That’s wrong… The limiting factor is Tank players and to a lesser extent support players. Unless there’s a mass exodus, a loss of Damage players won’t have a significant impact on queue times cept to make the Damage queue shorter.
What other reason would they have for experimenting with a game mode? It’s pure logical deduction. They spent well over a month attempting adjustments to it before they realized it just did not work with high mobility nor did it flow well.
They even entirely removed it until a few die hard fans requested it be re-added. To which it was added to the rotation after that. Without those few die hard fans it would have never seen the light of day again.
The compromise was arcade and obscurity.
Which indicates that it is a big enough problem that they even considered ditching 2-2-2. They aren’t going to dedicate time to something unless they are trying to fix something. If it was such a great success and the problems minor they would not have so quickly (by their own standard of “quick”) tried to experiment to fix.
There is absolutely no evidence to support it as a success. Every action of the dev’s speaks far more the words of any dev or player.
They are sweating in their boots. Doing everything they can to correct a mistake without admitting fault.
2 Likes
Lol these type of threads always ignore the more obvious sensible solutions that dont require ruining the whole core gameplay of tanks and supports or going back to the horrible coinflop mess before role que.
- Add more engaging tanks/support options
- improve game balance
- increase incentives for playing all roles
- increase feelgood factor for clutch plays within those roles such as clutch heals, good utility usage, good peel that saves a team mate etc.
Profit without catering to dps players who just want quick que times but have no care for teamwork, synergies etc
Can you direct me in the arcade selection of where to find comp classic? I took your advice and looked everywhere in arcade for it but I seem to can’t find it
No matter how engaging you make tanks and support. The majority will still play dps. You may attract one or two out of 50-60 people but thats a drop in the bucket.
You know this is blizzard right?
The incentive was when everyone was responsible for all roles. They removed that. No amount of reward system can replace that.
The feel good factor is so subjective. Not to mention most of the time the healers and tanks get the praise, the potg, and the cards. How on earth can you improve the feel good factor anymore then that?
Last I checked this is a player issue and not a role issue. I’ll watch someone choose hanzo and the tank does not even consider zarya.
I’ll watch someone choose Pharah and the two supports will remain picks that have no consistent means of healing her.
I’ll watch a McCree ignore flashing the rein out of his shield so his rein can shatter.
That is a player problem and cannot be placed at solely the feet of dps.
4 Likes
I am not aware of any valid data at this time that supports the claim of a majority
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Overwatch 2 is guaranteed to open with multiple new tanks and supports, per Jeff.
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As stated multiple times, game balance is at its best in the last 4 years.
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Loot boxes aren’t enough to make people care.
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They cheesed the Play of The Game algorithm to favor supports, even when they do nothing spectacular. That’s not going to keep people playing this game.
Check
Yet there are still MULTIPLE tanks/supports that were either unnecessarily over-nerfed or have been neglected throughout CC/power creep such as zen, bap, winston, dva, orisa, ball and possibly sigma. When this many heroes need help is it any wonder why people drift away from the roles?
Loot boxes are the worst incentive any1 could come up with. Blizzard needs to put genuine thought behind real incentives such as a priority que reward of some sort
Potg sucks in its current state and doesnt favour genuine decent support or tank plays such as utility + clutch heal combos or tank peeling, setting up teamwipe etc.
Thats not the only way of making the roles feel rewarding tho. Jeff has defo spoken about different ways of increasing feelgood factor of those roles for Ow2 recently which is a positive sign… cant find link unfortunately
They really haven’t moved on. They still talk about it a lot in interviews.
The idea of 3, 2, 1, wasn’t received as well, but the team believes they know why. “If Overwatch would have released with a 3,2,1 system, everyone would probably be fine with it, but since we didn’t, players got used to something and don’t want to see it be changed,”
That is not moving on. That looks like they think that if they force the issue, the players will accept it.
That may be right, or it may be wrong, but, they haven’t moved on from it. I think it is coming.
