That’s why I stated if Bastion isn’t in bunker. So in this instance, he is or isn’t in it.
It WOULDN’T be.
That is how I am proposing it SHOULD be.
I am proposing that Bastion have that means of escaping, of when Roadhog suddenly appears around a corner I can resposition.
Not as soon as I see Roadhog or Ana or Hanzo’s face on the enemy’s team slots I go “welp I’m straight up dead if they ever get a good line of sight on me… or they’re utterly incompetent”.
That’s too much of what saves me, the Ana who inexplicably doesn’t use sleepdart. The hanzo who takes it easy on me by starting with Storm arrows rather than shooting a full power arrow first then storm arrows.
People are making these mistakes less and less.
I can’t depend on my opponent making bonehead mistakes.
I have too, but it wasn’t because I was good, it was because they made bonehead mistakes.
Mistakes that people cannot count on and are becoming less and less common.
I hope you can see why it’s not justified to nerf the damage of a tank-buster with such a low pickrate when GOATS is such a despised meta.
Please, you must follow your logic through… if bastion is being forced out of sentry mode more often because he now even has the possibility of escaping, why also nerf his damage when he is in sentry mode?
I think you underestimate how large bastion’s hitbox is.
It is as large as Roadhog’s hitbox but with half the health (armour is now too weak) and a far worse self-heal.
I know how strong Bastion’s recon mode is, I survive most 1 vs 1 firefights with more than 15 rounds remaining in my clip, either I did incredibly well and landed a high proportion of headshots or I didn’t deal damage quickly enough and I’m fragged.
Really Bastion’s clip size buffs have been mostly useless.
What is the point in being able to shoot continually for 4.4 seconds when you have a hitbox the size of a soccer goal net? A hitbox that big you’re going to take damage at such a high rate you’re not going to have a chance to shot for 4.4 seconds!
If I go head to head with a reaper. 4.4 seconds is long enough for him to mag dump all 8 rounds into me!
What if we put Sentry mode (the turret) on wheels and like…let it move?
I dunno, maybe something like:
- Increase Bastion’s health to 300HP and 50 Armor
- Decrease Ironclad damage reduction from 20% to 10%
- Allow Sentry mode to move at 30% of normal speed
- Reduce Sentry mode rate of fire from 30 RPS to 24
- Reduce Sentry mode spread angle
The ability to move, even very slowly at 30% normal speed, would let this guy peak around corners…which would be a game changer. Also, making him like…the only DPS pick to be able to survive a headshot from Widowmaker would mean a lot in today’s meta. It’d be everything.
I dunno. Too much?
He already can survive a headshot but with 2 HP or something like that. Her shot does 300 and with armor that reduces 3 of it.
In the past 6 months bastion’s pickrate has fallen.
The rise of bunker has seen a fall in Bastion’s pickrate to even lower levels than before.
As you may see when you get round to reading the rest of the thread, you’ll see how changes proposed would make bastion less viable in bunker comp but more more viable elsewhere.
it should be added that Hanzo is VERY LIKELY going to have the drop on Bastion as your minigun has such a distinctive and loud sound so hanzo knows where to aim his sonic arrow. Which has recently had its radius buffed.
So he’s going to be playing against you with wallhacks most of the time.
Looking back at all the other changes to all other heroes one thing is consistent: none of them want to change the art. So so adding new polygons or new animations, no.
You can take existing assets and rearrange them like take Symm’s ultimate teleporter and have it placed as a cooldown ability.
The problem with an absolute health increase is it makes healing from allies more effective when we’re trying to make Bastion more independent.
A step in the right direction but 350HP won’t compensate for that.
10% damage reduction is just an annoyingly small number, why not remove all damage reduction and entirely replace it with extra armour of a type that healers couldn’t heal?
Another thing they don’t seem to ever want to do is alter the fire rate on fully-automatic weapons.
See a fully automatic weapon has a distinct sound, Sombra’s is a “brrrrt”, soldier’s is a “chew-chew-chew-chew” and so on. I think the sound design department probably put a lot of work into having the heroes be recognised by their sound and don’t want to change that.
So whatever happens, Bastion’s sentry gun is going to stay at 30RPS and Recon gun is going to stay at 8RPS.
I think they could change it, just the sound department would veto the idea.
They could just lower the damage of each shot by 20% instead of reducing the rate of fire, then. My only thought on this was that the increased mobility (letting Bastion come around corners, albeit very slowly) should come at DPS cost.
What would that disproportionately affect?
That would disproportionately hurt Bastion as a tank-buster and shield breaker. When Goats is all about tanks and shield break! It’s also going to hurt Bastion in a possible anti-Bunker comp!
There is a sort of mobility I think could work, one that has a built in downside, I like the idea of utilising the jump key/button in sentry mode being a special way of transforming into recon mode as it “springs” Bastion away at a normal jump height (and direction controlled by thumbstick/WASD) as he’s reconfiguring.
This would effectively give up damage for mobility as Bastion is no longer in sentry mode any more.
This is the inverse of how Bastion mains jump in recon mode triggering the transformation into sentry, mid-air.
You know what, now that you’ve said this…I kind of like the idea of giving the turret like, a little rocket jump or hop or something like that, to move into position. It could be a tool purely for Sentry Mode.
Give it a relatively short range and make it slow, like Reaper’s teleport. Maybe like…a Reaper style teleport with a relatively short range, that works in Sentry mode and has a long cooldown of like…15 seconds. Just something to let a player transform, charge up this slow rocket jump, then get out from around the corner into firing position. It’d still make you a stationary target, making it hard to retreat, but you wouldn’t have to transform in full view of the enemy team to begin your grizzly work, so that’d be nice. You also wouldn’t have to change the existing model. It could be anything from a little grappling hook to rocket jump or like…teleportation node or whatever.
