Remember "#ReworkMercy?"

The funny thing is all supports are as skill less as mercy if you take out their dps part apart from bap moira ana.

Zen orbs are easier than mercy noodle

Lucio doesn’t even have to aim

Brig same

Kiriko has auto aim and better range.

Probably should clarify- based on what you said I took “problem” to mean Mercy making other things OP. It might be true here, and it might not be. Historically, it’s not always easy to tell and this is hardly the first time these sorts of things have happened. This is a strong yet inevitable side effect due to the nature of her kit. That then leaves multiple options:

  1. Destroy Mercy’s identity
  2. Let Mercy have long periods of being over or under powered as the devs gather data across metas to accurately gauge her power level
  3. Frequently adjust Mercy without letting the meta truly settle, such that there are no prolonged periods of bad balance.

I believe 3 to be the healthiest for the game- the playerbase is no longer willing to wait for balance to really settle, and the brain, skill, and experience drain from all the vets leaving only makes that worse. This solution would mean Mercy mains are going to complain about constantly relearning their character.

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RiGhT cLiCk + ShIfT is GuD GaMePlAy DoE!

Rework time, now.

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My favorite is people bringing up the Mercy forum raid from 4 years ago as if that is relevant anymore. I think there is some bad apples who are a little over dramatic but jesus christ I can barely count any constructive criticisms over the hero without topping it off with several insults to the players/hero. I get this game can be frustrating but I would like to discuss changes for my favorite hero without being insulted constantly.

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Completely ignoring the amount of Lucio players that are constantly throwing the game off a cliff because they can’t work his mechanics properly.

Your perspective seems skewed as someone who obviously possesses good mechanics. The avg plat Lucio is much less useful than the average plat Mercy.

No I didn’t.

Stop being obtuse and make the point you are trying to make. One problem with these conversations is you all think you’re so witty that it’s like pulling teeth.

ooo big gotcha - checkmate.

You can not land consistent damage on Mercy due to broken movement Outside of lucky snipers shots she gets the distract element for free. Like everything else in her kit. There’s nothing difficult about executing GA or superjump.

Eh, no. I think you’re proving his point here more than anything. I do think she should be changed to help make design and balance easier, as well as giving her more rewarding moments and personal power / less dependence on allies (though she should be the most dependent still to not shift her to the point she becomes unrecognizable to those who do enjoy her). There is literally nothing wrong with characters that play the game differently than others, it helps create a space for those who might otherwise not be interested in a game to become interested and fill a niche (though in Mercy’s case, it’s popular) design space that isn’t already covered.

I would change damage beam to give her something where she could deal damage of her own in some manner, lessen the impact of valk and have that as a regular ability. Rez should be an ult with the value it provides. Currently, it’s a frustrating ability in higher ranks since rez can often just be a suicide button / make your team staggered. Making it her ult that works instantly or maybe make it so there is still a delay but she can do stuff while it casts would be a better direction for her. We can keep her identity and core gameplay while removing pain points for the broader community / balance team and make her more enjoyable for those who do play her.

Just my thoughts anyways.

Engaging with the enemy is just one facet of the game. You arrogantly suggesting that its a “large skill check” only shows that you’re narrowly viewing the game.

See, you’re wrong again. In Overwatch, there’s characters that primarily support their team. Mercy primarily supports her team. Mercy is playing Overwatch. According to YOUR narrow lens, she’s playing a different game, and that’s unironically because you have no idea what you’re talking about.

Because you don’t understand it. You aren’t the only one that doesn’t understand this.

OH no I’m not. I’m telling you what the real issue is. You don’t understand what you’re talking about, yet you’re doing a ton of talking. That’s the issue.

Does mercy not provide her own value? When she’s healing and damage boosting you, is she not providing her own value? When she rezzes someone, she’s not providing her own value? What do you guys see when you look at Mercy? She’s actively helping her team, and somehow not providing value?

No, I know what you see “Huh?! She hasn’t shot anyone! Its just like she’s not playing. REWORK!”.

And before you accuse me of setting up strawmen, I clearly typed that above sentence to mock common opinions against mercy.

Thank you, I happen to think I’m pretty funny.

Edit: I’m not joking, I’m glad you guys never got into TF2. Who knows how you guys would butcher that game.

“The Engineer is a sentry bot! He should be reworked so that he has to fight more!”

“The medic isn’t providing value! He’s just holding his m1 over someone that’s fighting!”

“SNIPER OP SNIPER OP SNIPER OP!”

Okay, to be fair, we still got a lot of that last one.

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Yes, you did. You went from “Mercy never has to reveal herself” to “I understand that Mercy is valuable when revealing herself” which is literally a direct contradiction.

No, YOU changed the argument you were making.

And if this were true then Mercy would be the most picked support in GM.

If there is truely no skill curve to abilities, there would only be Mercy players in GM because of how easy she is, but clearly this isn’t the case.

Dude, even contenders players struggle with Mercy’s movement, here’s a video of freaking flats struggling to use Mercy’s movement: https://youtu.be/AbTNXpH54IA?t=271

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…why do you think people hold that opinion…? :thinking:

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No, I think the issue is that you have enough of an ego to think you can determine who does and doesn’t deserve respect. Instead of just simply stating, “This hero feels unfair to me and I understand that it’s not so black and white, but still feel she could use more fine-tuning”, you conflate it in an attempt to try to turn it into objectivity, and then get pissed when people don’t agree with you on it.

