Why did Illari also get a nerf?

General Discussion
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Who was complaining about Illari’s turret healing her? It makes absolutely no sense.

If you think it’s too strong at 40 on herself, why allow it on another teammate? Why specifically did you think it was a good idea to nerf pylon healing on the character who it belongs to and is her only source of an in-combat self-heal? What was the intention here? It has buffed healing on characters who can be tankier and deadlier but Illari has it being only half as effective? FOR WHAT? The explanation doesn’t even make sense:

IT’S HER ONLY IN-COMBAT SELF-HEAL, WHY WOULD YOU DISCOURAGE THE USE OF IT ON HERSELF??? I guess Illari is supposed to just give up and die when getting dove or flanked, the pylon already wasn’t keeping her up in the majority of those situations where she needed to use it on herself. Paired with the damage passive, the change is just so incredibly stupid.

Bap gets 180000 healthbar resets but god forbid Illari using a stationary Mercy jr. (which the original isn’t even valued for her healing as much as her utility) which is easily destroyed, in an emergency situation to not instantly die against characters who usually have more health, better defensive abilities, better mobility, and/or access to more damage (that they don’t have to charge).

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A skilled Illari can beat any Tracer.

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and a less skilled Tracer can beat any Illari and has a free full hp/positioning reset which already gave her a bigger advantage in the matchup because recall is faster and safer than pylon already was. Pylon already wasn’t saving Illari from Tracer, that’s Illari playing out of her mind and the Tracer being a worse player. Nerfing it in these situations was completely unnecessary because it was already weak in them.

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They seem very worried about her 1v1 dueling potential. I’m not convinced she deserves the reduction to self healing, particularly since she didn’t see a damage buff, but at the moment I’m inclined to believe she’s net buffed so I’m not too upset.

IDK. Patch notes as a whole seemed kind of weird in what they did address vs what went untouched. Happy with the D.Va buffs though.

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I think its mostly because of the healer passive on top of the turret

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What I find weird about it is: as far as I know, there’s no way to get the pylon to prioritise others over self, so now there’s this lingering feeling that in order to get the pylon working fully, I have to LoS it until it heals my allies. Which seems a little counter-intuitive.

If someone’s actually tested the pylon’s priorities and found that it targets allies first and foremost, please let me know.

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The pylon targets the hero with the lowest health % of their max.

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Ah, okay, that makes sense. Cheers.

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Okay. I wish I got an in-combat self-heal as Junkrat :skull:

It’s still useful on herself. It still heals her.

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Why buff turret at all? It’s the most boring and least skilled part of her kit. This does nothing to make her more fun to play. With all the downtime on her primary heals I find I get frustrated playing her and being unable to heal for too long a period.

They should have left turret alone and rebalanced her own healing - slightly lower HPS but more uptime.

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interesting i think the pylon is by far the most fun part of her kit. i wish she had 2 pylons and the pylon is still weaker than what it was on release.

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As someone who plays tf out of illari- they truly have the right idea in mind for once.

Illari and (and bap and kiriko who is APPARENTLY ignored about this) are designed in a way where they can be extremely duel effective in a super toxic way

It’s very proper for her self heal to be less effective for the same reason lucios is

Now whether or not 20 is too low is another question… I would’ve made it 25 probably. Maybe even left it at 30 and have her 40 for her team only.

Because of the dps passive being rebuffed recently that is.

However, buffing her pylon for her team without buffing it for herself is appropriate- as an illari player…

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Junkrat has access to multiple sources of aoe burst damage, two mines for more mobility than Illari’s boop, is a damage character so he doesn’t have as much responsibility as supports, and isn’t usually the prioritized target over his supports.

This change is like them nerfing him so only he deals less damage for someone in his trap, completely unnecessary and only hurts the character for no reason. But you would still be able to place it, right? other characters don’t even have the trap, right?

I agree but they did buff it but only for her team, they nerfed it for herself for some reason, meanwhile Sojourn got buffed… It makes no sense.

This logic would hold water if they nerfed it for everyone while taking damage but they didn’t, only Illari.

Illari is not extremely duel effective with a Mercy Jr. Idk how you came to that conclusion with the amount of damage, damage sources, and damage mitigation tools other characters have when dueling her, her charging gun, and weak turret. The fact that they made it more powerful for her teammates who can be or are even deadlier and/or tankier with their own mitigation tools to use on top of it, means it was just meant to hurt the character in situations it was already weak in for no good reason.

