safe to assume that’s the same person from last year on a new account.