A New Sc2 Community Balance Council

SC2 in the pro scene seems to be dying and I do not want it to end. Sure we can donate money but that would only be throwing money at the problem until not enough people are not willing to donate money. I haven’t been on here for awhile as I stopped caring at some point but the situation is different now. I hope my idea here will at least be heard by the appropriate channels.

Here’s how the new sc2 community balance council members should be elected according to my idea: First, we create a thread and all users in it are anonymous and can only post once there. Everyone can post their first ideas in their own respective single post for the game. Each of their post can be upvoted or/and downvoted. Then after an undisclosed time period set by Blizzard, the votes and thread are locked. Then Blizzard can decide how many council members they want. They will pick the ones with the most votes. If any of them decline becoming a member then the next one with the most votes are offered. There will be an undisclosed and universal time period when their term limit is up and a new democratic election to repeat the process all over the time. The first thread will be deleted at an undisclosed time to further minimize pattern recognition of who is who. This new council will discuss with each other while anonymous to each other. No council member is allowed to disclose who they are or what they’re discussing with. If they’re found breaking this rule, they’re stripped of their position without warning.

Overall, these are my intentions behind my idea:
-To protect the identities of who decide the balance.
-To make it as democratic as possible.

I may edit this post to further improve it as necessary based on what you all think of my idea.

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There’s an easier way to solve the balance issue. Funding is put into escrow and only released after the grandmaster equalizes to 33/33/33. Like magic, the balance counsel would finally discover what the word “balanced” actually means.

When you gain power of attorney over someone, you have to keep a log of all expenditures and submit them for review, and that’s to prevent someone from treating their Grandpa’s estate as a personal slush fund. You have to save receipts and enter descriptions for each payment. But, when competitors in tournaments get to affect the balance of a BILLION dollar game, that then affects their own odds to win tournaments, this doesn’t require AT A MINIMUM similar levels of scrutiny and third party review?

Bare minimum the names of everyone involved should be public & all their discussions should be public. How on Earth is it even legal for competitors in a video game to consult on the design of the video game they compete in. That is an OBVIOUS conflict of interest.

The balance of the game should be implemented through a neutral third party, similar to how escrow works. In the financial world, they are used to dealing with some of the most egregious bias & motivated reasoning known to man, because people will find all kinds of ways to try and justify why they deserve some money and other people don’t. Similar standards should be used to regulate the esports industry especially if the competitors are consulting on the very same game they play.

This is such an obvious and massive conflict of interest that frankly I think pro players should be banned from balance counsel. Whoever implemented this did not know how various industries solve similar problems, which is just a way to say that they had no clue what they were doing.

Put funding into escrow. You only get paid if you meet objective, quantifiable standards for balance, according to industry statistical methods. Add on fines. If you want to be on the counsel, you sign a contract that includes fines if targets aren’t met. If you succeed, escrow gets released and you get paid. If you don’t succeed, you get fined. It’s not hard. The problem is, it will delete protoss from the premier scene because f2 abusers are 5k players in disguise but protoss lets them cosplay as a pro player. Esports will never allow that to happen because it’s bad for viewership. So Blizzard has to make a choice – does the individual player matter, or does the finals of premiers tournaments matter? You can’t do both. Good luck finding anyone to watch the tournament when they’re playing other games and SC2 is memory-holed.

Being more specific. 5 grand is placed into escrow to be released if grandmaster stays within 33/33/33 +/- 2% for 6 months. If this is achieved, you are paid the 5 grand. In order to be on the counsel, you have to put 5 grand into escrow. If you fail to meet the target, you lose your money. Your 5 grand is added to the pot for the next balance team. You can retry as many times as you’d like, as long as you pay 5 grand each time.

The problem is that there is no risk. They see an opportunity to manipulate game design for their own personal benefit, and there is no risk to getting it wrong. Another problem is that most of these people are not smart people. Adding in a 5 grand escrow fee will weed out a lot of the dummies who aren’t smart enough to manage their finances to such a degree that they have that kind of discretionary cash. The current system is designed to attract dummies, who get to affect their own financial future, and to shield them from any and all review or criticism which is equivalent to a greenlight to be as abusive as you want to be. That’s what has to change here. The system has to be designed to filter out the dummies, create risk for failure, and reward for success, using objective and quantifiable metrics that are not subject to opinion or interpretation, and add on high levels of review and scrutiny.

