I agreed with most of what you wrote, but in regards specifically to the statement quoted above…I prefer an effective team over a so-called “balanced” team. I want a team that can adjust to what the other team is doing. and etc.
I really don’t see the alleged “balance” of a 222 team as being an advantage, I see those restrictions as a disadvantage, albeit I’ll of course concede that in 222 both teams are weighed down by that same disadvantage
I agree, I love OQ because of the whacky and weird team comps you can come up with that are still effective, and work better than 222. The only reason I said 222 is more balanced is, as you said, both teams are limited.
np dude and understood.
I just dont see it as an advantage or a good thing, is all
I mean the brig problem open queue has is since all the normal playerbase plays role queue stats are skewed heavily and plats get boosted to masters. It becomes a problem when I’m masters in role queue pretty much playing against plats. Its not very fun as its just a steam role
open queue feels easier, I pick the role the team needs, queue as roles though, im liable to end up in a situation where I just cant carry or counter.
Role queue is so stiffling, thanks to role queue you can’t play dps anymore, might as well retire, unless you wanna wait like 30 minutes between matches.
No thanks, this game must be dead or something w/ how long it takes to find matches.
do you have any valid data to support this claim?
Personally, I almost never play 222 modes, and many others have stated the same on various 222 threads throughout this forum
mind you, since Blizzard has not yet re-added role-less qp to the main game selection screen yet, I’m asking this for competitive only
open role is basically the objectively better mode, role queue was introduced because it was a handicap that forced 222 on competitive play.
Blizzard basically nerfed out flexibility in role choice for comp, at least they added open back in because i’m sure they themselves realize this is what they did.
They are trying to make the game less complex, I don’t know if this is really a good thing though because now I can’t play DPS really in qp.
I spent 3-4 (?) seasons in OQ right when it came out. Came back to RQ when priority passes came out and it’s harder than I remember it.
I was maybe ~200 higher in OQ than RQ at the time OQ came out but kept seeing golds and plats in masters. But now I’m back in RQ I’m lower than I’ve ever been in RQ and 2 of my best 4 hero’s are pretty meta. OQ ruined me maybe.
Specifics of your “servey group” and how exactly you came to that conclusion aside, in my personal experience, OQ queue times have overall ranged between Tank and Support RQ queue times.
But, I have heard lits of people in these Forums who play on more unpopulated servers for example like OCE that OQ queue times are even longer than RQ DPS queue times, so therefore, no, this isn’t an objective claim.
Completely false. This ““notion”” you’re talking about can and had been enforced without any bribe whatsoever. There were though many complaints about the collateral damage that are high queue times. Each and every single change such as the lootbox/coin awards for playing underpopulated roles, Flex queue and the major matchmaking changes a few years ago that may or may have not gone through (as far as I remember, RQ queue times after this change became almost instant, but I think at the expense of match quality. Queue times returned to normal though shortly after, hinting that such changed may have not actually gone through. I don’t really remember the specifics) all had a clear purpose that was stated again and again in the Dev updates: to reduce queue times.
If players had no problem with queue times and/or we lived in a utopia, then none of the above changes would be needed, period, so they have nothing to do with enforcing the fundamental ““notion”” of RQ in the first place (also, if we lived in a utopia, we wouldn’t had needed RQ in the first place).
If my and your anecdotal and personal accounts can be validated by actual evidence and it’s true that OQ queue times are lower than RQ DPS queue times, then yes, this statement would be true.
Even though I certainly disagree that OQ somehow gives players access to “higher skilled” and more effective “micro/macro/meta strategies” compared to RQ, all of this is a very understandable interpretation.
But, since this is a skill cap discussion and nothing more, then the lack of an ability to switch roles mid - game in RQ can also enhance said cap, as the player will have to be much more proficient in the heroes of the role they choose, as they can’t just switch to the enemy’s counters and call it a day. And of course playing heroes that aren’t in the advantageous position if being counters is a much more difficult task in the first place.
Dunno why you say hard wrong when I didn’t dismiss these theoretical advantages of OQ.
And once again, more options to throw.
Completely false. You know that the people who instantly pick DPS are so often the ones crying about 222, wanting more Healers and yelling at Tanks to push, right?