Better if there’s a small signal at the landing spot the instant before it happens, so a skilled and aware enemy team can see him that Bastion is about to land there, you know, to make it sporting.
I wasn’t replying to you, I was replying to OP.
Now you just deleted Soldier. Any way of making Sentry mode better, sort of defeats the purpose of Old Jack.
Not sure this suggestion would actually work.
I did read it, I didn’t comment because I disagree.
That’s what I do and it works. I juggle Recon and Sentry. I’m constantly repositioning. The mode I’m in most of the time is Recon. I use Sentry to catch people off guard or bust a shield when I’m protected / they aren’t expecting it and I use it to mob up on retreating teams. So far it’s worked lovely.
It’s called game sense and pre-positioning yourself in a spot where Hog can’t do that.
That’s the attitude of a bad Bastion, no offense.
You never should have been depending on that in the first place. Not saying you were, just saying.
I’m not saying straight up nerf it. I’m saying if you are going to increase his survivability enough that a nerf to his damage would have to happen. It’s a trade off. Otherwise you just get…
I really don’t think we should be encouraging the “sit stationary and hold left click over targets” to easily profit style of gameplay.
I’m saying if you increase his survivability IN Sentry that his damage needs to be cut. I’m not against any buffs for the character at all, I just disagree with HOW to buff him.
Bastions increased clip size was amazing imo, and if you didn’t do damage quickly enough you got fragged. That sounds like how it’s should be. You got rewarded for good aim and punished for bad aim.
Uhrm…
In all rights, Sentry Mode is supposed to out-1v1 a Soldier 76.
And generally be better than one at any realistic range.
I hate comparing the two heroes, but yea…
A soldier 76 is not supposed to stand up well against a Sentry Mode Bastion without direct cover from LOS
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I feel like you should just git gud as genji.
Come on man, there’s limits.
The problem with game sense is it’s wrong most of the time. You’re going to be like “Yeah, I’m 50% sure a roadhog might come around that corner” so as a result you’re out of sentry mode and… when do you go back into sentry mode.
This paralyses Bastion to such a huge extent.
And Roadhog doesn’t need such pseudo-psychic “gamesense” he just needs functioning ears, it’s so easy to hear Bastion’s minigun. Hearing roadhog’s footsteps as distinct from any other footsteps, no way.
That’s a no-win-scenario.
It would only have been an insult to my intelligence.
But how would what I propose encourage that?
It would encourage everything OTHER THAN HIDING BEHIND AN ORISA SHIELD!
Because Bastion is so vulnerable to a sleep dart or roadhog hook, and a shield will stop such things. Because Bastion can’t just hop out of the way.
Why?
He clearly isn’t powerful even now in bunker comps with his stats falling as bunker comp is rising.
IMO… for “in my opinion”.
What reason do you have to back up your opinion?
And follow that logic through.
You cannot shoot the weapon any quicker, you’re stuck at 8 shots per second.
So if you can’t kill them in about 20 rounds, then what’s the point in capacity over 20 rounds?
This would still mean Soldier 76 gets a huge reward for getting the drop on Bastion. As he can with sprint letting him traverse the map to odd angles.
The helix rocket’s flight time syncs up with the delay after firing the helix so that at around 25m range a helix rocket hits simultaneous with a 9 round burst for a sudden burst of 300 damage. With either 20% DR or +100 NR Armour, that’s going to leave Bastion really weak.
Soldier 76 can win if he’s smart.
Soldier 76 right now can win by being really lazy, just A+D strafe right in front of Bastion and with biotic field and a bit of cover, easily win the fight and Bastion can’t even escape!
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but thats simply not what hes intended to be.
thats like asking for a tank widowmaker, or a healer genji. it wont happen. ever.
his niche is being a stationary heavy hitter. no mobility in exchange for extreme damage. and he has that. the only question is number tweaking.
i know how frustrating it can be when you like a hero design, but hate their playstyle. but pretending that something is wrong with them simply because you dont enjoy how they work… thats not reasonable.
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I agree, Bastion needs a rework so he gets his own shield
Completely agree. Also…
I’m not against these.
These on the other hands…
No. His spread was already reduced by 33% over time recently I think too. Maybe his spread could use a little bit more reduction but not much. And I’m gonna have to say no to the headshot.
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By making him a Tank. It’s quite simple.
Bastion 350 hp in total: 200 health, 150 armor
Ironclad: When in recon mode everyone in a 5 meter range radius will gain a 20% damage reduction. When in Sentry form, Bastion has 15% damage reduction towards himself.
Sentry mode: Now will have that when Bastion is heading into Sentry mode will now slide with in this configuration. By shooting you gain gain momentum. Regular speed. 5.5 mps. Closer to a wall to push off. 7 mps. Ammo now has been decreased from 300 to 200. Damage decreased from 7.5 dmg to 15 dmg to 5 dmg to 10 dmg.
(While in Sentry) Space Bar: Anchor- With Bastions gliding ability added you can still stay still with this ability to anchor down to lock into the ground or unanchor to start gliding again and escape.
Q:Juggernaut Mode- Bastion’s Sentry mode gun switches out for his Recon weapon on his right arm and gains the tank cannon on his left arm. Loses the ability to heal during ult, but walking speed increases to 6.5. Lasts 8 seconds
RMB= Sentry Gun- Same
LMB=Tank Cannon- 160 damage per shot.
You realize if they reworked Bastion, Torbjorn would most likely fill the gap.
Sorry to break it to you but in Plat/Diamond Bunker generally is run without Bastion except for like a handful of maps on a specific point.
Also the label is applied with anything with Orisa soooooo. No.