This would be free money for most mathematicians and statisticians and computer scientists, by the way. They could balance this game in a heartbeat. It would be effortless and virtually risk free. You have all these high school dropouts who play video games all day, who can’t even define what “balanced” means, arguing like shrieking monkeys and it’s no wonder that they can’t solve anything.

If you can define what “balanced” means, it’s very easy to balance the game. Balanced means equal opportunity in grandmaster. Protoss have more access to grandmaster. Reduce the power level of the most commonly used units in protoss matchups in 5% increments until Grandmaster bobs up and down but achieves an average that is 33%. From there, identify units that create unstable outcomes, aka gambling mechanics, and nerf those. Identify stabilizing units, and buff those. Each time in 5% increments. Now the game is balanced, and stable. Congratulations, funds get released from escrow.

“But but what if nerfing unit A causes problem B in scenario C on map D in matchup E???” Well if it’s a problem it will affect Grandmaster representation and, if not, then it’s not a problem.

What does it look like currently? Would equal opportunity be based off unique accounts? Would it vary server to server? Or base the population off of Diamond and above? Would you be ok if 50% were toss and 50% toss in GM?

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Do you really want people on this forum to decide balance?..

LOL

Jokes aside, you can’t choose the balance council based on community voting, because most players are biased towards their own race

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I still remember “dreampool,” when the community was given the opportunity to vote for maps for the map pool, and it ended up being a disaster. IIRC, they had to change the map pool in the middle of the season because it was so bad.

It was a good case of showing that community concensus is not necessarily a sound way to make decisions for the game.

(Neither are perfectly balanced ratios for grandmaster league, by the way - trends of large discrepancies over time can be good indicators of the state of balance, but there will always be some variables outside of unit stats that will cause some imperfections in win ratios)

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Exactly, it’s way more complex than just representation.

This is what I was talking about when I said they can’t even define what Balanced means. BuT MuH SmUrFing. If toss has equal chances of promotion to gm, they will have the same number of smurfs. Take a class on statistics for crying out loud. The probability that just by chance all the smurfs happen to be protoss is so close to zero it is effectively zero. The only variable capable of clustering around protoss is protoss itself.

We better up the escrow requirements to be on the balance counsel to 20k. The game really cant survive another Neanderthal balance council. Being good at a video game DOES NOT translate to understanding video game design, NOT ONE BIT.

To jokingly answer your question, maybe not you LOL. In seriousness, do you have a better idea how to recruit people that are more likely to focus more on balance than money?

Maps are superficial compared to balance.

Bad idea, because that would assume everyone is equally skilled.

This is what I was talking about with people not knowing the basics of how to approach these issues. Introductory statistics:

In introductory statistics, the null hypothesis (often denoted as H₀) is a statement of no effect or no change. It typically represents the status quo or the widely accepted belief, which a researcher then attempts to disprove with data. Essentially, it’s the hypothesis that there’s no relationship between the variables being studied

The default assumption is that there is no association between Protoss and other variables. We use a hypothesis test to see if there are relationships between Protoss and other variables, like skill & performance:

In introductory statistics, a hypothesis test is a procedure used to determine if there’s enough evidence to reject a claim (null hypothesis) about a population parameter. It involves collecting data, analyzing it, and making a decision based on the results. The process helps researchers understand if observed differences in a sample are likely due to chance or if they suggest a real effect

In the case of Grandmaster, the hypothesis is that Protoss have higher performance that makes it more likely to get Grandmaster. We assume this is not true, that Protoss has equal odds to be GM as Terran and Zerg, and calculate the probability it can happen under this assumption, aka the H₀ hypothesis, using a binomial calculator:

https://i.imgur.com/gPbTMWk.png

There is a 99.999% chance that Protoss and increased performance are related. In science, 1 in 20 odds is considered significant. This is 1 in 171,824 odds. It is the definition of a sound statistical conclusion.

