Smurf problem in low plat

Are you able to entertain the possibility your interpretation might be wrong? Like, what would it take to change your mind?

I can testify that Jeff said this at some point. Would finding the link change your point of view?

It is on console where smurf accounts are free to make.

Doesn’t matter how quickly they climb up to their usual rank. They’re still bringing high level experience, game sense, gameplay and skill into every lower tier match they play.

That gives them an unfair advantage over those players who’ve never been higher tier, and anything that gives an unfair advantage is cheating according to Blizzard.

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There’s no interpreting necessary. The reporting system spells it out quite clearly.

No, what Jeff said is that he doesn’t think smurfs are a problem because they soon rise to their usual rank.

However, he failed to address the impact that high tier players have in low tier matches due to the unfair advantage they have, and he also failed to acknowledge the fact that his own game’s reporting system says that’s cheating.

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You and I must have very different definitions of “clearly”. An example of clearly in this case would be something along the lines of “smurfing is considered cheating”. Clearly this isn’t the case given that Jeff himself made a reply to a thread titled “Smurfing is cheating. Stop downplaying it” to clarify that “Smurfing—and I know this isn’t what you want to hear—isn’t really that big of an issue”. Keep in mind that Blizzard takes cheating very seriously and have banned multiple accounts permanently for cheating. I’m not sure how else to spell it out any clearer to you. Clearly your interpretation does not align with what Blizzard constitutes as cheating.

Link: Overwatch Forums

I play on console as well so that point is kind of moot. Someone being better than you does not equate to cheating. If anything is to blame it’s the MM/Placement system.

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Jeff failed to mention that smurfs like to throw and rise ruining others climb causing the game to die

This depends on, wheter or not you forced your way to gold, if a guy made a new account and got placed in gold, how is it his fault at all. Your reasoning is not even solid and it isn´t on the supposed “abuser”.

It isn´t toxic to give you a direct source to the said developers saying x is alright, then you go ahead and misread some rules they have set up and conclude, that it isn´t. That is an inability to read and understand.

From mister kaplan himself

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Try a dictionary. The word has literally been defined there. A little hint for you, Google can be a great thing. I hate to say this, but the only “failing” here is you.

How is throwing somehow worse?
Are you saying it’s fair, fine, and acceptable to expect you to play a gold match against a top 500 player, but it’s not fair, fine, or acceptable to expect me to win a game because this same player was previously on my team and didn’t want to win? (No, I am not assuming I am higher rank than you. I most likely am not. It’s just an example.)
What makes my game matter more than yours, or yours matter more than mine?
One is not better than the other. Neither is fair for the 11 others in the game.

Smurfing is an issue. It is basically the dictionary’s definition of cheating. (You know, that thing our language is so reliant on)

Blizzard could say that the word “purple” means - a woody perennial plant, typically having a single stem or trunk growing to a considerable height and bearing lateral branches at some distance from the ground. (The definition for tree, if you can’t figure that out) However, that doesn’t make them right.

Furthermore, if you bother with clicking “report” on a player, and select cheating, it states “Cheating is: Using third party programs to automate any facet of the game, exploiting a bug, or engaging in any activity that an unfair advantage.”

Really? So a person who is already ranked, can’t just play on their main account instead of making a new one to grief players? Maybe I am wrong, but seems like they had a choice…

Yeah and since blizzard proved time and time again, that it isn´t a problem and that it is okay to have alt accounts. There is no point in arguing, what you feel is right or wrong. So a top 500 One trick are not allowed to make a new account to play a complete different hero etc ? Even though he is gonna prob dominate until he gets to a certain rank.

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i’m trying to be polite. If you’re going to be condescending then honestly it reflects badly on your character.

And how does this relate to your argument? Once again you need to be more clear and concise in your statements.

Smurfing is an issue (I’ll give you that), but to consider it the dictionary’s definition of cheating is a stretch.

Being a better player on another account is just that, having a (fair) advantage of experience and practice in the game.

To reiterate my stand, smurfing/having an alt account is NOT cheating. Smurfs are a plague on the playerbase however they generally operate within the rules (except when they are throwing matches to artificially derank)
Alt accounts are fair game, and the hatred people have for them is unwarranted (partly because they are mistaken for smurfs who throw games)

You are forgetting two HUGE things here.

  1. My thoughts or feelings didn’t define the word. Just like yours nor Blizzard’s.
  2. As stated before, when you click someone’s name, go to report, and then click cheating, it literally states “engaging in any activity that grants an unfair advantage.”