It’s not proper because she is way less mobile than Lucio so it is much easier to land shots on her. His self-healing can also be amped. He has better tools to get out of fights and better, more frequent displacement of enemies to put distance between each other. He also has a burst weapon that he doesn’t have to charge up. Lucio also doesn’t have to worry about someone dealing damage to a stationary target and gimping his healing output.

Your comparison is pretty dumb for obvious reasons. Illari isn’t skating on walls across the map. Lucio’s mobility (which Illari doesn’t have) makes up for his self-healing. 20 is blatantly too low, if anything they should have just kept it as 30 for her but they nerfed it for no good reason.

As an Illari player, this nerf was incredibly stupid and unwarranted especially given the Sojourn changes in the same patch.

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In unrelated news this fixes her for deathmatch :sweat_smile:

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The sojourn changes were absolutely moronic never disagreed there and I said they have the right IDEA not execution so… learn to read I guess

Like I said I’d buff her pylon to 40 and leave the self heal at 30 thanks to the dps passive existing

Absolutely would not buff her self heal to 40 as well- but! I wouldn’t be crying if they did either.

On the other hand, suzu and regen burst heal bap and kiriko WAY too much. And yes it IS the same reason lucio heals himself less. He has duel potential and with that it’s super unbalanced to let him also heal himself a lot mid duel.

The fabled elusive impossible to catch lucio that doesn’t do **** is not the good lucio that they balance around. The lucio they balance around is the one who can and will kill you. Not the fool who “dances on payload and is impossible to kill!” In bronze and silver ranks. Yeah his mobility is part of his duel potential but if he could not reliably duel as well they wouldn’t staunch his self heal. An example is Moira- she ain’t doing jack with all that self heal and mobility. Because she only wins duels against fools.

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This is just another specific rule given to an ability that the devs keep doing recently, its really bad game design imo

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Her heal is still only at 32hps for teammates who get tickled by the DPS passive. Only 16hps for herself. :expressionless:

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Kiriko and Bap’s heals are instant burst heals with baps also having a HoT and access to IF. Illari’s pylon is too slow to set up and actually start healing and too slow to heal even while set up to be make her oppressive in a duel. It numerically already did too little healing and too slowly for it to even be mentioned as making her have too much duel potential. This isn’t how I personally feel about it, It was numerically, objectively, already weak and that’s IF the person she was dueling didn’t take one moment to obliterate it in the fight.

Like I said, a huge reason Lucio’s self-heal is on the weak end is because he doesn’t need it due to his mobility being high and constant. It’s the same reason they gave Tracer less hp, because her mobility makes up for her not having a bunch of hp at any given moment. Lucio’s gun alone isn’t outstanding, it’s mobility that helps him out greatly and allows him to get out of hairy situations. Just because a support has the potential to kill someone does not automatically mean they have amazing dueling potential or that they should also have a useless damage mitigation mid-combat, especially given the multiple invulnerabilities, damage mitigation tools, area denial, and mobility in the damage role.

HE CAN RELIABLY DUEL BECAUSE OF HIS MOBILITY. The lucio who is hard to hit IS the one killing people, Good lucios are not skating primarily on the ground and rarely using walls, what are you talking about??? Illari does not have comparable mobility to Lucio, You justifying the nerf by comparing her to a character who is constantly highly mobile is what makes no sense.

Them nerfing Lucio’s self-heal would be the same issue, it’s already not that strong, it would only hurt the character unnecessarily. Just like Illari’s nerf does not address a problem area. It only hurts the character in situations with an ability that was already weak in those situations.

That’s what i’m saying, why? If the buff is too oppressive for Illari, why tf can Sojourn, Tracer, or tanks still benefit from it, characters who are way scarier?? It makes no sense.

They could have just had it heal her the same but buff it for teammates yet they went out of their way to nerf it as a personal middle finger to Illari, herself.

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It’s more of a forced playstyle adjustment. The optimal way of playing Illari right now is off like a solo DPS taking flank angles, putting your pylon down to heal only you, and spamming the enemy with poke damage

This makes that less effective and encourages you to be around your teal using it to heal them not just yourself

I’m all for it

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The main problem is that they probably went a little too far. 40 healing is too much and 20 isn’t enough.

This will be really effective for low elo Illari’s who were already pushing main, but high end Illari players will be much less effective trying to stick with the team and are going to get targeted since it halves the effectiveness of her Pylon. I don’t see 16 HPS being that big of a deal to burst through.

1 Like