Which is why this idea isn’t to make an individual hero strong.
It’s to make a strategy that requires at least 2 players strong.
Since D.va with her matrix up isn’t much of a threat.
This is why D.va players are the WORST.
uh. D.Va making whoever she dived useless was the biggest threat of the entire comp.
I don’t think you have any idea how small 1 meter is in overwatch
Yeah, but a Dive comp, isn’t an individual hero just 1v1ing people to death. Like your examples.
I think I have a better understanding of it than most people on the forums.
That’s the problem the game is suffering.
While Rein can have a reliable barrier for that because he’s mono-task, playing defensively holding the barrier for your teammates is not the most attractive style, Rein is an “in your face” tank, people also want to play aggro Brawly style with him.
Then making multi-tasking tanks with barriers compared to Rein’s barrier uptime and reliability (which potentially could be more attractive) just proved to be “oppressive”, more advantageous than using the other tanks and slowed too much the paced of the game into barrier fight.
Therefore they nerfed Sigma and Orisa, but we went back to the reliable barrier problem involving Rein.
People want a tank to have that reliable defensive tool on their team, but they don’t want to play it because it’s not engaging enough (Rein style), and when it could potentially be, it’s not reliable enough for balance reasons (Winston barrier is more limited, Orisa’s and Sigma’s barriers got nerfed to be more limited too).
Roadhogs peel is to hook an kill something. Dva shuts that down currently let alone your Meka Godzilla. As for hooking Dva… 
hogs value comes from killing someone he’s hooked. Relying on hook as your disable for Dva is not good.
Hammond is great at displacing stuff and initiating said dive. Repelling a big gank…? The target will be dead and you’re just irritating your own team as they try and get some trades but the enemy is being knocked all over the place
This is the most effective counter which is atrocious design.
Zarya can save a single person that’s a plus. Rein/Zar ain’t gonna go well into this dive though. If you group up you can only save a single person, if you split, the flankers will wipe them out. Because of how crucial burst is, you’d just mirror Dva
With Orisa, you’d also just run Dva. Same as Sigma. But you wouldn’t pick them anyway cos you’d just pick Monkey/Ball 
So at worst for mid-ELOs you have Winston/D.va, Rein/D.va, Sigma/D.va, Rein/Zarya, Sigma/Zarya.
When compared to the status quo, of Rein/Zarya or nothing, that ain’t bad.
Despite the fact that “If Dive is dominant at high tier, that means Dive will be dominant at all ELOs” is probably not true. And wasn’t true the last time Dive was dominant.
I get what you’re trying to do.
Rein/Zarya run rampant in low elo because their tank synergy is really easy to pick up and understand. And Reins is the only shield that low elo players find viable enough to use. And a good shield goes far in low elos where positioning isn’t the best.
Orisa/Sigma (Orisa especially) aren’t going to be good single shield tanks for low elos because their shields suck compared to Reins for them. That’s what’s stopping them from being more viable and even sometimes an alternative to Rein.
So to do this yeah…you’d buff their shields. But you can’t do that without Double Barrier becoming instantly meta at high ranks and everyone raging.
And you’re right Dive should be a good comp to combat Double Shield because you just bypass the shields and attack them at close range.
But you just stick Brig/Bap & other anti-dive behind those shields and dive is useless.
So then it’s Double Shield mirror comps.
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Yeh that’s still bad. Also I think you’re getting carried away saying Sigma will be played alongside Zar/Dva. It’ll be Dva regardless, and whoever works best with Dva
You didn’t have the pick/win/etc of them last time dive was the be all/end all? From what I remember dive worked fine in plat, even if it lacked the coordination at the top 
regardless, these changes make dva stupid broken and remove most counters to dive. This is bad.
Better than the current situation we’re in.
Add in that Mei and Brig have never been popular below Diamond. So it’s pretty hard to believe countering them would impact Plat and below games much.
Also revert mccree reload time and nerf mercy dmg boost to 25%
GreyFalcon.
The way to buff D.Va is:
- Increase Defense Matrix to 12m
- Decrease the Fall-Off of her guns.
You should NOT remove counterplay from a character. This would literally make D.Va a MUST PICK. And I’m saying this as a D.Va main, THAT IS BROKEN!
The way I see it, metas are defined by the compositions with the least counterplay.
So reducing counterplay is literally the only way to make something be meta.
And after 3+ years of either high durability bunker, or high durability deathball, as the meta (with brief interruptions). Perhaps it’s time to get back to Dive.
Define: AntiDive.
Double barrier will become an issue, again.
There is no such thing.
Accretion is not a stun.
This is melee ability. It cannot be Defense Matrix’d unless Defense Matrix starts stopping all melee abilities. Which would be overpowering.
Then all other similar abilities would be stopped by Defense Matrix, that includes beams like Moira’s, Zarya’s and Symmetra’s. Which would be overpowering.
