OMG I forgot she used to be a “support”
Just rework the hero entirely.
Its hard to balance him if you tweak one way or the other it can make him to op or just a throw pick. I do however believe the m2 punch needs to be increased in distance and base the knockback off of his charge.
Widow has to land a head shot. Her shots streak across the map. Her utility is limited, and she’s EASILY countered. I did it today on my first time ever playing Winston on comp.
You have to realize too that the vast majority of the players in this game are platinum or below, and that each rank is completely different. In fact, different areas of the same rank are different. A blanket statement like this is just stupid. That’s like if a GM player were to tell a bronze player that if they die to a Junkrat ult because they don’t have 84% accuracy, then they deserved it.
Ya, if they were a GM player, maybe they did, but not at bronze, silver, gold, etc. It’s subjective.
Or you can:
Turn into a solid block of ice or create an obstruction.
Go super saiyan.
Fly into the air.
Dart further than the ability can reach
Climb a wall.
Evaporate into a cloud
Blink through time.
Fade into the distance.
Become an immovable object
I can keep going.
Rocket punch is one of the most telegraphed abilities in the game- and nearly every hero can straight up tank, block, evade, dodge, avoid, disrupt, or straight up ruin RP from doing anything.
RP is so disruptable that good Doomfists rarely actually use it for offense outside of opportune moments- and instead rely on it for an escape.
If you’d complained about his ability to blind Hail Mary over a roof top with a full charged slam, uppercut, and shotgun combo an unsuspecting squishy down quickly I’d have understood.
But RP? Literally one of the single most limited abilities in the game- it roots him to a crawl, lights him up, is one of the loudest non ult abilities in the game. Can’t be fired up. Or down- and can only be fired straight. Only does partial damage up front- requiring you to hit a wall to get the rest of the damage. Within a finite angle, of course. Too wide of an angle and the target will instead just slide.
RP is fine.
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And here’s where a huge disconnect comes in. Here we have a player who could be in Master, talking about how balanced Doomfist is. 4% of the playerbase in Overwatch is in Master/GM. Even if you’re in Diamond, you account for 14% of the entire playerbase–you just don’t speak for the playerbase. That’s like the 1% wealthiest speaking for the rest of the nation.
A lot of people know for instance that Reaper is best at lower ranks, and starts to get really bad at high ranks. Does that mean he needs to be buffed up because he’s so poor in the highest ranks? Of course not. We’re talking about almost all of the population of this game–76% of it (96% if we’re only removing Master/GM).
So when you talk about how you, “lack the skill to counterplay him”, that’s like a Koch brother lecturing the rest of the country on how we should distribute governmental resources. After all, everything’s good for them.
Honestly on this front you really have little say. You’re such a tiny minority of the playerbase that we shouldn’t even be catering to you or what you want. That’s not to say we shouldn’t care, but you’re just such a tiny minority–we just can’t be having discussions that cater to such minute demographics when the impacts of those caterings could be so high on virtually the rest of the players.
At the end of the day, it’s just selfish thinking. It’s saying: I am literally a fraction of the population that can do this, so the rest of you should suffer because I can do what almost none of you can.
That’s insane.
Use your ears.
No, it’s just that you’re literally walking into it.
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Hanzo can aim up.
Or down.
Isn’t limited to at most 20 meters.
Can hold his arrow for as long as he likes- instead of having it fire for him after a couple seconds automatically.
Doesn’t scream or light up like a Christmas tree while holding and give away his position.
Can lunge while charging to reposition.
Doesn’t have a cooldown.
Can still KO you with a single shot
Doesn’t require you to hit a wall to kill you.
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You’re missing the entire point. The entire point isn’t that the fist is counterable if you SEE him, it’s that the ability does so much damage that it can one-shot and you don’t even know he’s there, like around a corner.
Yes, you can do all of those things if he starts charging up right in front of you, but in any other situation, you either have to just hit those abilities and hope you survive, plus burn them down, or you have to hope he wasn’t targeting you.
I have been cheesed by this so often around corners and the like. We’re not talking about abilities that can be countered here, we’re talking about the player not even meaning to hit you, but they just do because you happened to turn the corner and get instantly kill you.
That kind of RNG doesn’t belong in a game like this, and before you go off on how you just listen for his charge-up and not go around corners, if you read my initial posts where I discussed that it isn’t always possible to know where it’s coming from. You could be busy focused on blocking something just as threatening, or freezing a healer, or protecting a team mate, so you wouldn’t know if he’s around that corner or if he’s right behind you.
That’s really my biggest complaint isn’t how powerful it is if it didn’t get random kills. The fact that it deals so much damage in a single hit makes that a problem. That isn’t a thing that happens with the snipers. I know where the snipers are–they’re in the back almost every time, and I almost never get one shot sniped. I die too often to Doomfist punches from around corners compared to even being one-shot sniped, and that’s when I KNOW where it’s coming from.
You’re not reading all the posts. The sound won’t tell you where he is, only that he’s using the skill. Even another poster admitted that it, “sorta does”, referring to how you can “sorta” tell where he is if you use headphones.
I saw your point.
It’s just wrong.
Even if you can’t see him it is the loudest ability in the game and can be heard charging quite easily.
