I mean I proved it. It could be off by a few %, but it’s not that erroneous.
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Its not proven. You have stated some weird calc but you didnt actually validate your maths. You havent shown that its valid.
I could run some weird numbers too and say hey look i proved something. But proving something in mathematical aspects is something very very different and something very hard to do.
look at that. Just look at that 
Just a little hint to make it easier for you:
You want a formula something like amount of games / average MMR and compare that to other races.
Thats how you could show that for example terran needs more games for their mmr. Concluding that it means its harder is still a pretty big stretch and hard to argue but hey it would be a beginning. your formula lacks sense in terms of units as you just mess around weird fractions and stats and it lacks sense. You dont state where your values come from and why they should be valid.
For example your 0.91 is the value i gave to you for an example: I said if you want to average out the whole terran population over the leagues (for whatever nonsense reason because i dont think it means anything) you would get a percantage of 36% terran in every league since 36% of overall population is terran but for higher leagues we can estimate that they only have 33% representation. 1- 33%/36%= 0.083333*100%=8.3333% lower population than expected if you would expect a 36% population for every league (in my reply to you i said 9% because i wanted to save time).
That however doesnt a state that they gain 8% less mmr on average.
Another example is your 37% activity/ 36% population stat. it doesnt equate a 3% higher activity for terran. Terran is exactly 1% more active than the other races.
And i dont know where you got your 1.06 and what it should reflect.
As you can see your formula doesnt make any sense at all.
Last but not least: even if you managed to show something in that direction its still not a proof for terran being harder/underpowered. because you need a validation why its ok to equate terran getting less mmr on average=terran is harder.
ForGG is literally keeping NA GM alive.
…
I wanted to ask what you want me to do with this statement until i looked at NA GM.
Holy cow. That guy is insane.
Funny tho that this guy has the best winrate vs terran 73% and his tvz and tvp is the same on 68%.
The win rate is very low considering the amount of TvPs he plays. Dude could probably play it blindfolded at this point.
The roach burrow nerf for starters. The rest of the nerfs are pretty well correlated to him stomping everyone. Some of the nerfs were just backtracks to buffs given to make Korean zergs competitive in 2017 though.
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It has to be proportional to the TERRAN population man, are you seriously braindead?
You want to
What? having to play more to get the same MMR making something harder is a “stretch?” Jesus you’re delusional.
I did. Every time I do, you and your PPP idiot sisterhood just rally cry “THAT DOESN’T MEAN TERRAN IS HARDER, NOTHING MEANS ANYTHING! THINGS DON’T MEAN THINGS!”
It’s completely pathetic
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Do you know what a difference in Activity means ?
It can be suggested If Race selection was random. But it is Not
You didnt. You cant calc weird crap and say its proven. I have stated above that the Units are Missing and the values are at best wrong. Nothing in this calc is Close to be correct or comprehensible. And you still try to make 1% Activity difference to 3% by Not understanding the 1% Activity difference is already in Relation to the terran Population.
Lets rephrase it: weird crap calculation doesnt mean anything. That is correct
Maru has been better than every zerg player in the world since forever. The one year when serral was crushing it and we desperately wanted a Serral vs Maru GSL finals, Serral wimped out (and continues to), never showing up to GSL even once.
I for one would like to thank Maru for showing all the TCF terrans how to play their race. It’s pretty simple. Take a lead, hold a good position, and watch zerg melt as they try to crack you open. The trades were insane.
I don’t have a problem with you stating that people are picking Terran more frequently, I have a problem with you stating that they must be the “less skilled players” (which is contrary to all evidence) because you said so. That’s what’s completely moronic.
Terran players aren’t just less skilled because you want them to be.
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I mean, we saw Serral vs Maru in TSL earlier this year - though Maru stated he wasn’t playing at his best.
It makes perfect Sense. We already discussed this. You deny Basic Logic and evidence. And yes If you ask the Community Most people will exactly Tell that. And also the evidence is exactly telling that on average terran Players are less skilled (because of the distribution of the Players in the Leagues and If we only use this Metric…and we really only have this Metric and its actually a good metric).
Im Not saying a Masters terran is less skilled than a Player of a different Race but with Same mmr but terran being very dominant in lower League and thus Lowering average mmr for terran is pretty logical. In the Same Sense thats its pretty logical that zerg has a Higher average mmr because of the absence of zerg Players in lower Leagues.
What you cant understand is that Race selection is Not random.
You failed to provide evidence. A theory isn’t evidence, it’s an explanation. I know you’re not too stupid to understand the difference, but yet you keep blowing that horn, grasping at reeds to keep yourself from the truth.
It’s funny to me, that this is so painful for you. It’s just a video game.
I understand it fully, and were the players playing less, or newer, I would acquiesce, instead it’s the opposite.
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You never mentioned as to why your explanations change like the wind. Because it’s like idea whack a mole. Every time I smash one with facts, you come up with another brain dead, moronic explanation.
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I can explain it to you Like you are a Guy with lesser brain Power:
Lets say you have Like no clue about Vacuum cleaners (vc) Other than there is a Button to Start and there is a head where Things get sucked in.
Now you stand infront of 3 vc. The First one Looks very weird. Like nothing you have Seen before. You dont See a Button to Start and you dont know where Things get sucked in. The next 2 seem to be similiar and you See the Button to Start and also the head where Things get sucked in. But you have Seen 10 advertisements for one of the 2 and there is also on unit Standing there free to Test Out. which one of those 3 you will buy?
Probably the one where you have Seen an Advertisement and could Test it Out and Looks familiar to you No ? Does this have anything to say about the quality of the Product or how easy or hard it is to use it on Long Term ? No.