These players both want to play DPS all the time and have a team that fulfills basic prerequisites (prerequisites according to the devs themselves judging by the tips that would pop up in the hero selection screen pre - 222, encouraging teams to select more Tanks and Healers). For these people and especially Tank/Support players with their low queue times, RQ is a win - win solution. Both for the selfish and selfless players.
These players, along with the fake ““Flexers”” of pre - RQ, are the members of the normal player base that are responsible for RQ’s necessary status in the first place.
Zero math used. Moving on.
Once again, zero objectiveness involved.
Completely false statement. It provides no resteictions, just as you like to say, so this ““containment”” point is nonsensical.
And that’s exactly why it was wiped off the game for years… Sure 
Cheap - and invalid - blows… Not the indication of a solid, secured stance… That’s for sure.
Open queue is the real competitive mode. Ask anybody who has been playing since launch.
We’ll get nowhere arguing about queues, but with 2/3 of the roles being bribed, the dominant one here is DPS. And as for dps, the queues are shorter with open - roughly 3/2 times shorter.
Either people want dps, or they don’t. Since dps queues are longest, by a large margin in 222, it’s objective to say “dps is the most popular role”. In fact, with queue times as guidance, it’s likely that dps demand trumps the combined demand of tank+support. For that reason, bypassing queues via OPEN comp puts the supply/demand back into relevance.
And that’s an objective measure for you - 222 is an out-of-touch, broken model with supply/demand mistmatches covered by bribes and egregious queues.
= bad for game, broken model. A bandaid fix to dodge an admission of guilt, and justifiable revert.
No it can’t, and doesn’t. You can opt to ‘challenge yourself’ in OPEN comp by 1tricking or other handicaps to increase proficiency, if you so desire. The fact that more options are at the very least on the table, even if they’re trash, increases skillcap from a sheer combinatorics perspective.
Not true at all. Evidence, please. Quality is always a gamble. No1 should gamble with certifiably more options, freedom, and shorter queues. Open is objectively better.
Well considering it takes 8-10 minutes for me to find and that top 500 has less than half of it is GM players i would say most of the players play role queue.
none of that is valid data to support the claim that was made
I wish there was a competetive mode for formed teams only with a clan-system etc. You’d build your own clan, form competetive teams and queue up in this mode against other clans that did the same. This would solve most (if not all) of the issues that come with playing with randoms.
Open Queue is competitive point farming for people looking to complete their golden gun collection, change my mind.
The game needed this like 3-4 years ago. It’s FAR too late for it to be impactful in OW1 right now. OW2 may have it, but honestly I wouldn’t hold out hope for game redefining features like actual 6-player premade matchmaking through guilds or hero bans. It’s just not Blizz quality /s
Yes let me hack into the blizzard server to get the only statistics you will accept.
If it takes me 8-10 minutes to get into a game where it only needs 11 other players vs 5 minutes when it needs ones for different roles I can tell you for sure less people play role queue. If you cant accept that you need to go take basic math.
a statement was made as if it were a known fact.
it is not unreasonable to ask for the data to support such a statement
If diamonds are in top 500 the gamemode is dead
waaaait
and you, of course, did that on a bunch of your accounts and all the impacted accounts shifted down?
Of course it is and I never argued against this specific point. Even the devs themselves released statistics years ago that prove exactly this.
Completely false. The fact that RQ enforces a 222 model doesn’t mean it’s out - of - touch, it just does its job of enforcing some basic structure, which so many players refused to even consider before, therefore causing problems.
Like, with your logic, were the Brig nerfs back in the day of release Brig that targeted a play style out of touch because so many high - ranked players used to abuse said play style?
I don’t think so.
False. Everything in this world has negative side effects. Dismissing them at their entirety due to said side effects is nonsensical to say the least.
Once again, a revert of RQ is nothing more than an unwarranted pipe dream, especially now that it coexists with OQ.
I’m once again not denying this. I’m just pointing out another perspective that makes sense, just like this specific one you mentioned.
Oh, so you don’t remember all the people instant - locking DPS and then crying for Heals and Tanks?
Fair enough, no problem.
Much less so though when there’s less options to mess up 
For the final time. Zero. Objectiveness. Involved.