This reply evaded my notice when I first replied…
I still love how people regurgitate this overexagge- nay hyperbole - every time this topic comes up…first of all you didn’t have to and that SPECIFIC issue was already addressed…if you didn’t bother taking the (real easy) step to avoid that…that’s on you
Second - it’s the BIGGEST over exaggeration in history of OW…even in QP it didn’t happen…and it was even less likely to happen in comp as there was something on the line there…Jeff even came on here and touted 222 as the way most people play the game…the thing the community defaults to (which I can verify is very much the case even in QPC - my games are 95% of time either 222 or 132 there)…you could play 20 straight game of 222 and if you got a game with 4 dps you would scream bloody murder “UGH WHY ARE THERE ALWAYS 5 DPS ON MY TEAM”…
This whole 5 dps “boogie monster” has been perpetuated so much that community actually believes it was/is a thing
222 didn’t solve THAT…it just handcuffed everyone into playing something they were already doing for the most part…and I literally mean handcuffed…the game is a shell of itself now…variety and flexibility, which are supposed to be core staples of this game…are gone…and with it giant portions of the player base…
5 Likes
Pretty much like the urban myth of “hide and rez Mercy”. Once something is removed from the game, people tend to believe what they think they remember, even if it was never a fact in the first place.
It’s a common psychological phenomenon, actually. That’s why data is valuable while checking past history.
1 Like
Role queue has made the game playable for me. As someone with ~17,000 games played I can say with confidence that at least 50% of them were unplayable as one team would have a viable team comp and the other would have something that doesn’t even remotely work. This was because people had their subset of playable heroes and there was never a good compromise that allowed all of the people to fill the role that they were good at.
They just helped Sigma out in the last patch to compensate for a couple of his nerfs. Orisa is okay, DVA is still great, Ball is amazing and is going to be even better when the new Mei nerf drops, Winston may need something small, Baptiste is perfectly fine, and so is Zen. None of the characters you named are struggling to be viable.
I already detailed exactly why they did that in my previous post… I don’t think it’s that hard to comprehend really:
Are you referring to the Classic game modes here??
As I already said, if it really was such a big of a problem, they would have immediately implemented 3/2/1 into the game.
Since they didn’t do that, that means one thing and one thing only, that there are certainly important problems with 2/2/2 role lock (as there are with literally everything else in this world), but they’re not enough in any way in order to change the positive overall opinion of the majority of the player base towards the system, etc.
- In one of the latest Developer Updates Jeff Kaplan himself said that 2/2/2 role - queue was overall a “positive” change.
- Here are some official developer quotes that were released a couple of months ago:
And even more importantly, here’s the point where the overall very positive opinion of the majority of the game’s player base is touched upon:
- I have to admit this isn’t such a trustworthy source, but just the fact that the grand majority of the unofficial polls created in social places as historically negative for some reason as these Forums have surprisingly shown 2/2/2 role - lock to be a clear winner amongst fans, with the different concensus sometimes even touching 3:1 in favor of the system really says a lot …
But yeah, write all of them off while not providing even the slightest amount of evidence which proves your dream of 2/2/2 role - lock’s supposed ““failure””…
Truly bias at its finest… 
Youre extemely naive to believe that.
I strongly suggest playing all those heroes, looking at their pick rates and win rates then coming back and rethinking your opinion
Would love to have a link of the above…
As I think I’ve already told you already (hi again by the way 
), I doubt such a prospect extremely, for obvious reasons of course and for reasons I’ve most probably already provided…
I play with a Masters DVA and Zen. We don’t have any problems. I see you’re on PS4. If you want the smoke, you can get it.
for sake of clarity, I am (and was, at the time I wrote my response quoted above) aware of all of these items.
- I am referring to capture the flag.
- Your argument is they never undo or throw away something they invest time and money into. Yet in the same breath you admit they put time and money into 3-2-1 and threw it away.
No. Capture the flag.
Not true. They had already learned from that mistake. They may not admit to them publicly or typically revert mistakes but they do learn from them at least half the time.
They had already made the mistake of implementing 2-2-2 without long term public testing and saw the results. Results that they are very much trying to figure out how to combat. So much so they were willing this time to dump a bunch of effort and risk it meaning nothing in the end.
They introduced experimental so they could try it without long term risk. Because the last time they did such a sweeping change it did not do well (2-2-2)
Of course he did. Like I said before, Blizzard and especially the OW dev’s are infamous for never admitting mistakes. They make public statements as a PR move. Not as honest developers. Why? Because the shareholders want the value of their holdings to remain steady. Honesty would mean negative fluctuations in their holdings.
It is naive to take a dev of a AAA company at face value. Especially a fortune 500 company who’s main concern is appeasing the shareholders. Not its player customer base.
3 Likes
They need to make supports invincible but unable to do any damage or contest any objectives. Their job is to simply heal their teammates and provide utility. They can all have black and white striped jerseys and they can be the scapegoat if their team loses the match.