“People just need time to figure out Sym”

I will agree that those other movements matter. That being said, its not as if Sym didn’t need to actually do some form of maneuvering as well. One could theoretically get by without fade, or with using it less effectively. Of all the characters Moira is without question the next in line. Sym auto-lock didn’t entirely remove the question of movement or positioning, she just limited it to the greatest degree. I am sympathetic and thought it was both good design and a boon to those with disabilities that auto-lock existed, and a shame that Blizz feels that introducing gay characters matters but supporting people with physical disabilities don’t count as much. That all being said, Moira is easily the next in line.

Let me again retort - these are facts such as in the case of the orb - it is still a very damaging weapon, I didn’t say it was equal only that it is quite effective.

You may think the teleporter has the worst mobility, but it’s still more than poor Zen or most of the roster has. I use it effectively and so do others.

On the light saber question, I can only say I play almost every character to one degree or another, and few in close quarters can compare. As I said, pre-charge is the key, and knowing when to use it. It is anything but weak. You say most DPS can hit those numbers, but I don’t see it in play. Sym will do better here than you are giving her credit for.

What comes out in the Sym posts is this:

I want a character that takes little effort to play; she has a near instant teleporter with gigantic range, anything less just sucks. I want an auto-lock weapon that melts everyone, despite how it is perceived by much of the community, I want a shield generator when Blizz is moving away from armor which the generator effectively was. On top, I want a move to 250 health despite having regenerative shielding already. For turrets, people will never be happy because they are a secondary ability not a prime, but some folks want effectively Torb turrets out of them on top of everything else.

Sym is my favorite character, but what is being proposed by the community frankly is a character that would be OP and frankly not that challenging to play.

I still wonder what they were thinking with specimen 28 :thinking:.
They really just shouldn’t have bothered.

It’s kind of lore skin, from Winston’s time at lunar colony. Space suits usually not made fashionable, especially ones for giant gorilla.

Yeah but really what does it achieve? Cosmetics should be made to be enjoyed as a cosmetic, not a supplement for the lack of story telling in the game.
Even so, there should be nothing stopping the devs for making the skin appealing, it could have looked like anything.

Mostly, people want Sym2 back, with maybe the throwing turrets asset. Some (like me) would be happy with minor improvements.


How did you assume I don’t play Sym? What’s even an ‘actual’ Sym player? If someone plays Sym then they play Sym, dead simple. If people who don’t main and insta lock her to death know how to use her kit then I see no reason why people who devote all their time on her can’t even try to adapt to what’s available.

There are top players fully showing how current Sym can be used to her full potential. Why are we still even debating about her ‘lack of consistency’ or whatever when really that’s not what you really want.

Sym 4.0 can’t and won’t happen. No hero should be revamped so many times it becomes a different hero every time.

i think its funny that most Sym players i run across still dont know that her ammo is restored when they attack a shield. restore ammo and build to max power, why do shield tanks still get picked again?

That hardly matters. It’s faster to reload than it is to recharge her ammo on shields. If she’s busy attacking shields, she’s not doing damage. Unless Orisa is feeding you shields, free charges on shields don’t happen.

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Because if you are shooting the shield you are in range of everyone standing behind said shield. So unless you have a weird angle (the beam of death is quickly gonna give your position away) or is behind your own shield, any half competent team will quickly gun you down.

Even if unopposed you wont melt the shield that fast, several seconds at least and if you run through the shield to attack before it is down chances are that even at full charge you would have been better of doing it as Reaper than Symmetra.


There is been some kind of idea, for Symmetra stealing shield health and adding it to her own, by attacking enemy barrier. Over time extra barrier would decay.

You mean, if your aim is above 80% accuracy.

Which is like… 1% of the playerbase?

Face it: The only thing that improved is the teleporter. Everything else saw a drastic decline in either gameplay design, value output, or both. The only thing that 3.0 has over 2.0 is the teleporter.

If your team isn’t using your teleporter, you’re worse off.


Nope. Accuracy is relative, specially vs Shields and huge tanks. Dont make generalizations

Face it : You are in denial.

  • M1 does more damage, literally better.
  • Turrets have more HP and do more damage and can be thrown without risk, literally better.
  • Orbs dont pierce but they are faster, load faster, do more damage and also splash.
  • TP as you mentioned is better.
  • The ultimate does actually shield you from focused damage.

Hard to swallow pill : Most of the people that want Sym 2.0 can’t aim or adapt. It is what it is. You can still run around in this thread all you want, facts won’t change.

