I love how people think balancing should either be focused on “bronze players” or “pro players”, when the correct answer most of the time would be to balance around silver~plat level.
You know, where 80% of your playerbase is. Probably more, if you count the people that simply never touched competitive.
Sorry i have to disagree without brig, some actual tank would probably take over, since goats itself originated from quad tank.
Yet, if you dare like something off-meta and play them because it’s fun, you get false reported and banned within days.
It was nowhere near as effective, however. Slambulance was a fad comp.
The infamous triple-tank several moons ago was literally THE most hated meta in the entire history of Overwatch, it made people so miserable you can’t even imagine. And right now, just playing 3 Tanks/ 3 Supports is incredibly strong. They couldn’t possibly want to counteract that, no way. Let’s all just blame the OWL for literally anything we don’t like about the game instead.
I swear, it won’t be long before people from these forums blame a bad breakup or a failed job-interview on the Overwatch League.
so tell me why goats even exists in the first place
also who’s gonna replace brig? zen? ana?
I’m a bit surprised by the Torb changes. I understand the auto sentry. But Torb was almost an off healer for armor boosting tanks as well their turret helping them create more space.
Torb has his packs removed and now has anti-tank offensive ability. Mercy can no longer solo heal well which hurts Tanks a lot. In this upcoming patches, Tanks lost allies. I would hate to main a tank now. Tanks are caught in the middle having to deal with more damage, less heals, more cc/stun, more characters with faster mobility or spam. It wouldn’t be as bad if they still had Mercy who formerly had strong solo heals to counter some of that punishment that tanks endure.
DPS currently has a huge edge on making the bigger impact. I would say the Pharah changes feels like an actual nerf. Since they have smaller AOE, it means splash damage won’t go around shields as much and teammates who packed together will receive overall less damage. It’s a oxymoron to force Pharah to have precise splash damage to pander to console players.
While there are heroes that are too dependent from others there will always be huge differences between OWL and pub metas.
I cannot stand the notion that so many players have, thinking what it does in pro play cannoy be emulated in matchmaking.
You all realise that doesn’t make a lick of sense right?
“Matchmaking is not co ordinated” well that all the depends on the players at the time. There’s nothing actually stopping 6 strangers from going into chat and working together, comboing ults etc. Obvs it wont be as good as a team that practices together but then it doesn’t need to be.
E.g. “sombra is useless in ladder, no one follows up on emp”.
But they can if they want to. This is why the game has to be balanced from top down cos theres nothing stopping lower ranks doing what pros do other than lack of communication and skill.
Like i said goats originated from quad tank which had 4 tanks and two supports. In goats they simply replaced roadhog with Brig. So probably with another tank and most likely with roadhog.
However it’s obviously hard to tell if quad tank would be as strong as goats now against dive with hammond in general.
GOATs isn’t meta in the pro scene. On the past two months, 2-2-2 has been dominating by a large margin. Then triple supp, then GOATs, then triple tank.
Keep in mind we only have 6 tanks, of course they’re going to be picked more than the 14 DPS when ideally you need 2. Same with supports.
I wouldn’t mind that the game were balanced around pro play if their feedback weighed just as much as ours. Blizzard has stats to tell them what’s balanced and what not at the various levels of play. They don’t need pro players to tell them “Don’t buff Sombra like this, because then we’ll have to change our play style”.
Pro’s don’t care about balance. All they care about is winning.
So, yes, we need to include pro play in the equation, but, no, their feedback is not more important than what the rest of the player base have to say.
Brig does what Roadhog is supposed to do though, like, a billion times better without any of the drawbacks of actually running Hog.
As of right now you can sub in Brig with Hog, it makes the whole comp super vulnerable to Ana and mobility except for the most close-quarter of maps. Slambulance pretty much only works on Horizon first because 4 tanks feeds too much ult and is too hard countered by anti nade to work anywhere else.
if anything goats should be easier to run in pubs than in pro games since people are a lot less willing to switch to counter it and people aren’t coordinated enough to kite it and divide-and-conquer it
“pros run it but we can’t” is one of the weakest arguments i see on this forum and more people need to point out how silly it is
define pro scene
it’s certainly run all the time in contenders (was literally one-tricked in the eu finals to victory) and it’s constantly run by a majority of the lesser teams in wc and is often just mirrored to counter it
even usa, canada, and china often just mirror goats when they lose the first fight against it and they’re considered the best teams
been playing ow for 2 years and I still cannot grasp why people expect a competitive game marketed as an esport to be balanced around low rank players
The game isn’t as interesting to play or watch if the meta is just a 3-3 tank/support death ball that wades into each other and starts fighting at a distance of a few inches.
Sure it’s kind of fun to play at first but it doesn’t have the legs for long term.
People want to play/watch skill based, aim based heroes in a FPS game. It’s why there are so many DPS options and so few tanks. The problem is at some point tanks become so insufferable to play the only ones willing to do it are the people being paid for the role.
So that’s not healthy for the game either.
I still think and this is an unpopular opinion, that at some point we are going to see a forced 2-2-2 team standard. Just like we moved to 1HL before as Blizzard is just not going to be able to balance around 3-3 or 4-2 etc sort of comps. At least not balance it enough to keep the game interesting to watch and play for the widest range of players.
The best way to balance a game is not around the majority. This is not democracy. This is about balancing the power levels of the heroes. The power level of the heroes is best expressed by those who are the best. The only thing you have to support your method is numbers. Majority doesn’t mean much in terms of balance
It seems to become the new one if you look at the current woc teams and especially France. If a team full of owl players plays goats that much, than it’s at least a hint for me and I dom’t think you should write that off so quickly.
It’s wrong to judge the current meta by owl season 1 who was mostly in a different patch… Not even sure if the finals and world cup are on the same patch.
The stats I used are from the front page of Winston’s Lab. It’s mostly OWWC matches on the current patch (except Incheon qualifiers), with a bit of Contenders on old patch. Removing old patch games doesn’t make much of a difference.
If teams with lots of OWL players use GOATs against teams with no or few OWL players, then it doesn’t mean anything, it’s no different than South Korea using a cheese comp and pubstomping.
oh god please no the majority of people who play this game are absolutely terrible players, myself included.
The reason we have brig is a testament to that.