Yeah some Mercy players can be feral, a notable one frequents these forums. But it would be a lot more approachable if people approached it in good faith and not, “I am frustrated at this hero so let me pass judgment on the players of said hero”.

Please, PLEASE drive that into your thought process. I have seen plenty of people who approach Mercy conversations with a very modest and respectful tone. Yours ain’t it. None of the people getting flack is it. You try to conflate it to make it as objective as possible, which I would assume people are doing to make it less likely they’ll be disagreed with - but it has the opposite effect.

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It because people view Mercy as the easiest support because she has an auto aim weapon. Honestly that’s literally it.

Other character have strong ults, stronger weapons, higher healing, better abilities but those don’t matter because Mercy doesn’t need to aim.

You constantly see the people going “She’s a free climb to top 500” but when you ask them to prove it they almost always respond “I don’t want to”. Its so annoying.

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Mercy players opinions are usually completely dismissed

This actually applies everyone who has an identifiable main. People come after Zen regularly. Discord was already nerfed in beta because tank players whined about him, and now they’re back for round two saying discord needs to go entirely even though there are dive/off tanks who can easily counter Zen because they can’t handle the idea of a mere support forcing a swap.

Obviously if I say, ‘Zen is fine,’ people say, ‘lol sit down Zen main,’ because they unironically think Zen just discords the tank and goes AFK when in reality you only Discord a tank who is pushing you (and this is last-ditch self-defence in most cases) overextended, or after killing supports. In other words they were either attacking you, or going to die anyway you just made it happen faster.

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In entire honesty, I think a large part of it comes from subconscious peer pressure (EX: Everyone else says it, I need to also say it). I think that peer pressure originates from a place of misogyny/homophobia (to an extent).

There’s a reason people crap on Mercy/D.va/Sym more than Lucio/Rein/Torb for a reason… It’s not because one of those groups is easier than the other.

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Honestly, 90% of these threads are people complaining about other people and very little discussion as to actual balance. That’s regardless of whichever “side” you take, really. It can honestly be hard to just have a conversation about a character without people getting worked up.

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I’m fine with saying that Mercy is the easiest hero. Heck, I’m fine with people going “A mercy main? Hmm, I don’t know about this” in regards to skill. The difference? I’ll never say the literal lie of “Mercy does not provide value” and suggest that everything mercy mercy does is some how not providing value.

I’m not okay with the constant suggesting that Mercy’s bad BECAUSE she’s not a pew pew character, that Overwatch is somehow not ready to handle characters who don’t fit in the typical shooter mold. Seriously, is that the kind of game you guys want to play? Where every character is the same barring slightly different guns and slightly different support abilities that aren’t allowed to be good because people will complain?

Soldier, Baptiste, Bastion, and Sojourn are all DANGEROUSLY close to being similar to each other, and really that’s a big blow to Overwatch’s identity. We want more of that?

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…huh…? Explanation please…? :thinking:

Seagull syndrome is still alive and well

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Sure, last thread I was called out for my icon! People seem to go rabid for anything except the actual point when it comes to Mercy.

For the sake of discussing changes to Mercy I’d like to see; rework her blue beam as THAT a constant factor in major DPS problems over the years.

It could be a damage reduction beam if needed. If not, then an empowerment for her healing beam instead.

Why not give her a disarm/knockback ability on right-click instead? She quickly casts the end-half of her caedecus animation, slamming her staff down and knowing people away.

Allow it to be used while moving so she can Guardian Angel in and save the day with a cheaky disarm!

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I know its not your main point but personally I’m pretty iffy on saying Mercy is the easiest hero. Its such a subjective point that is different between everyone so having such a broad statement like mercy shouldn’t be good because she is the easiest is the kind of things that tick me off. I mean personally no-one can convince me that Lucio is not the easiest hero in the world. But I know people view him differently so its a pointless argument you know.

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Because nobody had to play Medic. In fact a lot of the time you ended up having to beg people to pay medic. I’ve had people try to pay me to play Medic on their mid-tier UGC teams, because nobody wanted to play him. People understood that Medic was pretty miserable to play and they were generally grateful to the players who were willing to take one for the team and be the only healer.

Even when OW1 launched, with no role queue and just Lucio, Zen and Mercy as supports, there wasn’t a whole lot of harassment. Yeah, you got eGirl jokes (remember: there were “Medic mains are either gay or somebody’s girlfriend or both” jokes too) but having a Mercy main on your team was pretty lucky. You were all set for healing, and it was one less person who was gonna fight you over a DPS slot.

In Overwatch, you’re guaranteed two supports even if you have to wait fifteen minutes for them to queue, and there are a lot of support classes to choose from. So. Yeah. People feel entitled to be choosy now–both about who they play with and who they play against.

And of course any time people have a choice, there are going to be that absolute babies who lose their minds when they don’t get their way. So they come up with any excuse as to why they should get their way, even if it means constructing elaborate narratives about how people who play (hero they don’t like) are just garbage, “mentally ill”, boosted, lazy, selfish…

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