What will players want after 2-2-2 fails

General Discussion
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Forums in a nutshell :upside_down_face:

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Toxicity is not reduced since people will be demanding others play the heroes they think are best for the map/meta/enemy. DPS one-tricks aren’t going anywhere and will still be in your games and frustrate you by “not killing anything”.

“Oh but they will drop to bronze!” Yeah, they should have dropped with the current system too, but somehow didn’t and are present in every single rank. Do you really think they’re all secretly Mercy mains who decided to go DPS in comp for a change?

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They can be equally good at both heroes. The current DPS might be both Pharah mains with no skill on snipers.

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and you don’t know how to read if you did youd see I said:

I never said others cant meet the win condition, I framed that win you play to when you pick the role that BEST MEETS THE WIN CONDITION

Why would I trust anyone in a solo que environment, where people don’t know how to play like a team would in a team environment. Take it from a GM player, the best way to climb, is to figure out how to get the most value from your hero in spite of your team, so when they cant pull their weight, you still get value.

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Bold claim. Care to prove it? Because my firsthand experience with the new system has so far proven the opposite.

I know that DPS one-tricks will still be around. The difference is that one-tricking no longer causes problems for your teammates.

My DPS teammate only plays Widowmaker. So what? My team still has two tanks, and two healers. It’s a non-issue.

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Or which side of the map you’re going to be on. I don’t use the same hero for attack and defense, especially on a map like Hanamura. On Quickplay i do, but that’s because i’m trying out different things with the heros and how well they can actually work.

Rather than 2-2-2 just have it 1-1-1. You can’t switch out of tank if you’re the only tank. When i pick Orisa, i don’t mind if there’s 4 DPS as long as there’s atleast 1 healer, even if it’s a Zen, that’s not uncommon in Quickplay. If someone wants to go Roadhog later on, that’s cool. If we’re being dominated by a Doomfist or Wrecking ball, by that point someone’s already switched to Roadhog so i can switch to Sombra and stop them. Orisa is my main, but i know her enough to recognize when she loses value, especially when dealing with fast enemies that go through shields.

Just 1-1-1 will do, atleast in QP, you can pull off solo tanking in that mode.

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Ok, whatever. You just heave to learn how to adapt to the map within your role from now on. A small sacrifice to be had.

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Just leave QP out of this discussion, please. Classic QP will still be in the Arcade.

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Well then you don’t know what the hell you’re talking about.

Besides Shanghai Dragons, LA Valiant, Houston Outlaws, LA Gladiators, Guangzhou Charge, Chengdu Hunters, Florida Mayhem are all teams that prefered to play DPS heavy lineups to Goats lately.

Additionally, NYXL, Vancouver Titans, San Francisco Shock, and Seoul Dynasty all played some Goats and some other compositions. Seoul and NYXL played some DPS comps, Vancouver Titans played a lot of their own take on dive, San Francisco Shock played a decent bit of quad tank and Orisa Hog.

Only some of the weaker teams this stage stuck to only playing Goats.

Just watch the playoffs for stage 3 and tell me if you only see Goats or a ton of other compositions too.

And once you know that, everything else you said is based on a false premise.

My ass. Even saying that 10% of games in quickplay are 2-2-2 vs 2-2-2 is a big stretch, it’s definitely not most games.

That’s interesting, I haven’t heard it, I’ll have to look it up. You do have to recognize that the OWL casters don’t have much to do with game development though. Sure, they know a few things ahead of time, but they don’t know many reasons behind development changes, and they have no say in game development. They’re just… casters.

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Then put that mode into Arcade instead and let QP stay at it is on the main screen. The ones that want locked 2-2-2 can go to Competitive.

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Your personal and anecdotes are not an argument. Give it 2 months and a few games of Symm and Torb duos.

Widows get harrased even without 222. As you put it yourself “it’s my firsthand experience”.

A friend of mine got harrased for playing Sombra because they decided “we didn’t need a Sombra”. Hammond started throwing by piledriving the point alone. The comp was 222.

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Well I do. I very much mind it. Playing tank without two healers is a chore and playing with Zenyatta as your only healer is pure torture. Even playing Orisa in that scenario is super hard, but playing a Winston or Reinhardt is just a nightmare.

1-1-1 just forces tank players to keep playing tank while no one backs them up, and supports to keep playing support while 5 players on the enemy team are hard focusing them (because any opponent that isn’t a potato will recognize that taking out a solo zen as support is a super easy way to straight up win the game).

It doesn’t fix… anything.

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EVOLUTION

Now in theaters in Japan.

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Idk, a game worth playing?

Oh shoot, classic wow is coming out in a month. :eyes:

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every hero to be viable in every situation and in every comp.

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Then good thing that this is what usually happens when i pick Orisa even when i didn’t instalock her.

But seriously, even if there’s a Zen, it can still work, i just move slower and set the pace more carefully. Luckily, the easier healers usually get picked, so you’re more likely to get Moira, Ana or Mercy.

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If you want to talk about bad balance pigeon holing you into certain roles lol . . .

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That happens, and it’s super nice when it does, but you can’t deny there’s too many games - especially in quick play - where you pick a tank, and 4-5 people on your team just pick DPS. You ask “any chance to get a support” and there’s just silence from your team. :man_shrugging:

But what’s the downside you see with a 2-2-2? You’ll have two supports and another tank in every game you play, isn’t that better than having to hope your team has players who are willing to switch to supports?

And what if you really wanted to play Mei in that game you linked? You’d probably end up with a 5 or 6 DPS team judging from how things were shaping up, now you’ll actually be able to play a DPS in a balanced composition when you want to.

There’s so many upsides and so few downsides. :man_shrugging:

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Everything else you said is irrelevant because I don’t agree with you on this base premisse.

IMO, going with a hero that you know how to play is a better way to ensure victory than looking for role distribution.

Yes, this sometimes includes the odd game where you have 3 tanks or 4 healers or 5 DPS.

Because unlike many other games (especially MOBAs), each hero in OW is kinda unique on the way they should be played. Ashe isn’t “McCree with a scope”, Baptiste isn’t “Ana with grenades”, and Winston isn’t “Reinhardt with a spherical barrier”. Your proficiency on a specif hero is more relevant to your team chances than you being the second or fourth DPS.

Sure, I would advise everyone to get proficient with a hero pool as diverse as possible, so that you would have a large array of options to swap in case something else on your toolbox is more appropriate for the situation. But if you only know how to play Genji, Doomfist and Junkrat, swapping into a bad Widow to counter Pharah will not help, while sticking with your previous option means you could help with the ground fight while seeking cover from Pharah.

Pro teams and ladder premades are different, and there you might start worrying about composition a bit more. If you are always playing with the same 5 teammates, it’s worthy training a specific hero to complement the rest of the team. But that assumes you are a team (of pros or friends), so there is more going on than any encounter with randoms on the matchmaking.

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Skimming thru OWL vods RN
LA vs Spark GOATS
HO vs VT GOATS
SHANGHAI vs NY GOATS
DF VS SPARK GOATS
SH VS VALIANT GOATS

Seems pretty much nothing but GOATS to me but I don’t follow OWL, like an ever increasing portion of their viewerbase so I could be wrong.

A large chunk of the games I play in are either 2.2.2 or start in 2.2.2 initially. These are Master to GM level games. Where do you rank because it seems to me if this feature has benefit it’s only to 3 things

  1. OWL viewership
    2.Low level games where every game is 6 dps
    3.High level comp games where getting 3-4 supports/tanks on one team is equal to a loss

Sure seemed to be doing damage control for them though.

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