DPS forcing metas? That would be a first.
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Sarcasm right? DPS kind of also forced GOATS to develop as a way to counter double sniper.
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Well, given that Mei couldn’t be used as a defence in old dive, then… well… maybe you CAN play into her, since she was useless vs it.
But triple/quad (which sometimes included double sniper) DPS countered goats.
But no, pretty much all metas were dictated by tank, and a few by supports. Double sniper is maybe the one exception and I personally felt that grav was more important than dragon in grav dragon. But Das jis me.
To be honest, can’t really say I disagree.
Though I will say I think this update proved nerfing shield health doesn’t solve the problems they pose. They can’t be too weak or too strong, and I don’t think it’s realistic to expect an actual balance.
I think all shields except Rein’s need more counterplay, weakspots you can shoot to take them down more quickly. For example, Winston’s barrier should be destructible if you shoot the generator on the inside, this way you could take it down more quickly. They could compensate by giving Winston some kind of alt fire. Orisa’s generator sits behind the barrier on the ground, so being able to shoot it to bring it down makes sense.
Sigma, he either needs weakspots while it’s being deployed, or have it not block any damage until it’s deployed, because this makes him vulnerable until it is set.
When it comes to damage though, I just think certain heroes will never be balanced as they are. Mainly Reaper, his kit needs to be fully reworked so he’s actually good at Flanking and killing Tanks. Like some kind of crazy child of the Scout and Spy from TF2.
That was before 8 buffs though.
I like this idea:
None of which help her vs the winston barrier which is what stopped her. Like, I don’t expect her to be ANY kind of defence against it again.
Ill agree he isnt good with dive. Hard to hit your heals on a bunch of mobile heroes and there are better choices. But he is great with rein/zarya as tanks. Any comps where the tanks are not dive, and the dps isnt like tracer and doom/genji and bap would be great. He doesnt need it to be bunker, just slower comps.
Didn’t they nerf barrier dancing by making the freezing ticks last longer?
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Huh, yeah, you are right there, it was designed as a nerf to moblity heroes, but, yes, it will help against barrier dancing.
I don’t think it will be nearly enough, but you are right, there IS a buff there.
I just cry every time someone says “piercing” is a buff against winston, it is like, you don’t even manage to freeze one person, what the hell makes you think you will freeze 2 people?
But yeah, that IS a buff.
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Yeah I don’t get that either.
But yeah, I really wouldn’t recommend Winston vs Mei. She doesn’t freeze you outright, but Winston has enough trouble unfreezing himself that you usually have to bail before you get anything done or get frozen.
I like the idea of D.va being able to protect dive teams from Mei so she’s not such a gatekeeper. It’d also help Sigma but I think he’ll still be countered by her.
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Generally no, but, when it is part of Winston / D’va and 2 flankers jumping on the support, Mei isn’t going stop any of them, nor will she save the support.
All you have done taking Mei is have one less person who can counter dive the enemy… so YOUR dive is less effect than their dive is.
Lucio was by FAR the better defence vs dive, in that as they jump in, he speed boosts the Zen the hell out of there. That worked pretty well. It was his job in dive 
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He then also would then try to slow down the ever present Tracer, since the fight wasn’t totally one sided.
But mostly, his job was to press speed boost the very moment they saw the Winston jump, so they wouldn’t be where the dive landed.
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But now Mei can freeze the Winston and D.va at the same time. Lucio can speed his whole team, Mei can slow all the divers instead now. And she can do stuff like fight Genji at range, which she couldn’t before.
Mei would still counter dive if freeze was matrixable, but not D.va Winston dive as much, which is an extremely inpopular combo right now. Hammond still would hardly be playable into Mei.
Oh yeah, you GOTTA dive with Winston into Mei.
Doing a Hammond dive into her would end in tears.
I ACTUALLY think the real counter to dive is 2-2-2. No one will queue to be the supports who’s job it is to be food for both the tanks and flankers.
No games = no dive.
I wouldn’t queue for it, unless I was IN a team, but the combo of 2-2-2 AND stopping higher ranked players from grouping up more than 3 people at a time?
No one is going to queue for that mess. “Someone else can support”
Imagine thinking anything is remotely balanced in such an asymmetrical game.
Starcraft was crazy asymmetrical. It could be balanced.
But they were balancing more on maths than on feels. They certainly didn’t balance on what streamers were saying.
I probably don’t quite know what I’m getting into by saying this but dive doesn’t scare the support side of me, we have Moira.
I think the supports are pretty well balanced right now.
This is comical.
Hanzo Reaper and Mei definitely need changes. Doom is more annoying but dominant but I wouldn’t mind changes for him as well.
Moira was added during the height of dive, so you would have expected her to be played in it, but, it didn’t happen.
Mostly because the maths of the dive itself - She couldn’t be in the front line.
But Zen could (in a way). When 4 people dive a target, which Zen has discorded at 30%, then Zen is now doing over 1 entire hero of damage with that ability.
So, he is reducing the TTK by a lot.
But, with Moira, you will never be able to give that kind of value.
So you HAD to run Zen, but you needed to protect him, so you had to run Lucio.
The only time that shifted, was when Moth meta happened, and Mercy would dive with you, Because Rez, and damage boost. Or, she stayed back, and would Rez the Zen the moment the dive moved on 
Both tactics worked.
But the Zen were there because Discord made him the strongest damage dealer in the team.
Moira couldn’t compete.
It isn’t that she wouldn’t be able to resist the dive, it is that you wouldn’t need to dive her in the first place
These days he has less discord, so maybe the maths change.
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Tanks and supports dictate the way the team comp is played, but it’s the synergy between tanks and supports that either counters or enable the top dps which dictates which tanks/supports are being played.
- Season 2 bayblade with reaper, Ana rein zarya lucio all supported him.
- Season 3 triple tank with Soldier, Ana rein zarya and d.va both enabled and mitigated him.
- Season 4-9 dive with Tracer, d.va zen winston all enabled her.
- Season 7-9 bunker with jakerat, orisa mercy enabled him.
- Season 7-11 double sniper, mercy zen and d.va all enabled them, the days of pocket the widow.
- Season 12-15 goats, the synergy between 3 supports and 3 tanks all working together to keep double sniper out of the meta.