Blizzard has chosen to play both sides.

Do you agree that both of these are direct quotes from you?

Now, if you Google “cheating definition” this is what comes up.

“act dishonestly or unfairly in order to gain an advantage, especially in a game or examination.”

Now if you Google “smurf gaming definition” this is what you find.

“In multiplayer online gaming, the term Smurf (noun) is used to refer to an experienced player who creates a new account for the purposes of being matched against inexperienced players for easy wins.”

How is it “without cheating or trying to achieve unjust advantage”? If a player knowingly is (insert rank here) yet they create a new account to play against lower ranked players, did they not try to achieve an unjust advantage?

I think a good way to try and fix smurfs is if someone is dominating at the rank they are in for 5 games in a row they should get 2 matches that are of people with a similar skill level. If they are truly trying to climb they will play appropriately and get to their correct rank. If they intentionally play bad to stay in the current rank I think it should flag then for further review of trolling in a low rank.

I think this would further deter people from doing the bronze - gm videos since they would essentially get placed with players at a much faster rate. Also it would be easier to spot people who troll and dramatically play worse when placed in a situation where they could essentially leave a whole rank if they are that much more skilled than the current rank they are on.

Are you suggesting skill-based promotions (e.g. a GM climbing through Platinum would get a couple of games in Masters vs. Masters and if they win they’re now Masters?) I’d be okay with that, but I still think smurfing is more of a scapegoat for people who don’t want to admit mistakes than an actual problem for people trying to climb. It would require introducing a new system on top of the matchmaker with its own bugs and likely new ways to game the system.

Absolutely wrong, cause the “unfair” aspect, that you think is “unfair” is

  1. Not unfair. Being better is not an unfair advantage.

  2. It wasn´t decided or choosen by the player to be that way, he is merely playing the new account as intended.

So in conclusion you are absolutely wrong and Blizzard clearly stated as such.

As you found yourself right here, it is only if they “purposes of being matched against inexperienced players”, this means only if you intentionally throw or do worse to get those games, is it unfair. Which Blizzard confirms, Throwing games to get worse placements is ban able.

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You understand the definition of fair is “without cheating or trying to achieve unjust advantage”? Thus, the definition of unfair would be along the lines of “cheating or trying to achieve an unjust advantage.”

You’re better than me at this game? Great for you. Many are. However, once you intentionally do anything to get yourself into matches against me (or lower ranked players) you have removed fair play from the game, which is a form of cheating.

There’s different SR tiers for a reason. That’s to make for fair matches for everyone. (The system isn’t perfect, but that’s not the topic here)

If I already have an SR that is better than the gold starting area, buying a new account removes fair play from the game, which is cheating. If I already have an SR below the gold starting area, buying a new account is cheating. It removes fair play from the game.

If I play heroes I am not good at, which cause me to drop SR, so that I can play the heroes I am good at to climb back up, I have removed fair play from the game. Which is cheating.

Now, does it break the rules Blizzard put into place? Yes and no. It’s been stated by someone from Blizzard that it doesn’t. However, the game’s reporting feature actually states that it does. (Which has been shown more than once. Feel free to look for yourself)

This means Blizzard can ban your account, as you have clearly broken a rule, but it also means they could allow me to do it. Or they could ban me for doing it, but not ban you for doing the same exact thing.

You’ve been provided with definitions of words, you’ve been provided with rules from the game.

Do you think murder shouldn’t be considered murder, just because you didn’t choose the definition of the word? (I know, one doesn’t equal the other)

Did the person not know they were already ranked on their “main” account?
Did the person not know they would start at a lower SR tier on a new account?
Did the person not choose to purchase the game/account for a second time?
Did the person not choose to log out of their other account?
Did the person not choose to sign into the new account?
Did the person not play to reach a specific level, with the intent of playing competitive?
Did the person not intentionally queue for competitive matching?

At which point in these 7 steps did this person not have a choice or a clue? These 7 things didn’t just happen. There was effort put into them. Even if you don’t use the auto sign in feature, the others are choices made.