Good luck buddy.

Not sure how on Earth I am creating a “straw man” fallacy, not sure you understand exactly what that is, but I notice people are throwing this video and meme up lately as a defense of sorts. Posting a link doesn’t somehow shore up the false accusation.

The points I have mentioned are pretty obviously what people across the board want.

To say it hardly matters is a serious overstatement. Considering well over half the matches in QP and even probably 90% in Comp have a shield bearer at the center of the group, it’s a serious advantage if you press it.

It literally does NOT!

The 120 DPS was guaranteed. The 180 is contingent on accuracy, meaning that you need an accuracy of 66% or higher to break even, and that is NOT counting the extended wind-up AND the fact that that ALSO became contingent on accuracy.

I calculated it. If you want to break even with Symm 2.0 over the first six seconds of combat, you NEED 80% accuracy, at which point your average DPS is 1 higher, and at 4 seconds, EVEN with 80% accuracy, your average DPS is 10 LOWER on Symm 3.0 than 2.0.

80% accuracy should NOT be worse!

Her M1 is garbage. It is the worst weapon in the game bar NONE. It’s a squishy hero with almost no mobility, wielding a short range weapon that gets a unique drawback in exchange for thoroughly mediocre DPS.

Tracer gets 240. Reaper gets 280. Even flipping TORBJORN, who has way better tools for getting close and surviving it, has 250. NONE of those count headshots. Symmetra is stuck with 180 at that range, but not only that, she has to spend four seconds (80% accuracy, anything lower and that duration increases) doing either abysmal DPS or NO damage.

SO A) In ordinary circumstances, her DPS is LOWER, and B) it is WAY harder to achieve, especially in comparison to literally any other hero.

The throwing mechanism is an improvement. The cooldown is a sliiiight improvement. Everything else is a downgrade. Fewer turrets means they’re easier to dispatch (equivalent destruction ALWAYS required two shots in vastly different directions for 2.0, now it takes only one for most of the roster.) and they cover a much smaller area. They break much faster, leaving a less consistent presence on the field. They attack from fewer angles, making barriers more effective.

But they’re not fast enough to be usable at medium range, and they’re also nothing compared to any other DPS weapon, on top of now also not being uniquely effective against barriers.

Provided your enemy doesn’t step through it. Provided your team doesn’t step through it. Provided it places all right. And even on all of that, it still -feels- awful and doesn’t help Symmetra herself enough.

But only on higher tiers where teammates will actually use it. And it’s STILL suffering from the absolutely godawful ‘snap-to-closest’ targeting mechanism. Like… WHY.

If you can aim well enough to make Symmetra 3.0 work, you can reach top50 with any other hero. Symm doesn’t reward you.


You were sort of making an exaggeration so that sort of qualifies for a Strawman but yes, he has been throwing that in several posts. Basically when you disagree and claim his demands/statements are extreme and non realistic, he will throw Strawman or Ad hominem to try to take relevance from your rebuttal (ironic, because thats an ad hominem itself).

Talking about people that cant adapt and/or aim and make unrealistic claims:

In what world dude? In a world where all tracers spraying from 10mt away are Top500/Dafran with 60% accuracy ? In a world where ALL reaper’s pellets hit EVERY SINGLE character in the game for its FULL damage at 4-6mt away?

Yep, confirmed.


So you will judge Symmetra for 100% accuracy values only but when I bring out that 100% accuracy under similar conditions gets you WAY higher value on other short range heroes, NOW accuracy is an issue?


Yep, i can do it because you are literally judging the new beam under the 100% accuracy of the OLD 2.0 beam, which is unfair and is literally, factually and empirically demostrating that you belong to those who cant aim and/or adapt to the new changes.

Btw, Sym has ZERO spread, now please go ahead and tell me that is the exact same to have 50% accuracy with Reaper/Tracer at 10mt+ than with Sym 3.0 at 10mt.

Stop mate. Seriously you are exposing yourself.

How am I doing that?

Seriously, what about Symm 3.0 am I holding to 100% accuracy? Or are you complaining that I am comparing it to the 100% accuracy of 2.0? Because let me remind you, 2.0 was 100% accuracy with no exception. That was the POINT.

YOU stated 3.0’s M1 does more damage. -I- explained that A) it doesn’t, if you account for accuracy, and B) even if it did, considering its drawbacks, it is abysmal in comparison to similar shortrange heroes like Reaper, Torbjorn and Tracer.