Now, what is the mechanism. Typical responses:

  1. “What if all the smurfs play Protoss?” → violates the H₀ hypothesis because you’re assuming there is a relation between Protoss and odds to smurf, even though the odds of that being true are 0.0006%.
  2. “What if the Protoss are more skilled?” → violates the H₀ hypothesis because you’re assuming there is a relation between skill and race selection, even though the odds of that being true are 0.0006%.

This alone is very strong evidence that Protoss, and Protoss alone, is the cause of increased performance, but we can do a hypothesis test that Protoss are more skilled. This one is a little more complicated. Instead of a binomial probability, we need a z-test:

  1. The R2 value between MMR and APM is 0.42, which means 42% of the MMR can be explained with APM. That leaves 58% of MMR unexplained. This tells us how much APM varies from performance on an individual basis. We want to know how many APM measurements have to be average together in order to shrink the 58% unexplained factors to 0%, using the central limit theorem, which is equivalent to saying the average APM perfectly predicts the average skill level of those in the group.
  2. The sampling variance formula is then s^2 = ∑(Xi - x̄) / (n - 1). This tells us the variance shrinks by n - 1. That means we can create an equation to calculate n:
s2 = 0.58/(n-1)
(we want a small s2 value, which I choose as 0.001)
0.001 = 0.58/(n - 1)
(solve for n)
0.001*(n - 1) = 0.58
n - 1 = 0.58 / 0.001
n = 0.58 / 0.001 + 1
n = 581
  1. This calculation shows that if we have a sample of >=581 players, the variability of non-APM factors will shrink to s2<=0.001, which is equivalent to saying they don’t impact the measurement.
  2. Grandmaster has 600 players. What is the average APM for each race in Grandmaster? The average for the past year was:
Race APM Avg
T 258
P 241
Z 322
Source: https://i.imgur.com/SEl0awm.png
  1. Since n=~600, these APM values perfectly correlate with performance. This definitely proves Protoss in GM are substantially worse than their Terran and Protoss counter parts.

Applying the Bradford-Hill criteria.

The Bradford-Hill criteria has some tools for double-checking that a relationship isn’t erroneous. Lets go through them:

  1. Strength of Association – A strong association between a factor and an outcome makes causality more likely. The correlation in this sample between MMR and APM is very close to 1. The association is strong. :ballot_box_with_check:
  2. Consistency – If different studies consistently show the same association, it strengthens the causal argument. Studies that look into this relationship have similar findings. For example: https://www.researchgate.net/publication/380467385_Starcraft_2_Performance_An_In-Depth_Look_At_In-Game_Telemetry_And_Player_Rank. These findings are consistent with other research. :ballot_box_with_check:
  3. Specificity – If a specific cause leads to a specific effect, it supports causality. How fast you play has a very obvious positive impact on performance in real-time games. :ballot_box_with_check:
  4. Temporality – The cause must occur before the effect (i.e., exposure must precede disease). How fast you play in a game obviously precedes the outcome of the game. :ballot_box_with_check:
  5. Biological Gradient (Dose-Response Relationship) – Higher exposure levels should generally result in a stronger effect. The correlation of 0.65 shows an obvious linear relationship between APM and MMR. :ballot_box_with_check:
  6. Plausibility – The relationship should make biological sense based on known mechanisms. It is very plausible that speed affects performance in real-time games. :ballot_box_with_check:
  7. Coherence – The association should not contradict existing knowledge of the disease or condition. Speed impacting performance does not contradict existing knowledge of how RTS games operate. Industry experts universally agree that speed is one of the biggest factors. :ballot_box_with_check:
  8. Experiment – If experimental evidence (such as clinical trials) supports the association, it strengthens the case for causality. Low-APM challenges on YouTube show 6.5k mmr pro players struggling to get 5k mmr. :ballot_box_with_check:
  9. Analogy – If similar factors are known to cause similar effects, it lends support to causation. We know that in chess having less time to think about your moves reduces the quality if the moves, such as in Blitz chess. :ballot_box_with_check:

This meets the Bradford-Hill criteria, which means there is definitely a negative relationship between skill and Protoss within the Grandmaster sample, meaning Grandmaster Protoss are reliably less skilled on average than Terrans or Zergs.

