No, they would go and try mutations solo with pure ravagers. Cause 125 biomass means, not even double edged hurts you - not even a tinsy, tiny bit. DE returns full damage, but your units heal 125%, allowing all units to self heal against enemy damage even in the face of double edged.
I don’t know what else to tell you - P1 is blatantly almost broken powerful once you hit 125 biomass with a hand full of the right units. Just the biomass needed to get 6 UEs is almost enough to get 5 ravagers to 125 biomass. And those will be at least twice as powerful as 5 ravagers at 100 biomass, that i am certain of. If you can’t think of a way people might use that, then it’s due to a lack of imagination, not lack of prestige power.
Can you explain the thought process behind this? I mean, of course 5x125 > 5x100 but twice as much? Sounds like bs to me. It basically means that at least 5x125 Ravagers = 10x100 Ravagers.
Also, I haven’t tried it, so not sure, but shouldn’t Ravagers just die from their Corrosive bile if Double edged is active?
No, while I don’t think Zhadoom’s explanation a few posts above is accurate. How this works based on my experience and sc2coop:
The leech cancels out Double Edge. @100 biomass, leech is 100% of your damage, which equals the double edge full damage dealt back, this cancelling.
With 125biomass, you actually gain HP from mutator per attack but it isn’t super relevant because you already hit that threshold. The basic “more leech” gives more back applies here, so of course 125 would still be better.
If there’s some sort of quirk with Bile Damage then I have no idea. In that case ignore this lol.
Its calculated from base HP, if I remember right, its 120, so 100 biomass is 480 hp, 125 biomass is 570. Difference is 18,75 %.
You do realise that purpose of Ravagers is not self healing, but killing enemies?
Besides that, their autoattacks deal literally no damage compared to Corrosive biles.
What you described in your post has nothing to do with being more powerful its being more tanky, more durable. Power is DPS.
For sure, P0 Aba is better than P1 Aba in early/mid and late game. They don’t need to increase the drop rate of biomass to match with P0 Aba, they needs to do something like :
** Reduce max biomass to 80
** Biomass has +50% increased effect (for equivalent to 120 biomass at 80).
Corrosive bile deals less damage than ravagers have life. At 125 biomass units get 3% * 125 = 375% additional HP. So ravagers go from 145 HP (coop roach and ravager have 145HP, not 125) to 688 HP.
Corrosive bile deals 60 damage (+40 upgrade).
Without upgrade a ravager can take “Double Edged” damage from hitting 11 units with 1 bile. With upgrade its 6 units.
So i would recommand to not get the upgrade or, if you feel confident, make sure you don’t hit more than 6 targets at once…
That being said, if the ravager is attacking, it will be healing for 36HP / s. If each bile hits 5 targets, the resulting returned 300 damage will be completely healed by the ravagers leech in 8.3s. Less if you have some queens around.
UEs without symbionts are just tanks and their dps is pretty low… On the other hand, Raynors stimmed marines are not tanky at all, but they can melt any target in seconds, as their dps is among the best in game. I agree with Che in this one.
I agree with this but I think it also needs some context.
Abathur’s UE are just too good, I think anyone who knows how to use it (and especially uses it well) will understand this thoroughly.
So how would one change up his playstyle radically? I think to that point, the devs did a good job with P1 by removing UE. They didn’t remove them all from all 3 prestige, which is also a point to consider.
P2, they buffed the Swarm Hosts (which is another way, but if they did this similarly to P1, it would be rather repetitive). P3, well, we all know about that one so I’m not gonna rant on it .
Overall, I think Abathur’s prestige definitely have a good comprehensive coverage. P1 - remove UE, buff overall army potential. P2 - Boost SH, allow Deep Tunnel, retain UE as normal. P3 - Uncap UE, remove army potential via 1/2 biomass bonus. It honestly was very well designed imho. That said, as all things have a caveat lol, some of these numbers could use a tweak… I’m looking at you Limit-less .
But P1 does not really buff overall army - unless the game goes into 30++ minutes and there is infinite biomass on the map.
Its similar to the P3 for H&H - it actually makes weaker what it is supposed to make stronger.
UE not only make abathur army stronger but also feed them biomass quickly.
Without UE entire abathur army is much weaker because there is no fast income of biomass from 6 UE slaughtering everyone and tanking all the damage.
P1 abathur revolves around farming huge amounts of biomass - but without UE it actually sucks at quickly farming biomass.
Right now P1 needs so much time to farm up biomass to just become equal to default Abathur that the map is over before that happens.
That is probably the issue… to fix it, something like UE requires research at the Evolution Chamber (something like 400 minerals 300 gas, needs Lair) [for baseline Abathur… then remove the research requirement for P3]
I don’t think that’s THE issue or that it NEEDs fixing. I think it is perfectly fine that way, but if we are to go with the “remove UE buff biomass” then P1 needs a bit rethinking.
We can always go “Biomass is 2x effective and max biomass is 50 or 75, or any arbitrary number to keep it relatively similar while still achieving exactly the same results. With this particular example, you gain the “not enough biomass to start off issue”.
This is my biggest gripe with all of his prestige. Aba is the strongest speed running commander IMO and all of his prestige takes away from that, which is what makes him special and fun in the first place.
Was very disappointed to bust out 45 more levels only to find out the P0 is more fun / engaging / rewarding. Now it just feels like a long long buildup instead of instantly taking on the map.
The P3 is absurdly bad. Even on maps like oblivion express where I can abuse an ultralisk respawning and getting more biomass than any other map, it’s extremely hard to have two UEs out at the first train. Whereas I could have 3 Brutalisks and be sending a Levi at the first train instead with P0.
Waiting 15 minutes to reach a point where P3 exceeds P0 in UEs is not really beneficial. I’m sad about that.
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