You seriously just quoted my post, and want to act as if the words “creates a new account” aren’t there? LOL You do realize that you could have removed those four words, right? It wouldn’t have removed it from my actual post, but come on.

i had a game yesterday on Anubis where we were a four stack and the other two were a two stack. we joined vc they did not. ok whatever no problem. they played one tank one dps, we filled around that. cool stuff. we attacked the point and and had about a minute and a half left. not bad.

our turn to defend, the two stack who is not in vc goes two healers. no problem we fill around it. they wait in spawn until about ten seconds to match start, and they both switch to DPS. :slight_smile: no warning, no vc, nothing. just trolls to the max, for no reason whatsoever. we did well on attack and we now have zero healers on defense. what a fun game and community SMILE.

and before i hear it…this is not exactly common, but its not UNCOMMON. and thats what irritates people. they were obvious alternative accounts (not sure if a smurf) and they just troll on purpose with no consequence. whatever consequences they receive on that troll account (if any at all, omegalul) is laughable as they just go on the other twenty accounts they have and troll some more. ggs :slight_smile:

Wrong, you think it is, but nobody actually “intentionally do anything to get yourself into matches against me”, that is a smurf, which is not okay, but alt accounts (80%+ of accounts) are permitted" 100% no argument there.

There are a multitude of reasons to make new accounts, (training new roles, new heroes, having another account to play something you dont do on your main or practicing strategies) All of which are permitted, granted you dont throw.

Again, what you think is “Fair play”, is not fair play. Being better will never be an unfair advantage, just like any pro CSGO player, joining Overwatch, isn´t cheating until they reach top 500, which they would be by your logic.

Again Jeff kaplans own words > over your own “Interpretation” of what is fair play.

They stated you can in no way get banned for alt accounts. Done deal, stop trying to force this argument, that was disproven.

You´re pretty much unable to think at all. There are also several occasions, where people get out of “murder” through special circumstances and several other degrees of murder, the fact you are unaware of this, seems to tell me all about your ability to logically make analogies.

Just for the fun of it

  1. Irrelevant alt accounts are 100% permitted.
  2. Irrelevant, they are not able to choose, what tier to start in.
  3. Completely allowed
  4. Completely allowed
  5. Completely allowed
  6. Completely allowed
  7. Completely allowed

At all those steps he did something fair and completely legal, the only thing you call unfair is a fault of the matchmaker having no other way to rank up, than to start from the bottom and up. Which you cannot combat.

Yeah i quoted your post, to show you, what the post shows. The creates a new account is irrelevant, it clearly says that

  1. It has to be a new account
  2. You have to be purposefully trying to get ranked vs lower players, aka if you are killing everyone left and right all the time (with a 100% winrate), you are clearly not trying to stay at a lower level intentionally.

That is why i quoted that part, cause number 2, is not present, wich means, that your very own quote disproves your whole theory.

You make up word definitions, you read things and completely conclude your own reality from them (Despite the original people, who wrote it telling you, that it is wrong) and you quote dictionaries, that quite clearly states the opposite of, what you are saying.

You are really a dense one.

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So what if a new player wins their first game? Instant ban from 100% winrate?

So I am the dense one, but you:

  1. You quoted something and then tried to pretend that the words never existed
  2. You refuse to accept the literal definitions of words because they don’t conform to your illogical ramblings
  3. You accuse me of using my own interpretation when I typed word for word what the actual in game report feature stats when you click to report someone for cheating.
  4. You have the inability to comprehend that Blizzards rules do not define the word cheating.
  5. You fail to realize that escaping punishment for a crime (such as murder) doesn’t mean it is now a legal act.
  6. You think everything is irrelevant because it doesn’t fit your illogical ideas.

Kid, for the love of all things, please stay in school and learn something, anything really. Better yet, run along and pick up a book or something and start now. I recommend a dictionary. Might help you formulate an opinion if you can understand what words mean.

The words were not needed, the whole difference between a smurf and an alt account is the “trying to intentionally lower your rank”. Something you cannot understand and misunderstood.

Yeah right, show me a dictionary saying, that being better at a sport is an unfair advantage. I will wait all day.

Cause you interpret it and draw conclusions, blizzard outright stated, that your interpretation is wrong. Stop trying to act like you have an argument to stand on.

You have the inability to understand, that Blizzard defines, what is considered “Cheating” in their own game. Again “D.E.N.S.E”.

You fail to realize i was referring to forms of murder, such as “Self defense”, which are exclusions, that permits the act. D.E.N.S.E + I.L.L.I.T.E.R.A.T.E.

You think everything revolves around you and your viewpoints (Look around you, there is a reason no one is throwing likes on your stupid posts).

Your whole argument was irrelevant as soon as you thought, that you had a point using Blizzards report form, when Blizzards themselves clarified, that you are D.E.A.D A.S.S W.R.O.N.G

Now accept it and move on, you´re done.

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