These "revert Mercy" threads are funny


#51

But one side is a lot more vocal sadly…

I just want the revert Mercy brigade to disappear, I don’t care how. Then we can finally have a proper conversation about Mercy without being drowned out by stupidity.


#52

No pistol? No wonder why everyone thinks Mercy takes no mechanical skill.


#53

I’m not sure if it was that her kit was always boring. She had immediate gradification when ulting. Once it was done, you could see the impact. She could never stop moving if you wanted. Also resurrect resetting GA was a lot of fun.

The reason Mercy 2.0 feels worse is because how E Resurrect feels to use compared to how it used to flow (which obviously was OP with her initial rework). It turns her into a statue that is a free kill if you’re not careful, and that just doesn’t feel good and feels more like a chore to use than an actual ability. Also, her healing still felt nice, but with the nerf, even that feels bad too.

Valkyrie brought A LOT that was removed and I think that is a large part of the bore factor. Players were introduced with so many things that slowly kept getting removed until almost nothing of the original Valkyrie existed. That is understandable as it was OP and all. But it was a taste of power we shouldn’t have felt before it was working as intended.

Mercy was all about constant movement and great consistent healing, which she still has. But not nearly to the same extent outside of Valkyrie. Valkyrie also has the potential to bring a lot of power, but due to how long it lasts, it doesn’t feel that way. If it had like an 8s timer and much stronger beams, I’m sure it would feel a lot more fun as it is more immediately gratifying.

That is the difference between Mercy 1.0 and 2.0. 1.0 has immediate gratification through her stronger single-target heals and ultimate.

Mercy 2.0 has a lot of drawn out power that doesn’t feel strong anywhere. Even if it really is strong everywhere.

Edit: random thought. Heroes need to have a sense of urgency or immediate reaction that is noticeable. Mercy is currently the only hero in the game that doesn’t not have any form of immediate urgency outside of survival.

Rein has earth shatter, Zarya has grav, Tracer has her blinks, Genji has his blade, McCree has flash bang, Brig has shield bash and whip, Lucio has his boops, crossfade, and his ult, etc. EVERY hero has a form of immediate gratification and/or urgency or power play. Mercy doesn’t. Everything she has is slow and doesn’t appear to show impact. EVERY SINGLE HERO in this game has a visual and obvious impact. Mercy is the only hero that doesn’t. Granted, some heroes like Sombra have drawbacks to their urgency just like Mercy, but not to the same extreme. Sombra’s ultimate also visually shows impact when you shut down an entire team and you get a kill on that Zen and your team wipes the enemy. It’s all about immediate gratification. That is what makes heroes fun, which Mercy doesn’t have.


#54

Yes, 50 hp/s, and your second healer, and the tanks, and the DPS. That’s the point of Valk, it’s an initiation ult, instead of a reaction ult like mass rez. When Mercy goes Valk and her team moves in, then the enemy team has to either engage these multiple boosted/healed targets, or back up and give them space. And with Mercy moving around to prioritize healing, that becomes much harder for the enemy team.

See, the point of the ult isn’t to get you POTG poggers front page of reddit 5 rez #yoloswag, it’s to benefit the team before they die, so that the plan can work, instead of just gambling on a dumb, cheap mechanic to fix everything for you. Valkyrie requires skill, and it speaks volumes that there’s now a segment of the forums devoted to avoid having to use it.


#55

I’m glad you agree of her being reworked, in some way, unlike people who don’t want her to be changed because they like her being toned down like this lol, and I’ll be really honest with you. I think the most fun I can have with Mercy nowadays is using Guardian Angel. Is just so incredible to juke a DPS that is chasing you constantly (I mean, I guess Mercy 2.0 showed them they should focus her…). Because every single part of her kit was toned down.

Sure, 1.0 base kit was really basic. But it was cool to know who to prioritize your heals and stuff. But if Mercy’s kit was limited on healing and flying, honestly, she definetely would be a really non-content hero. What gives her personality is her core, her ability to Ressurect allies. Because it shows she is more than an ordinary doctor, she’s Mercy. And when it was an ultimate, it felt impactful. From a solo man tempo Res to a 5 men Res.

5 men because the feeling of saving your team made you feel like a real hero. And tempo Resses because you would waste your entire ultimate on 1 or 2 allies to continue the fight, but that Res could flip the fight. I remember solo rezzing a Reaper in the end of the first point of Dorado. Sounds dumb, but I saw he had his ult. So I thought, it can work. Turns out he killed like 3-4 enemies and we hold the point, consequently we won the match. I felt awesome as well, because my Res, even small, was used wisely (at my eyes at least lol) and it actually changed the game.

But right now, as it is, you don’t obtain Res. It’s just given… Is not something special anymore. Is something regular, on a constant cooldown. You don’t think too much when using it because, oh well, you’ll have another one in 30 seconds anyway. The risk of using it like old Res had is gone. You gotta just see if enemies are around you, see who is more worth to Res, but that’s it. Nothing so special, nothing that feels impactful.

And Valkyrie, it was impactful once. But right now, it feels horrible, you feel like a spectator even when you try to heal your teammates.
What I suggested in another post to make Mercy feel more impactful and fun, if we do keep Valkyrie’s concept, was this:

Res should be part of her ult somehow, because of how powerful it is.