We have a positive correlation that shows Protoss have increased performance. We have a negative correlation showing Protoss have decreased skill. What hypothesis could possibly explain this other than that Protoss is imbalanced. Protoss is definitely imbalanced and the odds that this conclusion is wrong is <0.0006%. We can see with certainty that Protoss is overpowered.

The balance counsel, by contrast, is convinced that Protoss is underpowered. These people are utterly clueless and severely incompetent. They shouldn’t be allowed to manage a mcdonalds, let alone the design of a billion-dollar video game.

By the way, this analysis underestimates the confidence of these conclusions because we are measuring Grandmaster for a single day. The reality is that Protoss have dominated Grandmaster for years, and they’ve had reliably lower APM the entire time. If you calculated the true confidence, it would be somewhere in the ballpark of 99.9999999999999999999999999% probability that toss is busted. Add in how they dominate ESL cups, have had positive win-rates in the pro scene as recorded by Aligulac, etc, and the amount of evidence is truly insurmountable. It’s impossible to get this answer wrong, and the balance counsel managed to do it. Utterly incompetent doesn’t even begin to describe these people.

To solve this, the balance counsel members should be required to put $20,000 USD in escrow which they will not get back if they fail to balance the game. This solves the issue in two ways: one, it filters out dummies whose finances are a mess. Two, it provides a very strong incentive to not fail. If you aren’t willing to do this, then you shouldn’t be allowed to work on a billion dollar game’s design to affect million dollar tournaments.

Why on Earth these kinds of protections & incentives don’t exist blows my mind. Who is in charge of this sinking ship? We’re just going to let some randos who play video games all day long do whatever they want even when it obviously causes clear and cognizable harm to some of the players? :exploding_head:

There are more ways to measure this, by the way. We can compare how PvZ performance compares to PvP performance: https://imgur.com/R467oTT

Protoss with X PvP performance score X+30 in PvZ; zergs with X ZvZ performance score X-30 ZvP performance. Translation, Protoss universally have higher performance in PvZ than PvP, and the difference is equivalent to a 60% win-rate advantage.

You might say that 60% is pretty small. But, it drastically hurts Zerg players’ ability to win tournament money. Let’s say a zerg plays a single-elimination tournament vs 32 other players, and that all players are of equal skill. The odds that you win is 0.5^5=3%. If you reduce his winrate by 10%, his odds to win goes to: 0.4^5=1%. It slashes an individual Zerg’s ability to win tournaments by a factor of 3x. If this is true, Zergs should win the least tournament money (subtracting outliers):

https://imgur.com/ft3X26V

Expectedly, Protoss tournament winnings, after subtracting outliers, perfectly mirrors grandmaster representation. We’ve unified Grandmaster and Pro play under the same umbrella, we’ve shown in Protoss’ advantage can be measured in multiple ways. We’ve shown skill reinforces the theory that Protoss is advantaged because Protoss are less skilled according to skill metric measurements. What more do we need? The level of delusion surrounding SC2’s balance is equivalent to having your credit cards sent to collections BUT still believing you are a millionaire. The belief that Protoss is underpowered is absolutely, unequivocally, delusional.

I am actually interested in how it would be implemented and I had a few questions. No need to insult right off the bat. So maybe in good faith I try again. What population would it be based off of, to insure equal opportunity?

You can do it for the whole ladder population or a strata within the population as long as you can reliably shrink the impact of non balance factors to 0 within that sample. You use regression analysis to establish how large the sample has to be, within the strata, so that the average of that sample has a 1:1 correlation with the variable you intend to measure, which in this case is faction performance. You verify this is the case by doing a regression analysis of the averages, and it should show a very high R2 value.

You do this for multiple strata, multiple data sources, scale the measurements by dividing them by the standard deviation of the data, and combine the scores using Stouffer’s method to get a final scoring. Yes, you could include a measurement of premier finals as a strata within this computation.

