The role system is too bad to force a role queue and 2-2-2. Plus 2-2-2 gets kinda boring if it’s the only thing you play.
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If they are smart, they will introduce 2-2-2 with role queue. If they are completely insane, they will introduce 2-2-2 without role queue. Experience tells me they are more insane than smart, but they are first and foremost, slow, so we’ll see (maybe?).
Again, I ask, why does everyone on the forums and Twitter think tank and support mains are some oppressed minority? Is there no one on this planet who plays tanks or healers, because that sounds preposterous.
Oppressed? No.
Annoyed away from the game? No doubt. There are a lot of good dps players.
But there are also a lot of bad ones who refuse to do anything for the team and just do as they wish so your tank has to go without an off-tank for peel, or you are running only one healer and your tanks suffer, or you are running no tanks so the supports have nothing to earn them space to peek and heal the flankers that went in.
It’s annoying and this game is hemorrhaging players, might be time to give them what they were asking for and win them back.
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My favorite hero is Tracer. The only hero I dislike in the game is Lucio. I am a fairly competent Quake player, with solid aim and movement, I played in tournaments, even won money. So, it’s kinda evident what would I gravitate to regarding the hero pool.
My stats after I practically gave up on the game, even back in beta:
-300 hours on Lucio
-34 MINUTES (I remembered the exact number) on Tracer
Another important info: I am not a people pleaser.
Now, let that sink in (I am not being snarky, I do mean let it cook for a bit) and then reassess your position and who knows, perhaps you’ll see what people are talking about.
On a break. Ask yourself how often you see a group arguing who gets to play dps or how many teams insta lock 3+ dps as opposed to 3+ support or tank mains, rather telling.
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Just look at how many times you solo-queue in QP and see how many people intsalock dps. Take notes of it and you’ll see a startlingly strong pattern very quickly.
What does this even mean? More team oriented?
It means something to help the team instead of just getting kills. Getting kills helps the team in an indirect way. Healing or tanking is direct teamwork.
Those selfish DPS mains, how dare they want to play these heroes ! Not even switching to a tank/supp ! They’re not even a part of the team ! I’d love instalocking GOATS but how dare they try 3 DPS ! I, as a morally superior support player, have to work and care for them while they ignore me !
Locked comps are trash, as well as roleQ as it sounds for now, and you have LFG to do that. If you’re “such a flex player” you know that you should be able to switch the whole team while ingame.
And justifying a 25-30min DPS queue saying “they will learn to flex”, just so you can play the same 2-2-2 in every game…
Tanks and supps are not special snowflakes. 2-2-2/GOATS are not the only viable comps. DPS are part of the team. People should play what they want.
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No one said they shouldn’t, but since the reality is people want to play their own damn heroes, Role queue is a NO BRAINER.
Thanks for illustrating the point though c:
If people function one way, and the game functions another, and the people don’t exactly meld well with the games function, it’s up to the game to streamline the experience. Simple as that. You can’t force people to be different, so you have to implement a system that doesn’t have them fighting their own instincts.
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How about accepting comps that fits what everyone wants to play ? Instead of forcing what you perceive is the best comp ?
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I agree.
It’s just tastes, my favorites comps are 3-2-1 (mainly 3 DPS, 2 Heal, 1 tank or 3 DPS, 1 Heal, 2 tanks)
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In a solo queue enviroment, all the way up to GM, I have rarely ever had ANY team ever want to change up how they play, it’s either strict meta comp, or everyone picks what they like, and then we have 4 dps so 2 people who DID want to play dps swapped off to other roles anyway.
Actually thinking in special compositions would be a 6v6 thing, but most games aren’t a 6v6. The overall quality of games is really poor outside of a team queue, and the hero stacked comps from one area cause balance issues that lead to having improperly balanced heroes (looking at you brig you monster of a bad hero) that no longer function outside of a role stacked composition, like brig is awful in 2/2/2, but a monster in 3/3. If heal stacking wasn’t a thing, BAM goats ded. If you couldn’t stack tanks, if you couldn’t stack DPS, alot of the games issues for most people would be instantly dead.
And to satisfy your worries on queue times.
That’s the fairest it can get while distributing the tanks and healers evenly to everyone. You can have the same amount of games, without super long wait times, all you have to do is learn to share and even out the oversupply of one role to the demand of the other roles. Makes a lot of sense when you just think about it logically.
The only real casualty of role queue is the fact you wouldn’t see any crazy 4/1/1 comps in E-sports, but that will just never happen at this point because the resources from tanks and healers are too strong and the squishy heroes can’t take full advantage of those resources because they can be one shot by other DPS too easily so they effectively counter themselves >.<
So are we REALLY losing anything tangible in order to gain consistent matchmade games where everyones there playing what they know they want? Having proper balancing instead of a balancing act that isn’t very balanced because they are worried about making a super meta or busy trying to kill the last one they accidentally spawned for 100% of the games lifecycle? Plugging up the bleeding of players currently leaving the game now that better options have come and overwatch just hasn’t developed enough into a good likable product?