#56

Replace with Moira

80HP/s (AoE) and your second healer and the tanks, and the DPS. There’s really no reason to pick Mercy if you have someone else who does 30HP more…
Only reason I can think to pick Mercy is because of the utility provided by Resurrect.

It’s also pretty trash.

Or use common sense and expend an ultimate because let’s be real, 30% dmg boost ain’t going be making a difference if I can already do that without the ultimate. Valk is just ez mode.

I could literally do all of this without Valkyrie…

Well done Sherlock. Point being, her ultimate can’t make plays.

Which I could do fine without the ultimate…

Here, hold this:

No it does not lmfao. Anyone can fly up to the skybox.


#57

If may can ask you to re-read my post?

I openly acknowledge that it appears to me that most people seemed to get most of their enjoyment largely from her ult- and if that’s was the case it strongly signifies that her core kit has largely always been boring

Now I want to say- I understand why people enjoyed it. Completely.

I do however strongly feel that most of a characters enjoyment should from from the bulk of their kit- and not simply looking for those moments they can hit Q.

Of course this is just me, and how I would do it.

But all said and done at the end of the day it’s also ok to have different heroes for different players. Just because I’d do it this way, doesn’t mean I’d concern others wanting a hero who does what they find fun.

But I will stand by the statement that an observation on such like does indicate that her core kit has always been lack luster for enjoyment.


#58

Yeah because pre-rework we asked for an E and instead we get an E in our ultimates place and an ultimate in our E’s place.


#59

Pre-rework Mercy was worthless in high ranks and overpowered in the opposite end. She needed the rework.


#60

I wouldn’t say worthless but she definitely was worse.
And now it’s happening all over again.


#61

Worse how? She’s picked in high-ranks again, and the rework highlighted the other healers’ weaknesses, which led to the long-awaited Ana and Lucio buffs.


#62

I can understand not wanting mass res back.

I personally don’t either.

But when people have this mentality here- and I have seen it, it baffles me too. Especially because most don’t play the hero themselves to begin with.

There’s a better middle ground for all to have fun.

But what we have now isn’t it.

Honestly same- it’s largely all I’ve ever personally enjoyed about her kit as a whole. Her mobility is a lot of fun.

Also agree.

Personally I’d find a way to make res work with her ult (albeit not a straight up mass rez, but something) -

And rework her kit to make it feel more engaging and fun as a whole in its base.

There’s a LOT of ways we could do this.

Having her healing ramp around in various ways the longer it’s attached to people (going up OR down could be interesting. It’d be interesting if it went up because she’d have to pocket people to get full value and would have to think a smidge more about swapping rapidly, it’d be interesting if it went down because it’d force her to be mindful of WHEN she started to heal someone and not just pocket them non stop the whole time- each offers its own dynamic)

Her beam could work exactly like it does now as far as how it connects and tethers- but could “ramp up” the closer she aimed to her target. Maybe it did 50 base line. Then amped up to 55 if she was looking more at her target (think of the limits for what moira can be aiming and still do damage)- then to touched 60 if her cross hairs were directly on their body somewhere (with the beam visibly amplifying and changing sound with each tier) Of course these numbers are just place holders to paint a picture- don’t pay them any real mind- but something like this could reward a mercy who is keeping tabs on people in her mind and reward her for more direct attention to a target. I feel keeping her head on a swivel is a huge part of what makes Mercy, mercy- and something to add some risk / reward to that dynamic could have some potential.

And of course- these are just spit ball ideas more than genuine suggestions. The point is that they could do something, many things- to make her core kit more engaging, while still being readily approachable- and hopefully make her not only more impactful, but more importantly more fun in her base kit.


#63


#64

I’m all for a rework without resurrect.


#65

Yeah, I kind of went more in depth in a different direction. :stuck_out_tongue: I always had fun with Mercy, but the restrictions on E Res and 50 HPS is what ruins it for me. Not the rest of her kit. I love her kit, always have. It always felt exhilarating. But now to turn to stone for 2s every 30s and to have my healing penalized just to keep the garbage design doesn’t feel good. Valkyrie doesn’t feel engaging either. You just fly away from the battle. These restrictions are what made her base kit boring. It wasn’t that her base kit was always lackluster. I still have fun with it when I’m not ressing or using Valkyrie.


#66

Her pickrate is dropping, and is probably gonna drop even more due to the fact each change just kinda ruins the fun in playing her.


#67

Just because Ana’s grenade self-heal is its most optimal use, doesn’t mean they should remove heal block, and boosting.

Just because reloading is Highnoon’s most optimal use, doesn’t mean they should remove the damage if you hold it.

What they did to Mercy is like removing body shots from Widow, and making crit boxes bigger. They removed choice, and made what once was skilled easy, and mandatory. This example may seem a bit extreme, but it should get the point across if you care to hear it.


#68

Try playing Medic in TF2. Basically, think Mercy except without the mobility, can’t damage boost on the fly, and doesn’t have Res at all. Then tell me what is and isn’t fun.


#69

He only has shared god mode. And can have Ana’s primary in a fashion. Also, he can have the mobility.


#71

None of the Medic’s tools give him a virtual no-clip. Plus access to greater mobility via the Quick-fix means sacrificing the killing power of the Kritz or the unstoppable force that is Stock. Nobody uses the Vaccinator unless they’re a god at cycling resistances.

Plus, the Crusader’s Crossbow example falls terribly short. Ana’s primary is superior in every way.