Now that you have the answer, you would follow up with a monte carlo model to verify that you can replicate the data using these measurements. I’ve personally made it to this step because you can calculate factional differences in MMR inside Grandmaster, factional differences inside the pro scene, and use that to do a monte carlo model of EWC and calculate how much MMR would be needed to add to Protoss in order for them to beat serral, and each of these gives similar measurements.

It doesn’t much matter what strata you pick as long as you can verify that the average measurements have a 1:1 correlation with faction performance. The reason this won’t work with Serral is because, as established in the above post, you’d need ~600 people to get a near 1:1 correlation between average APM and average MMR. How do you plan to measure balance’s impact on premier finals with a sample size of 4 or 6 players? There’s way too much noise in that data and it’s very clear in the sampling variance equation as described here:

Using this equation, s2 = 0.58/(n-1), on premier finals, gives us s2 = 0.58/(4-1) a sampling variance of 0.19 which is a standard deviation of 0.44. You couldn’t tell the difference between an C-grade student and an A-grade student with that much variability. You and I both know there is a huge difference in performance between a person who gets an A in history vs a C in history, so if your sample can’t tell which one is the A student then it’s completely useless. Based on APM, you couldn’t tell which of these 4 contestants is the better player. Increase the size of the sample to 600 and the standard deviation would shrink to 0.03 which is 15x less variability. That could reliably tell you if the Protoss group is more skilled than the Zerg group. If you did that test on Grandmaster, it would say the Protoss group is less skilled.

Now, it’s important to keep in mind that this effect should be divided by two. It’s easy to visualize why that as. Suppose we hit Zerg with a buff vs Protoss and it causes 1 protoss to be dropped from GM and 1 zerg from masters to be bumped up into GM. The effect that this has on APM would be times two because you are removing a low APM player from the Protoss pool and adding a low APM player to the zerg pool. So the true difference in APM between Protoss and Zerg, within Grandmaster, is the difference divided by two. When zergs have 322 APM and Protoss have 241 that’s equivalent to 40.5 APM that has to be equalized to balance the game. This gives us a heuristic for measuring balance & defining how large of nerfs to do. You combine this heuristic with other heuristics, using Stouffer’s method, to get a more complete picture, and then you start nerfing and buffing until the heuristics indicate there is no difference between each race at a GM level.

Your choice of nerfs should be biased towards maximizing skill expression. If you have a choice between nerfing a “high skill” unit and a “low skill” unit, you choose the low skill; if you have a choice between buffing a “high skill” and a “low skill” unit, you buff the high skill unit. This in theory will allow Protoss the ability to win premiers, IF they have the skill to do so. That means as you nerf things, you nerf things that have low micro potential like archons, immortals, carriers, and so forth. Lets be real, protoss has a lot of options in that regard. You could even do a combination nerf, where you over-nerf a low skill unit by 1.25x, but you compensate with a 0.25x buff to a high skill unit.

These are the sorts of strategies that could balance the game, but the balance council can’t even figure out that serral is irrelevant to balance as per the sampling variance equation. You can also figure out the same with an IQR test or a Z-score outlier test. They are balancing the game without using a proper data set that actually allows you to measure balance. Using a heuristic that can’t tell the difference between a C score student and an A score student to figure out if an A-score Protoss needs buffs vs an A-score zerg is totally, completely, utterly, without question, useless.

What are the non-balance factors or really the balance factors that you are thinking of? And how are those measured?

Picking the right strata makes sense, we all know that Terran is overrepresented in Bronze and Silver. Did you see Korean protoss in GM vs NA, its pretty stark. Though the underlying leagues are similar in distribution below masters.

So you’d rather a poor decision-making method be used for important matters than for superficial ones?

Not to mention that maps do actually affect balance since different races and strategies benefit or suffer differently based on map features and design.

That’s the reason “dreampool” failed, because the community didn’t recognize how map design interacts with balance, so they didn’t anticipate older maps being terrible for the game which at that point had gone through a ton of additional balance changes for each race.

It’s a good point, I mean think if there was no ramp to the main base. SC1 doesn’t have this issue does it?