Proof of that claim: Overall terran population and especially terran population in lower leagues and also comparing to the zerg overall zerg population and in lower leagues. Also compared to terran/zerg activity in other modes which is nearly exclusively played by lower mmr/casual players.
That is much much more of an evidence than your self proclaimed proven maths. Like hurr durr here we are 20% harder, trust me dude. If it was so easy to find out how balanced/unbalanced or hard/easy it is then blizzard would have reacted to that quickly. 20% (as you said its more of a conservative calculation) is like veeeeery much and would get fixed instantly by blizzard. and even now the pro player balance team doesnt think your way. so maybe you are wrong and they are right 0.o maybe. just maybe. maybe they dont give a damn about ppl in silver/gold league.
We know about the effects of design and advertising and how they manipulate the population and we have the exact statement of a starcraft designer who said that they designed terran to be familiar. they wanted as many people as possible to play the game so they made the human space cowboys as likeable as possible. its not a surprise that a) most people will play terran and b) most people will pick terran when they start the game and both claimes got proven right. this results in terran having lowest mmr on average and there is nothing wrong with that. that has 0 to say about for example terran players in masters or how easy/hard/whatever the race is. and why? because race selection is not random. therefore we cant just analyse some things and say definitve things about x or y race/population/whatever. this is not a highly controlled test area where every variable gets eliminated. its just simple capitalism. you advertise a product and boom goes the dynamite. Note that its pretty common to use the 25% to 50% of the budget you used for the game for advertising and promoting the game. if it wasnt proven effective, hardly would anyone still do it, heh?
The problem is you havent once smashed an argument with facts. Thats the bottomline problem. And on the other hand you cant refute my point so you argue for the sake of arguing. You have 0 counterproof of why mere exposure or advertising in general wouldnt work in sc. also no the data doesnt show the opposite. why else would terran be the by far most populated race if it wasnt the race most picked at the start of most new players (which btw evolved into veteran players); terran playercount rising over the years is also a big hint towards that, so that new/newer/casual players more often pick terran than the other races.
In other words: its very simple and logical that there are more terran players in lower league.
very weird to hear that from you considering you wanted to punch me because of that And i think the way you insult other people makes it clear that you are much much more involved with this. Every topic you speak about with others is how much harder terran is and how unfair the game is designed thats pretty whiny and pathetic if you ask me.
This is WHY TERRAN IS MORE POPULAR. Not why they’re lesser skilled.
The mere-exposure effect is a [psychological] phenomenon by which people tend to develop a preference for things merely because they are familiar with them. In [social psychology]), this effect is sometimes called the familiarity principle . The effect has been demonstrated with many kinds of things, including words, [Chinese characters], paintings, pictures of faces, [geometric figures], and sounds. In studies of interpersonal attraction, the more often people see a person, the more pleasing and likeable they find that person.
See that? Do you see where it said “among less skilled individuals?” No? Because it’s not there. YOU added that and called it a “fact.”
While we’re at it, and explanation as to why you dislike me:
In the field of psychology, cognitive dissonance is the perception of contradictory information, and the mental toll of it.
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They are not lesser skilled BUT however on average terran will have less mmr because of that.
They get first introduced by that → they more likely pick terran at the beginning ->They advance and either get better (higher leagues) switch races or stay terran in lower leagues (you begin in lower leagues, no one is born professional).
Which results in terran getting on average lowest mmr but having by far the most population.
(note: it is about statistics not about absolut truth about every person or decision, meaning ppl have higher chance picking terran at the start, etc etc.)
They have switched races, but yet the Terran population has grown over the years.
And why do they not get promoted while those with other races do, even though they play as much or more than their counterparts?
These are all explanations I’ve heard before. But we know they can’t be true, the numbers eliminate them as a possibility.
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This is no contradiction. If the rate of terran staying terran and not switching and new players picking terran is higher than the rate of terran switching to other races or new players picking not terran then the terran population is increasing (or you know ppl quitting terran vs quitting zerg/toss).
How and why? Why we know it cant be true?
They do tho? Terran is leading every league besides masters and grandmasters and masters its only a very small difference (and very small pop and also terran has lead masters in history more often than they did not). Once again: terran is leading! they arent “stuck”. They LEAD other leagues too. Leading diamond by more than 2% and lagging in masters by less than 1%. This is a very very good result.
The only big difference between terran and the other races is that terran has a very very high representation in lower leagues, which is the direct and obvious conclusion of mere exposure effect; ppl start the game start with terran and you have 3 options. stay, get better, switch. (4 if you count quitting too). And due to this effect (resulting in terran flooding lower leagues) terran has on average a lower mmr.
Average is often not a solid measure because outliers affects it too much, and how you should treat outliers is pretty arbitrary. The problem is as said before that we can expect players choosing different races to be, on average, different in terms of characteristics or in other words, the race you choose is not random.
With this in mind, properties of statistical inference and distributions goes out of the window because the sample Isn’t random. Even if a result show clear statistical evidence, It’s irrelevant because the sample is biased. There is also more to balance than just winrate, if for example protoss is so bad that the only way to win with them is to use different types of cheese strats, they might have a 50% winrate, but no doubt the race is underpowered. Balance goes beyond just winrates, you have to take build diversity, micro intensity (hard to measure) into account for example.
Just wanted to add my thoughts to the discussion.
As for the topic itself, Maru is just so absurdly good that this final really show no evidence of the terran vs zerg balance. I think everyone would agree Maru is far more skilled than Ragnarok.
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