Cooldown would have to be lowered to 6 seconds. Otherwise you can’t have an up to 300 damage ability with an accuracy rating of less than 35% on a 10-second cooldown. Every other hero would be passing by Hanzo and Storm Arrows would be the worse damage ability in the game.
Can’t have this. The cooldown needs to be longer, or you make double-barrier the best overall strategy and composition in the game, again. Until you learn and understand why, this always be a bad change.
Same with this.
There’s nothing wrong with any of them.
This is false.
Yes it would, this also false.
The point is to reduce it’s effectiveness, not increase. This would not help.
This is also false. The problems with Overwatch - particularly it’s tanks - is a fundamental issue. It’s built right into its gameplay systems, and it cannot be changed without a complete rework of what Overwatch is. Something that can’t happen with Overwatch, but can with OW2.
Bad argument.
It’s not about the playerbase, it’s about game balance. Rendering a 25-second cooldown worthless because of a 1-second ability is never good balance or even a good idea.
Quoted for emphasis.
Again this is a bad argument. Strategies exist and metagame compositions are normal player behavior. The point is to make sure that any one strategy is viable, but not dominant. The problem with every metagame composition is that Blizzard does something stupid some months ago and doesn’t start seeing its effects until months later when the metagame shifts because of their frequent tweaking.
We don’t need to call people dumb. Ignorance can be an issue, but as long as they’re willing to learn and take feedback that’s fine. If they’re stubborn, that’s okay, too. Just stop responding to it. But don’t call them dumb, especially when they’re making an effort like this.
These pick rates look pretty normal. Obvious outliers are obvious; but everyone else is getting picked fairly commonly.
This is again, a bad argument. Your solutions won’t help the health of the game.
ALready exists. Your solutions would make D.va dominant and double-barrier dominant.
No one has problems with them.
Wouldn’t happen, either way.
Except this isn’t what happens in Overwatch. Overwatch is not, nor has it ever been a MOBA. It doesn’t even qualify because no such mechanics for the MOBA exists.
Basically what would happen is that Sigma/Orisa become part of the dominant double-barrier metagame and D.va is rendered into worthlessness. Or D.va becomes a dominant for a short time to counteract the current meta before becoming worthless as Double-barrier takes over.
Irrelevant.
Or just go Sigma/Orisa and double barrier, kinetic grasp and fortify for days.
Outsiide of Brigitte and Moth, Roadhog and Genji weren’t deliberately nerfed. Reversions did happen, however.
Aside from this, this is largely community (mis)perceptions. That can have an impact of the general state of the game, but not much impact on the overall balance.
Except you’re not clearly understanding why reliability was a problem (it wasn’t).
You’re close, but not quite there.
Double-barrier still works. Blizzard’s point in reducing its effectiveness wasn’t to make it useless, but to make alternative strategies available and just as effective. Double-barrier became the defacto “best” and “dominant” strategy and no other strategy was working or could work under the then current settings.
Why Reinhardt/Zarya is dominating now, is largely due to a buff made some time ago increase Reinhardt’s health and damage. There was no need for this, this was an attempt by Blizzard to change up the meta strategies that didn’t pan out, but subsequent changes to other outliers (Wrecking Ball) has returned Reinhardt/Zarya back into the metagame. Except, it’s worse now thanks to a buff made some time ago. GM - as always - doesn’t always play to the best or strongest. They play what works best for them. Outliers like Reinhardt/Zarya become dominant because for GM, it’s a composition that works best for them. Blizzard is just making that worse.
Had Blizzard not buffed Reinhardt, and continued to tweaking down the current meta; it’s like that Reinhardt/Zarya would become a strategy and composition equal to that others (or one or two other compositions). But now, we’re seeing the effects of what happens when you buff perfectly fine and well-tuned Tanks.
I imagine that when Reinhardt is eventually tweaked; Orisa will likely see some more serious play thanks to her new crit-immune Fortify.
That’s some looooooooong walls of text
70x5 is 350.
Factor in the accuracy and critical hit rate of those Storm Arrows every 10 seconds, and the damage averages are much lower 350, even if the critical hits happened.
And again, there are heroes who can do more with smaller cooldowns and more reliable landings.
It knocks down the target, understand the difference and the nuance.
YOU need to provide the difference, not me. YOU need to prove this, because this is YOUR attempt to change things. Under the game’s rules, Defense Matrix covers projectiles. Shield Bash is not a projectile, it is a melee ability, and if Defense Matrix can cover that, then it must be able to cover all other abilities. That means that Rocket Punch, Accretion, Primal Rage, Reinhardt’s Hammer, Uppercut, Whipshot, Hook, cannot work while Defense Matrix is active.
Now if you want to change those rules, be my guest, but keep in mind that won’t free you from criticism.