You want any variable that correlates with performance. Players seek to control variables that impact performance. Whatever skill is, it will maximize variables that impact performance and you can measure that everywhere from the number of supply blocks to the screen movements per minute to the number of hotkeys used to reaction latency (difference between the timing of an event, and the timing of the reaction to the event) to APM to EPM to Spending Quotient … and the list goes on.

To combine these metrics, you use linear regression. It works something like this. You calculate the correlation between each variable and MMR. Rank sort them from highest correlation to lowest. Subtract out the variability, from the data, that can be accounted for by the variable with the highest correlation. Recalculate the correlations against the new data set, for the remaining variables, and repeat until no variables are left. This gives you a linear equation that maps these variables to MMR.

If you do this on a per race basis, and you plot these lines using the average for these variables, as measured from a strata on the ladder, and the lines have a different Y intercept, it means one race achieves a higher performance level for the same skill level. It means for the average of known skill factors, one race achieves a higher average MMR. That’s what the test would show.

Oh, you can also throw mirror matchup MMR ratings into this scoring metric, because they the highest known correlation with true skill of any variable (even higher than APM).

That’s effectively what happens in this chart https://imgur.com/R467oTT but with only 1 variable aka mirror matchup ratings. Ideally you would combine all the other metrics into a compound heuristic, but the mirror matchup ratings in and of themselves are pretty conclusive.

Bronze, silver etc have additional challenges because there is definitely a selection bias – you can’t expect every race to be equally likely to be picked. That’s why it’s important to do the test I mentioned and see if you can get a reliable correlation between a skill metric and MMR for a given strata and, if you can’t, then it’s useless. In theory, if all factors known to impact the incidence for each race at each level could be accounted for, of which skill is only one, we could build a model that perfectly describes bronze and silver too. But those kinds of models are called monte carlo and/or poisson point processes, and they get crazy complicated. In the interest of simplicity, you’d use grandmaster and you’d use masters as a baseline to define what proportions you expect to be in grandmaster.

One thing worth noting is that, and this is a on a different point, even if there are more protoss smurfs in GM, which is highly unlikely, this would merely incentivize players to not smurf. If pro players know that the game is balanced on GM representation, and they know they inflate GM representation with their smurf accounts, they will stop smurfing. Stopping smurfing is a good thing, League for example considers smurfing a banable offense, and the byproduct is that Grandmaster’s accuracy for indicating balance would increase as a result of the decreased smurfing. There is nothing to lose here and everything to gain if the game were balanced around Grandmaster.

There’s inherent variability due to who plays how much and in what region. That’s why you use a compound metric that does worldwide GM instead of just one GM region. I calculated that for APM to be a good measure of skill you’d need ~600 players which means you’d need all three EU,KR,NA Gm leagues.

Protoss have consistently held positive win-rates at the pro level since 2021; their GM dominance goes back to 2017. The idea that maps have a significant impact on balance is absurd. In theory, the maps could, but in practice they don’t because the map design & filtration process filters out any maps that would be too unfair, which is equivalent to filtering out maps that affect balance. This means the game’s design controls balance, and not the map pool. EDIT: vetos also limit the map pool’s impact on balance.

This feels independent of the race/skill issue. Though the other match might be instructive. Do we think TvZ is balanced? Then you could compaer TvP and ZvP.

SC1 has arguably even more quirks affected by map design because of pathing. Specific angles and spacing for where buildings can be put and where units can walk have to be considered because otherwise a unit might be able to be wiggled through spaces you’d think it shouldn’t be able to get through, or a unit might dance around a ramp you think it should be able to get through easily. Rush distances are also super tight.

Lol “absurd”? So would your claim be that winrates are equal across all maps? Now, I would say unit stats do have more of an impact than maps, but there have been maps that were rotated out of the map pool, or not included in tournaments, because of balance.

Could the very fact maps have to be tested to check for things like rush distances, Liberator and Tank positions, Overlord pillar positions, Reaper entry points, Cannon rush locations, natural-to-3rd distance, main and natural ramp/choke sizes be because those things can affect… what’s the word… balance?

Dreampool was a failed experiment. I wonder if that could be because the maps the community picked were… hmm… imbalanced?

