Before I start I will state that I believe this combo is currently counterable by various methods. The main point of this thread is to show how our input and requests have directly lead to this Meta. As much as we all would love to blame the Dev’s on this we do hold partial responsibilty as well.
So this is some what of a rant with some constructive feedback. I am not making any suggestions in this thread. Just observations.
D.va no longer has a 4 second defense matrix.
This makes it far more difficult to stop grav and/or Dragonstrike. A large part of the community wanted Defense Matrix nerfed.
Mass Rez is gone.
I realize many people disliked mass rez but it did serve its purpose. To counter mass wipe combo’s. Especially any combo that involved Grav. Grav left your teammates bodies in a neat little pile for rez to work.
Our request to have it re-worked has made team wipe combo’s that much more powerful while making single target or low frag potential ults less valuable such as McCree or Roadhog’s.
Hanzo is now a counter to Winston…
instead of the other way around. His lunge is on a shorter cooldown then that of Winstons Jumppack which enables him to keep his distance when dived and Storm arrow is extremely easy to land on Winston. A lot of us (including myself) despised scatter arrow. I am still glad it is gone but Hanzo’s leap in conjunction with Storm arrow makes Winstons job against Hanzo pretty difficult. Not impossible but the fight does get favored by Hanzo now.
Zarya’s Grav can no longer be escaped by most movement abilities.
This one was not requested by the community at large. However, None of us saw this as a big deal due to most of us wanting dive to end and seeing anything that could curb dive as a boon not a curse.
I believe if this were one of the only changes to favor it then it would be fine but when you look at all the other changes that have been listed and look at the bigger picture this does compound the issue.
In conclusion I think we as a community have kind of brought this on ourselves. Having a poor understanding of balance and prioritizing “what feels good” over what is balanced and fair is a big contributor to the situation.
I am not asking for reverts of any changes here but I do think something or a number of things need to be done to bring balance back to the game. A tough job without a doubt.
10 Likes
Its also the easiest and most effective combo to use and win now. It doesnt require communication either. Basically every match boils down to who gets the combo first.
but anything + grav literaly is a team kill. you dont even need an ultimate.
grav. zarya spams RMB. junkrat throws mine. dps just mindlessly holds. gg
that always happens. grav is just strongest ult in game
5 Likes
because hanzo is meta
zarya hasnt changed at all, this combo has always been this way
7 Likes
I think it is only easy because of the changes I mentioned. There was a time when this combo was far more ineffective against various comps and less universal. However, after this many balance changes that indirectly buffed Grav+Dragonstrike it just made it that much easier and valuable.
1 Like
Not when half of the cast could escape it.
4 Likes
good that i got buffed then
why should the slowest charging ult in the game be easily escaped while shatter catches everyone unless you block it with shield
1 Like
Zaryas isnt really the slowest. Trans, sound barrier and rally all charge way slower.
I would argue that although team wipes are definitely possible by other means without an Ult those options still have more feasible and reliable counters. Barriers, Support ults, and etc are more effective mitigation tools against other options.
Hence why Dragonstrike is preferred. It has less things to stop it in general.
1 Like
i don’t think you play zarya at all
unless you’re feeding zarya to gain 100% all the time then you will not get grav before any of those ults
A zarya constantly doing stuff VS a zen and a lucio constantly doing stuff will get ult first. Why? Because its cost is lower than them. Unless lucio boops like 3 people.
No…No…No. Hanzo and Grav was always the “Best Combo” . because of how much damage it does unless you have a Zen your Screwed. Your Just making a post now because he is in the meta not because he is “OP”
again i don’t think you play zarya at all
zen and lucio gains ult when they heal and when do damage
zarya needs to gain charge to gain good ult charge and needs someone to feed on her like a roadhog or dva even with all that a zen can still pull out a trans before grav
1 Like
This is extremely debatable. Also dont keep telling me “you dont play zarya” cause you only have 3 hours on her yourself. A zarya can get her ult way sooner than the zen unless she isnt playing well at all.
EDIT: Not to mention how Mercy in the current meta can simply damage boost her to help her get ult way faster to begin with.
Grav is also the only CC ult that allows you to reactively deploy a support ult to counter it, lets you keep your shields up to block incoming damage, and lets you shoot back at the things lining up on you to kill you. Earthshatter’s weakness (minus bugs) is that it can be blocked/dodged; Blizzard’s is that it can be escaped with mobility/invuln; Grav’s is that the people in it aren’t stunned or slowed, but just held. [Ed: and of course both Blizzard and Graviton Surge are projectiles that can be reflected or deleted]
Overwatch has been on an “aggression creep” for a while now.
Defensive kits and playstyles keep getting reworked to be more agressive, and now we’re seeing the downside of that.
1 Like
It’s more like Briggite is introduced to the game which pairs great with Reinhardt. Zarya also pairs great with Reinhardt and Hanzo just got a buff.
i know that grav+ anything is a team kill i did it on 4 out of 6 once with a zarya i got them to partner up to do the ult combo i was a tracer and they was a zarya and watch it take out brigitte was probably one of the best sights i seen
solution: Orisa Reinhard Mae
I would not say grav+anything is a team kill or zarya alone with any other team comp would pretty much be unstoppable all the time. Dragonstrike is the preferred combo because the damage cannot be blocked by barriers, and once it’s casted by hanzo it cannot be stopped. Most other combinations with grav have more counterplay available.
Most normal forms of damage can be blocked with barriers. Rocket barrage can be counter via barriers to blocked some or all of the damage, and it is also channeled so she can be stunned/hacked/slept out of it - or simply be focused down and killed. Junkrat tire has low HP so it’s pretty hit or miss depending on the grav location. Dva bomb can be absorbed entirely with a barrier as long as it’s not detonated directly in the center.