Unpopular Opinion: Forcing 2/2/2 is dumb

It’s a team game, so balancing comes from each Hero and then the possible synergy between them. But 2/2/2 is the default setting and it can be further customized depending on the team’s personal strengths.

Like, 3 tanks/2 healers/1 dps might work. Or 1 tank/2 healers/3 dps. It all depends on the enemy comp. The enemy comp and personal strengths determines what your team comp should be. Not a 2/2/2 golden rule.

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I am agree that force 2-2-2 isn’t a wise thing to do, I think people will leave.

But a third hero hero lock can work for example,
when the other class isn’t picked, when you are not in a 6 stack :slight_smile:

Literally every other comp works with 2Flex-2-2, besides 3-4DPS comps.

And let’s say 2Flex-2-2 was mandatory, it really shouldn’t be that hard to get 3 votes to unlock for 3-4DPS.

  • One person who wants to go third DPS
  • One person who is okay with either soloHeals or soloTank
  • One more teammate

Like I said above, if you can’t even coordinate and cooperate at that level, then you have no reason to be running soloHeal/soloTank comps that require better coordination/cooperation.

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If we’re pursuing a voting system, I would rather have hero bans. Hero bans are a way to solve the meta, whereas 2-2-2 locking doesn’t. It allows people to GOATS/TT, whereas hero bans specifically disable comps people don’t want to play against.

I swear every single time someone says “unpopular opinion” they go on to state a popular opinion.

I think 2-2-2 is being suggested to make the game more fair. As you move higher in the ranks the team with a 2-2-2 comp will usually beat the 4-5 dps team. Not always as I have won with 5 dps but more often than not it fails. I like GreyFalcon’s idea of 2flex-2tanks-2healers. That way you can still get a Goats comp but I think you’ll see 2-2-2 used a lot more.

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I don’t see role queue or 2/2/2 as balancing tools at all. Those wacky comps are more often than not completely impotent 5 dps and one off healer, than something like goats. Reason for that lies in some of the decisions in the game’s structure, not in the balancing.

Band-aid is a good term, because I would use it to describe any hero balancing undertakes, as opposed to systemic changes of contradictory elements.

He is by no means terrible against a comp with a Zarya in it.
Please, if you don’t know a hero don’t try to explain how they work.

-I would like to see a good composition with no healers and tanks. Considering how popularity discrepancy when it comes to roles is the major problem in the game, that would be the most essential thing to bring up to yours “almost everything can work”. Because, all dps comps or at least 5-1 comps should work for that to actually help with the situation.

-People are narrow minded - or they simply don’t give a fck and there are no systems in place to make them give a fck?

-so, either people don’t know how to play the compositions/heroes or the enemy comp is countering your comp? Cool, so learn every hero? And then somehow, by magic, get willing teammates to form a working composition?

-your last sentence… everyone knows that. That’s precisely why the game has issues and why people are suggesting role queue. I don’t really know what you wanted to accomplish with that statement, because that right there, the “point of OW” has undeniably failed completely and utterly and it couldn’t have been different with contradictory design decisions in place.
A non-ideal video game is better than an inherently dysfunctional one.
“but this would ruin the spirit of the game” - what game? This functioning non-frustrating smooth multiplayer experience we are playing? That game?

As said before 2-2-2 is too restrictive. I’d be fine with 1-1-1 3 flex and a 3 max cap on any given role.

Hero bans are good.
But Hero bans are inappropriate for all but the top 5% of the playerbase

Then you should actually be pro 2/2/2 role queue.
Everyone can play their desired role EVERY game without completely breaking the team comp.

I think that hero bans in lower tiers would actually help to balance the game.
They could ban oppressive heroes like Bastion and Reaper until they reach a rank where people actually cooperate to take them down.

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Which are historically the best niche counters to a tank meta. This is a terrible idea.

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I agree. I rather have a team that plays triple DPS with one tank and 2 healers, a triple tank comp, or if possible a triple dps or triple tank with a single healer.
Believing 2/2/2 wins the game it’s a misconception that you hear in bronze/silver.

About the heroes that needs a buff, it’s quite tricky: Pharah is an hero that needs aim (prediction mostly), but buffing her too much would mean more PharMercy comp; forget about Spamrat, we don’t need another hell like the period S6-S8; Doomfist needs something to be good but not too opressive IMO; Sym could get something (like a better tickrate for the primary fire)

And 2-2-2 comps won’t negate the toxicity and matchmaking problems in/around gold.

If you want 2-2-2 for lower elos, and hero ban in higher elos, then sure, but the 2 should never be used at the same time. (primarily because I want nothing to do with role que)

If you can’t get 3 people to agree to run a soloTank/soloHeal comp, then you wouldn’t be able to properly coordinate against an optimally run GOATs comp in the first place.

So that argument you got there doesn’t make any sense.

Optimal goats requires significantly more coordination than 3DPS, usually much more than most elos have. At most ranks 3DPS will roll goats unless you get lucky with two offtank mains.

Also, unpopular opinion: if you can’t get 3 people to agree you shouldn’t be on the same team.

You automatically have less toxicity with:

  1. A Role Queue preventing the need to argue with each other for dibs on a Role.
  2. You could have a slacker DPS/Tank/Healer, but your other DPS/Tank/Healer could pick up their slack.
  3. A Flex role player could pick up the slack for two offtanks, or a DPS focused healer.
  4. Offtanks(including Mei) or a Zenyatta could pick up the slack on Damage.

And if all that fails
5. Vote to unlock roles
6. Do a Role Swap with a teammate.

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I know I’m nitpicking, but this is quite literally the argument people made when Hero limits were introduced. Just cause wacky comps might be fun to goof around with, doesn’t mean its good to balance around.

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Honestly idk if 2/2/2 is forced or it’s a wacky comp, I just wanna be done with freaking G.O.A.Ts and variations