Yes, they limit the effect on raw winrates. Could that maybe be because people can veto maps that turn out to be a bit… wait for it… imbalanced?

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If the game were balanced, a protoss with X PvP elo would have X PvZ elo on average, but that’s not the case.

I personally think TvZ is fine. The difference between terran and zerg in grandmaster is small aka 5% (but remember, it’s divided by two so +/- 2.5%) and the gap between the two is going down over time. Protoss on the other hand is trending upwards and the gap between it and zerg is monstrous aka +/- 9.5%. If imbalance exists in TvZ, it is about 4x smaller than PvZ. So, not a big issue absolutely speaking, and not a big issue relatively speaking. The one caveat is Aligulac which has shown a hard swing to 58% in Terran’s favor, but, again, it contradicts GM. The contradiction is good, because it indicates variability in TvZ outcomes, and that indicates a balanced matchup because the variability peaks at a 50% win-rate so if the matchup is balanced we’d expect to see conflicts between data sources. Protoss trends are uniform across all known data sources, by contrast.

Yep. In both matchups, terran/zerg are incentivized to allin vs protoss. A good example of this in TvP is the SCV pull. There’s no point in leaving the SCVs at home because the moment your army leaves a warp prism flies in and warps in a bunch of zealots. If you pull the SCVs, the protoss is behind if he counter attacks your main (zealots aren’t participating in the fight) and the terran is benefited by the SCV’s contribution to the fight. Between the two options, pulling the SCVs is the obvious choice. SCV pulls have been a staple of TvP and high level terrans have been practically reliant on these builds to win at high levels for years now.

Zerg is likewise forced into allin positions because Protoss’ army strength is very high which means if you dedicate any supply to defending zealot runbys then you simply can’t win the main army engagement. If you have to choose between losing a base and losing your army, you choose losing a base almost every time. ZvP is about stalling and avoiding direct engagements while trying to mitigate counter attack damage and looking for a good engagement with the main army. 99% of engagements will end with the zerg being annihilated, and so it’s a game of extreme patience as you deal with endless counter attacks & look for the best main engagement that you can manage. It is technically an allin position, because your ability to hold bases goes down over time and so your ability to replenish your army goes down over time.

You are incentivized to trade here and now, because you have the income, but a direct engagement guarantees you are annihilated unless it’s absolutely perfect. The probability of getting a perfect engagement is very low without repeat-engagements, and that requires the game to longer, which puts you at odds vs your ability to hold bases. It’s obvious that no matter what zerg choose, he loses, but if he chooses to retain his army then there is a chance that in the future he might still get a good fight. If he chooses to fight now, he’s guaranteed to lose the base to the counter & to lose his army to the main fight. Stalling is the obvious choice.

The fundamental similarity between TvP and ZvP is the inability to win fights vs protoss deathballs. This makes defending economy impossible since you just don’t have the supply. This manifests differently depending on the matchup, since it causes SCV pulls in TvP meanwhile it causes stalling in ZvP. Terran would be forced into stalling as well except for the fact that they have timings capable of winning the game, while zerg has virtually no ability to allin thanks to a combination of creep spread and lack of tier 1 anti air.

I suppose maps might affect the meta more than balance. For example, there used to be so many ways reapers could jump into maps, tvt was 1 base two gas, two rax 1 fact hellion reaper every game.

Yes, it is absurd. If the map pool had a big impact on win-rates, Protoss wouldn’t be able to hold a positive win-rate for 39 of the last 40 seasons. If the map pool sometimes disfavored protoss, protoss would sometimes have a <50% win-rate, but that’s only happened once in the past 80 weeks of pro play. Either the community is consistently making the map pool favor protoss, or the map pool has no impact on balance.

The teamliquid map contest weeds out any egregiously imbalanced maps, and then players themselves veto the worst ones on top of that. It’s obvious that only the most balanced maps end up being the ones that are played on.

All these factors could impact balance if the veto system were changed and/or the teamliquid voting process were changed. As long as these features remain in effect, imbalanced maps contribute very little if anything at all to the win-rates.