You don’t NEED to see him to counter RP.
You can do them if he’s around a corner too.
Player error.
There’s no RNG about it
It’s pretty binary.
I read them.
Again-
You’re simply wrong.
After the fact. Not before. Any place Doomfist can pop from, a sniper can too.
Player error.
Okay, if the sound is loud, he’s nearby. If it is quiet, he is far away.
Additionally, if he gives you so much trouble, go switch onto one of his many counters.
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Overwatch uses 3 dimensional sound.
You can hear exactly where things are.
Above you. Behind you. Beside you. On the other side of a wall. How far the source of the sound is. Etc.
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I mean, if you’re deaf maybe. It sounds like that meme with Snake; “HhhnnnnnGG!”
But there’s a cool thing added into the game called subtitles, and those subtitles will tell you who’s using what ability around you and if they’re on the enemy team or yours.
Let’s play your game then. So what if it is player error? Who cares? The majority of the players in this game are in the lower ranks. Almost all of those players are going to perform player error. Those players shouldn’t die to stray one-shots that can change entire matches based off of that.
Take your high horse elsewhere. If you’re any rank above plat, you honestly have almost no say. You’re then just the tiny minority telling the rest of the players that it’s fine because YOU don’t have that player error.
I play this game to have fun, and when I am in situations in a game that I feel are within my control, I have fun–when I don’t, I don’t have fun.
And that is not my subjection. Studies have been done on this. Players in games do not have as much fun when they feel like their choices aren’t “fair”. Like when they feel like they died to a stray punch from around a corner that they couldn’t have possibly known about.
So who cares? Nerf it or change it.
For all you players talking about how it’s player error and the like, if you’re any rank past plat, I’m ignoring you because you’re just 1%ers trying to tell the rest of the country that the wealth distribution is cool the way it is because it happens to all work in your favor.
This entire game isn’t the same game. Bronze isn’t the same game as gold. Gold isn’t the same as diamond. This isn’t linear. I’m in high silver/low gold–if that isn’t you, you don’t play the same game that I do. It’s that simple.
Not just sort of. For anyone who isn’t functionally deaf, sound in headphones should be sufficient to perfectly locate ANYTHING you hear, even the much quieter sounds, and ESPECIALLY doomfists rocket punch, being easily the single most loud sound effect in the game, when you hear that charge you should know EXACTLY where he is.
It’s not an insane concept to use sound to your advantage, nor is it insane to be able to tell where most things are coming from reliably.
If you still have trouble, or some shoddy headphones that give you grief, try enabling The “Dolby Atmos” setting, as it’s made for stereo output, but gives you a much higher degree of directional sound.
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Are we talking about balance or handicaps? It makes all the difference.
Let’s play your game as well.
Where the majority of the players exist in this game Doomfist is a 50% win rate hero, of lower- and absolutely doesn’t over perform.
Actually I’m telling you he’s fine where you play because where you play he wins half of his games in the dot.
But you could have known about it. By using your ears.
And he’s not overpowered in high silver / low gold.
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Use your ears or use the subtitles too. As soon as you see the words “(DOOMFIST) (charging rocket punch)” on your screen, you’ll know that he’s charging it somewhere on the map.
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Oh my, it actually gives subtitles for sound effects without voice lines?
That’s a very good and helpful bit of advice :o
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SidewaysGts, you already have no say here, as you’re extremely bias. I looked up your profile.
You’re a Doomfist main.
Top heroes, Doomfist at 213 hours. Come. On. LOL
You also play Quick Play. I don’t care about Quick Play. I should have put this in Comp discussion. Victories in QP are meaningless. Last QP match I played we had 6 dps. Nobody takes QP seriously. I don’t care if Doomfist has 10 million HP and has one skill that just kills all players on the enemy team every 10 seconds from anywhere on the map, because QP win/loss has no value.
Move on. This only matters in comp where a single cheese death from around a corner matters.
Also, that isn’t good enough of a metric to assume his viability. You need more data. What’s his K/D ratio when compared to the other heroes? Which heroes, and how many heroes, kill him most often when compared to other heroes?
For example, does he actually die less frequently than all of the other dps against the most heroes? When you segregate the players with the most play time on DPS heroes, how does he stand out per rank?
It’s not as simple as win/loss. That’s too generic. This is why we’re moving to 2-2-2 with an independent rank per hero type–because the devs even found out while playtesting that many players are actually over or under performing on certain hero types than their actual ranks. Jeff himself said he was playing at an entire rank higher when he played tank, but doing even worse on support than he thought.
That puts everything into perspective. This game came out 3 years ago, so for THREE YEARS we have been using a ranking system that isn’t even true. It literally can’t be! Because even developers note that when they create a more granular system for mapping skill, it FLUCTUATES based off of hero type. That puts into question where you actually should be playing. If you should be a rank higher as a tank, but you can’t always play a tank (or you don’t realize you’re playing as a rank higher), then you won’t climb to that rank. Especially if you land in the kind of situation that Jeff apparently did. If he’s a rank higher on tank but thought he was good with support and plays a lot of support, he won’t climb because support is actually his weakest.
And for 3 years there wasn’t enough evidence for this until now.
ANGRY DOOMFIST NOISES