So Mei’s primay can now be deflected by Genji then? If Defense Matrix is going to be breaking rules, then D.va is broken. If you’re changing the rules, then Genji can deflect Mei’s primary. You can’t make weird exceptions like this, you need to define the rulesets.
It’s hard to take you seriously when you continue to regard abilities as “trash” like Doomfist and Roadhog.
As for heroes with 300 damage abilities. There’s Reinhardt with up to 600 damage with one Firestrike.
There’s Lucio’s Soundwave with a potential 600+ damage potential environmental kill.
There’s McCree with up 300 damage Fan the Hammer, available every 1.2 seconds. Or twice every 6 seconds.
It’s clear you’re not understanding the point of cooldown timers. Maybe you might understand it this way;
0 second
Firestrike 600 damage
Helix Rock 120
FTH 300x2
Storm Arrow 700
6 seconds
Firestrike 600 damage
Helix Rock 120
FTH 300x2
10 seconds
Storm Arrow 700 damage
12 seconds
Firestrike 600 damage
Helix Rocket 120 damage
FTH 300x2 damage
18 seconds
Firestrike 600 damage
Helix Rocket 120 damage
FTH 300x2 damage
20 seconds
Storm Arrow 700 damage.
In sum time of 20 seconds;
4 instances of Firestrike at 600 damage for 2400
4 instances of Helix Rocket at 120 damage for 480
4 instances of FTHx2 for 300x2 for 2400
3 instances of Storm Arrow for 2100.
Now let’s factor in accuracy. Let’s say 40% for all abilities.
Firestrike is 960
Helix Rock is 192
FTHx2 is 960
Storm Arrow 840
Now critical hit rate, 10%
Storm Arrows 756.
Now if you want to average real numbers for all the above abilities (like Firestrike, Helix Rocket, FTH) and find their real accuracies, you’ll probably find that the numbers would still average around the same numbers as Storm Arrows. It’s fairly certain that FTH has a accuracy of over 60%, as would Helix Rocket.
Behind every barrier there’s a Tank and possibly more shooting through it. It’s not possible to dive through every barrier with smart positioning. Otherwise, were it possible, Reinhardt would not be so dominant.
So there must’ve been a problem with Wrecking Ball when his pick rate was less than 1% in GM a year ago. And clearly, there’s a problem with Ashe right now when she’s below the pick rate of Doomfist. Clearly, pickrates have always indicated that the character is underpowered when they aren’t picked.
Dive isn’t the only strategy. Nor is it the only solution.
Queue times have nothing to do with it. This is about balancing the game. If the game is constantly broken on one side and isn’t fixed, players would still leave in droves.
You need to look at other competitive games and learn and understand why the metagame shifts and settles. You need to understand not every competitive player is picking the top and most powerful heroes in the game in every match-up. The competitive do not pick based on tiers; they pick what they can win with.
Secondly we have evidence. GOATS provided that evidence. GOATS would continue even now were the compositions not locked. Tanks are borderline broken and have been since the beginning of beta. No competitive game gives as much resilience and power to a small subset of heroes as Overwatch does. Tanks are an anomaly; they don’t belong in competitive games.
This is a bad argument. For all of it’s complexity, and unbalanced gameplay and roster, Super Smash Bros. Melee is still popular with a small crowd. As is Marvel Capcom 2; as is Street Fighter 3rd Strike. As is Counterstrike, League of Legends, and DOTA 2.
You’re inferring where there is no inference.
They aren’t. Going in the other extreme is also bad.
I’m pretty sure that D.va lines up with Winston, Sigma and Roadhog in terms of popularity, maybe even more popular than them (based on some anecdotal evidence). So it doesn’t really matter than to a huge chunk of the playerbase what state D.va is in, as long as she’s playable and remains fun. This thread, this forum (and reddit) don’t even constitute 1% of the playerbase and neither does GM.
Most aren’t even aware of the balance changes that happen. Overwatch is old by video game standards. The only ones that play nowadays are general interest latecomers, and die-hards like you. The rest of the players that left Overwatch, aren’t coming back until OW2 or on a rare blue moon. No changes here, otherwise are going to change that.
Dive is not the only solution. You need to be objective.
Hence why no one has a problem with them.
ALl I seem to remember is what you just said. I don’t remember snipers dominating there. If they did, it wouldn’t be called the SuperHog meta.
Neither of which is MOBA tactics.
It wouldn’t. You’re not getting it.
It’s still irrelevant.
Whether it’s 3 meters or 1 meter, Sigma still needs to lead to get good returns for Grasp. And besides that, Grasp has never been a peel, Accretion has.
This will never happen. You need to be objective here.
Right now, Double Barrier is still viable. It’s just not dominant.
This is not going to happen. You need to understand this.
Reading must be so difficult for you. Or you just don’t have patience.