Unwinnable matches are unwinnable by design

Games are won and lost by early ult economy. It becomes quite hard to make up an early lead - so yes, “unwinnable” matches are by design.

Games are won or lost by basicly anything :slight_smile:

You can easily lose first point just because someone was too long in bathroom and not defending on point.

Or hanzo has lucky kill on mercy, rein dies, mercy cant res…

I once lost match because i said “can you stop charging like crazy?” to our rein. He started throwing.

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This exact thing is why I stopped making those types of comment/requests of people, especially when playing on US servers. Those in the Americas have an especially negative reaction when told what to do, even if you’re just trying to help or just making a suggestion and trying to be nice about it.

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Yeah, i honestly blame myself anyway, i didnt have to say it. Its the way how i said it. Its wasnt usual reaction tho. Usualy when i say something like that, people do no just throw lol.

Few days ago i had lucio who started throwing after i told him that he can switch support too to help with pharah after he was complaining about the dps not killing her.

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That’s precisely how Overwatch’s financial model works, among other things, and is chiefly what I’m arguing against. A person shouldn’t need a new account to force their rigged system to acknowledge their merits.

The problem actually becomes apparent for the very reason one would need to purchase a new account. And evidence shows many players who have switched accounts have seen overall improvements to their MMR placements. This should not be.

This. I’ve experienced similar things as well, such as when playing Zen but choosing Ana or Bap instead because it’s what I think would work best, when instead the teammates I’ve been given seem to have strengths that benefit my stronger plays as Zenyatta. I completely agree!

Sometimes it’s hard to know why you’re in a game, because the reason you’re paired specifically with others with certain strengths is unknown. Though, imho I don’t really think this should matter as everyone will have some bias towards one character and one particular playstyle. So I think it shouldn’t be a factor when creating matches.

Nonetheless I believe this applies to the current system. :slightly_smiling_face:

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Strictly speaking, all matches are winnable/losable. However they are also handicapped with Match Making Rating. More information:

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I’ve not seen other posts of yours, but I agree with Porkypine here. It’s just not respectful to those new players to post a replay of their struggles for all to see.

I’m not even gonna touch the matchmaker argument. But we have to do better in this community at welcoming and helping new players. A long wait for OW2 makes this even more imperative.

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Well to be honest he said that he hard carried, thats not exactly description of “struggle” dont you think ? .)

I feel like you’re latching on to the wrong part of his post. It isn’t about someone’s supposed ability to carry. The point isn’t about OP and his skills. It’s about an issue we have with regard to the placement of new players.

You getting the replay to shoot holes in OP’s gameplay isn’t relevant to the conversation at hand.

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I already explained previously that that wasnt my intention. I was just curious to see tha match.

Yeah I agree it is the issue.

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That Scott Mercer sentence is the dumbest rule/algorithm ever invented in the competitive games history. Imagine NBA teams formed up for 50/50 win chances or any other sport. Nope just nope you got to let the teams form randomly unless paid like in OWL.

  • lucky ults etc. play too much deciding this, smurfs, alt accounts etc. => just leave it be.
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100% backed. I used the Olympics as an example, and another tried using MMA weight classes to disprove it. Only that further solidifies any argument against the algorithm as it forces players to play/punch above or below their “weight class”.

The NBA and any other professional sports would laugh at the idea of handicapped matches as the norm.

It’s not that matches are designed to be winnable or unwinnable, however any such design would be wrong. It’s that due to the amount of handicap, win/loss streaks become inevitable as player skill peaks or plateaus by being paired with stronger or weaker teammates.

It’s really like pairing an NFL MVP on a team of high school football players, against a team of college level players. The MVP is on an astronomically different level than anyone else, but that he’s up against somewhat competent teammates that they alone can singlehandedly counteract any, if not most, efforts made by the NFL player.

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Observation, you may find interesting / relevant.

Watching Yeatle on Dva in gold. Loses the game as enemy Hammond stalling all day long and the dps are playing Widow and Genji.

He’s locked into Dva as it’s his Dva unranked to gm stream, and neither dps switches. That leaves the team with Zarya, who’s pretty low energy most of the match, to try and kill him…

There’s Helluva lot of luck in matchmaker, where even a player 2k below his usual sr, can lose.

As he says, just play enough matches, the luck will balance out and you’ll get where you belong, eventually…

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And skill of players is often not reason to lose. It might be just very poor team comp as you explained :slight_smile:

So yeah, its game of luck at certain level :slight_smile:

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MMR/handicapping removes the component of luck.

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No, luck is part of matchmaking.

Placing a 2700 player in the same game as a 1900 player isn’t luck.

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I didnt say it is luck. You know what is luck?

Two teams with one lvl 25, both exactly same MMR, one is diamond smurf. Second one is new player. Getting smurf on your team is luck.

That has nothing to with luck because enemy team most likely have higher ranked too. You have to create different situation to talk about luck.

Also luck for who? For silver or for plat?

Higher ranked Tank = / = Higher Ranked DPS

I think one problem many have is they THINK ranks are equivalent when they aren’t. The problem with this system is it just throws people in willy nilly. Lets see a plat DPS and plat Support. Meh same thing HAVE AT IT!

TO me that’s one of the major flaws with matchmaking. It needs to make it EQUAL if it really is trying to make it EQUAL. If I have a 2 gold DPS on my team then the enemy team better have a 2 gold DPS or the game is already unbalanced. As we know, this doesn’t happen therefore the system is already wrong.

So what? You wery well know that meta shifts several times per year. Just because higher ranked dps is weaker vs tank in comparison, next week can be different.

Just recently was support role considered strongest, probably still is.