Certainly a lack of punishment is part of that, but healing output is frankly absurd and multiplies when you have highly defensive heroes that have some kind of self-heal or damage absorption/reduction skill.
A comp backed by Ana/Moira/Baptiste (pick 2) has a tremendous amount of directly applied healing, almost double what launch Overwatch was capable of without using ultimates. Mercy/Zen was only good for 80 HPS single target and Moira can do that by herself.
Agreed. I don’t think two tanks were the big issue as much as no shield limit. If we had 1) limited to one shield tank per match and 2) cut healing across the board I don’t think 5 v 5 nor this whole “DPS move” would have been necessary in the least.
It wouldn’t change the problem that no one will play tanks. Limiting the shield tanks only would drive more tanks away anyways.
At this point, it’s better for blizz to drive away the tanks completely to replace them with players who’ll play fat DPS. Cause that’s what the tanks are going to be, fat DPS.
And yes, tank are still very capable of killing things despite what people like to believe. Even Super was capable of killing DPS that are caught alone and will win most of the engagement. Them melting like butter is also ignoring the fact that it took enemy tanks + dps and support (I.E, the whole team.) to burn tanks that overextend.
I don’t know why people think this, half the tank players do not want to be a shield tank… but for some reason it seems there is the attitude that most do… when nothing could be further from the truth.
From what I seen, a fair amount of tank players do enjoy using shield to take, hold and push for space.
Really good post that explains why I’m worried about the zarya changes. As a Zarya main since day 1 I thought the bubble 2x charge rather than separate cool downs felt horrible and broke my main. She’s so well designed and doesn’t need the ability to bubble herself or others twice in quick succession IMO.
Counting the individual cool downs is really important to surviving as zarya, you know exactly when you can be aggressive and save yourself with a bubble. Same for if a teammate is near you can know when you can protect them, or use them as cover if they are in front of you.
Even with playing it more I don’t see how I can do that when I don’t know exactly when my next bubble is ready.
Also aren’t we supposed to be buffing tanks survivability, not reducing it with longer cool downs?
I would revert the zarya changes to the bubbles, giver her up to 100 temporary shield extra based on her weapon charge, and give her a mobility mechanic to not be so immobile in the new 5v5 world.
Remember she has lost her main source of reliable charge, her main tank. All fire will also be on her pushing to make space.
I find it very hard to believe that support healing would be an issue with buffed offenses and supports being more vulnerable. Remember devs, balance around OWL 
and not gold… which is where you’re at on a good day.
No healing nerfs, and no healing ultimanium either: Take lower heals across the board, or crappy heals during team fights. <---- that’s messed up.
Let the OWL players play the game with no nerfed healing.
Many do it because the teams demand a shield more often than not. As someone who does all three roles for years on end now, I can tell you that many tank players would just assume not be burdened with a shield.
Smart or not isn’t the issue
He’s definitely not someone who has a history of being able to separate out his personal bias from his perspective or judgement
I remember him ranting in shock comms during the height of sombra-goats about how broken sombra was and how “everybody knew it”.
It… clearly… had nothing to do with the fact that shock did not have a strong sombra player and were at a disadvantage against teams that did.
I believe Super is correct and on point here - especially about the cup. It looks horrible to drink from.
With regard to OW2 - there was nothing he said that was wrong. Sombra is completely broken in OW2 and anyone that thinks she’s not - is a sombra one trick that will never see T2 in their existence on this game. When Sombra can one clip a rein - the ONLY TANK in the team, it’s broken. She is not a tank shredder. She was never meant to be a tank shredder.
Currently there is a “dev team” who knows next to nothing about the heroes and the balance changes the game has undergone in 5 years and they are shooting in the dark with things - which is why OWL players are testing things right now for them.
I can say this with certainty: If they continue to implement changes like the ones they put forth for Sombra and allow them to go live - this game will be dead in the water instantly because nobody wants to play a game where 1. It’s not fun, 2. It’s insanely unbalanced and 3. Where there’s only 1 tank where there used to be 2.
Welcome to reality - but if the rose colored fantasy world “feels” better…by all means…live it. Just don’t blame anyone when you end up uninstalling from tilt once OW2 drops.
is super discovering the state of ow2 6 months after some of us did ? saw that issue back to the first stream of devs 5v5, we talked about it, and nothing has changed, well now i guess things will change now if owl tank talk about it
Did you get to play OW2 6 months prior to Super?
we saw the devs stream about it like everyone else, we saw the state of damage heroes, you don’t need to play it to see it
You actually do need to “play” it in order to feel it out. There’s no way you can watch a dev stream - most of who are plat or below - and determine whether the game is unbalanced or not. That is not only unrealistic, it’s absurd. That’s like buying a car without test driving it just because you saw an ad for it.
I mean… You don’t get to being one of the best in the world at something without pretty good intelligence 
you see the tank health bar drop fast which is the only thing i’m refering about right now, saying you need to play it to know it is like saying you need to be a marine vet to shoot a standing still elephant inside a corridor.
I am a high t500 main tank, currently rank 19 on this account - later today, top 10 if I play. If a sombra is able to one clip me, I’d need to play the actual game to see if I am able to counter or counter react to stop it from happening. There is no tank in the world that can judge his or her ability to do that without actually playing the game. A “dev” will not be able to demonstrate this because they are not one of the best tanks in the entire world - like Super is. And a viewer like you, won’t either - not by a long shot - not even sporting a t500 icon with a private profile where I cannot see you on the leaderboards for console at the moment.
If you are choosing not to play OW2 based on only what you’ve “seen” in a dev stream, you are robbing yourself and using that as an excuse rather than attempting and failing like the real t500 would.
ah yes the sr argument… please go ahead, demonstrate us how it’s relevant to making a valid opinions or not
anyway you’re saying that to make yourself an opinion you need to play the game, regarding counter play positionning etc… that’s fair, but it’s out of the subject, i’m talking about how fast tank’s healthbar drop to 0, THAT’S LITTERALLY IT, and i see little difference with how things went 6 months ago, doesn’t take an owl player to shoot a character 3 times the size of any dps.
nobody said anything about not playing ow2 btw.
SR is a very valid argument here because the higher the SR, the more knowledge someone has about the game. And in this case, if Sombra can one clip a Rein without thinking twice about it - no low elo Tank player is going to be able to test their ability to counter it.
Sombra is broken in OW2 currently and that’s why the devs are having the best players in the world test it out - instead of random diamond or below players.
There is a reason for these things. It’s not meant to be insulting. It’s meant to be tested by ppl who are actually good at this game.
if you dont use the tools correctly, you’re not a very good judge of the tool. simple as it is.