Role queue still sounds pretty good for the majority of players.
My point precisely. These comps aren’t crazy, especially when ran by owl teams. I believe it’s Guangzhou Charge that consistently runs those, to a certain degree of success.
In my case I am tired of playing supp/tank after 12seasons of filling and got serious on DPS, and I usually pick last since I’ve got a big DPS hero pool and can fill according to the team.
You can’t imagine how many people either switch (which is fine but often not necessary) or throw/flame when I pick the third DPS slot.
I just don’t fill roles anymore but I chose my character according to possible synergies or ult combos (Genji with Ana, Hanzo with Zarya, Sombra with Lucio+Rein, etc…) and it works.
You can run solo heal if your team avoids trash/poke damage with either shields or clean engages, if you don’t have two main tanks or no self-sustainable hero. Solo tank with Rein works in a lot of cases as well.
Some Korean team even ran Doomfist as main tank for a time, every hero has different utility, and balanced roles doesn’t mean balanced composition.
How you play the comp, exploiting the synergy between all characters matters more than just “enough healing, enough sustain, enough damage”, and the GOATS meta just has the most of those stats+synergies than any other comp.
Roles don’t mean everything, I betcha I heal more on Soldier than you do on Moira as well. (maybe not)
You realize it’s not JUST DPS mains who suffer from being placed in a game with too many of x main?
It happens a lot to healer mains and I can only assume it has also shoved 2-3 main tank mains into the same game and forced them to swap. I’ve even had to actually go DPS during my competetive life, multiple times, because I’ve been stacked with multiple healers and we weren’t playing GOATS.
Stop assuming people are attacking DPS mains.
It’s obvious you haven’t seen or tried LFG. It’s terrible.
Mechanically, it’s up to 6 random solo Qers who have never played together being put up against an organized 6 stack. Any time I’ve used it I have never been put up against another LFG group.
Then you have the community side of things. Almost no one uses it, so making the group takes upwards of 30-40 minutes depending on the time of day, and after 1 loss the entire group disbands anyhow and it’s right back to the start. And if you looked at LFG lately, it’s filled with “road to bronze” groups.
Neither are DPS.
Role Q gives people the chance to actually play what they want and not be forced to play a role they are uncomfortable with, especially at the highest of ranks where you may play Tracer at 3800 but your tank play is 3000 at best.
And role Q times for DPS wont be as bad as people say they will be. If you take World of Warcraft for example, where DPS outnumbers just about every other role, it takes maybe 5 minutes tops to find a group for a dungeon. And that’s with an almost similar set up to 2-2-2
And don’t forget, you won’t ever be forced to play GOATS and you can play your DPS role till! Amazing!
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Though I don’t complain about it. I’ll ask to change if there’s no hero synergy or no way to make the comp work. Roles are secondary in the regard.
Jeff himself said he estimated time queues for DPS to be around 25min in the video with Stylosa.
I have actually. Had both good teams, toxic ones, leavers and throwers. Not saying it works as intended. But if it would, that should be THE WAY to force 2-2-2 or whatever comp.
Not “forced”, it’s not “able” to play quad tanks or triple DPS or anything other than 2-2-2. I have 1k+ hours on the game and the variety is part of what keeps me going. The variety of my hero choice through the rounds
Strange how you make role Queue out to be this sort of way to fight back against DPS players, which isn’t the main cause for people wanting a role queue.
The main cause is having stacked hero comps that are difficult to deal with (GOATS and the old Triple Tank from long ago).
I can only speak from my experience, and in my experience I get more wins when people play who they’re strongest with, and not adhering to some pre-set comp that everyone should follow. Triple support? Triple Tank? Quad DPS? I’ll take that any day than someone who will fill and purposefully throw the match because they’re upset at their own teammates harassing them for wanting to be the 3rd DPS.
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That’s bad yeah harassment is a real issue
but the thing is… as a Main tank, you know how much worse it is to play with a lack of resources? Your playstyle goes from flexible and fun to static and you just get to watch everyone else play while wishing you could do more than what you can at that moment. I mean you can play hard still sure, but that’s most likely throwing because you risk death as a main tank and that means your team falls over, or you just straight up feed so much that your team loses the ult economy battle.
The 3rd DPS makes the tank player forego what is actually fun for them.
Same with one healer, can’t play aggressively and when you take damage as said support it leaves you out of the fight for a very long time, having to take angles to heal meaning your team cant effectively push that hard without losing their healers resources for a fight. It should also be noted that this isn’t a very fun way to play overwatch either.
But it happens all the time. And people seem to unilaterally hate that.
I can flex well enough that I’m not bothered by asymmetric queue times, but locking me into a 2-2-2 match every single game is a pretty great way to spend inordinate amounts of development time to get me to quit playing your game. They could save bucketloads of money by just asking me nicely.
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