There are plenty of universal rules for game development, ask me about them.
You have not countered this, you just tried to bicker and skip round the idea of what the definition of endgame is instead of addressing the point directly:
Endgame does not mean custom games, it means where players are lead via internal game structures, not external. Please stop fussing about words when i’ve repeatedly given you definitions as to what i mean.
We only have 1 permanent competitive game mode. More than 1 would be confusing.
“I have no obligation to explain it” to me means “i cant answer this question”. Please answer the question.
I’ve read plenty of feedback about 132 - there are 2 general camps (with exceptions, of course) - DPS players like it and everyone else does not.
I’ve given you plenty of valuable information about a lot of things so far, you’re just too busy bickering and desperately trying to avoid the point to see it.
Dismissing the entire content of these forums because you think people who post here are stupid is very short sighted. Yes, the players here have plenty of strange views, but that’s actually incredibly useful as a designer.
But, then again, you dont seem to actually want a decent debate yourself, you’re just dodging the point because you’re absolutely welded to the idea that QPC comp is required. While i do value your opinion, it seems you’re going round in circles here, refusing to accept concepts or explanations or even answer questions. I’m here to try learn about players and share my views on a few concepts relative to game design, but it seems you’re here to just argue, so your opinion is becoming increasingly less valuable to me.
Players are lead to the Open Division/Path to Pro via promotions in the Battlenet launcher, which is something every player needs to open in order to get to the game
Your definition of endgame is wrong.
Indeed, whether I can or cannot answer the question doesn’t matter. Jeff has already said that it doesn’t make it easier to balance
My definition of endgame is what i said it was. Wiggling around the point doesnt change the fact that IN MY DEFINITION, 2 endgame game modes will confuse players.
Your opinion matters here and that’s fine - i’m happy to accept you cant answer or counter my point. 222 reduced the number of possible comps by a factor of 1000, which made the game easier to balance. That alone is a great reason to abandon trying to balance QPC.
I am here to debate, you’re here to avoid questions and blindly push for a game mode regardless of what people say.
I defined what i was talking about. Lets refer to it as “ingame endgame” if that will make you happier. Keep wiggling.
2 ingame endgame game modes will confuse players. Please, tell me why this isnt true. Its not irrelevant because its what we’re talking about. Keep wiggling.
222 reduced the number of possible comps by a factor of 1000, which made the game easier to balance. That alone is a great reason to abandon trying to balance QPC. Please, tell me why this is not true. Keep wiggling.
You’ve complete failed to answer questions or counter any points for the majority of this thread, as you have with the entire post i quoted.
You’re completely lacking in interesting content. I’m done with you.
Note that we’re talking about Competitive players.
These are players who’ve already played Quickplay or other gamemodes to level 25.
Any confusion could be prevented by simply presenting new players with the choice when they queue for Quickplay, to go into either Role Queue Quickplay or Quickplay Classic.
This way they’re already primed on what to expect.
Furthermore, Competitive players are expected to have more of an enthusiasm for exploring and understanding the game.
It’s up to them to take the initiative and learn what each game mode is about.
Considering they’re enthusiast players, if they’re really interested in the “endgame” side of things, they’ll already have looked into the OWL etc. and taken note of the fact that tournaments are played by the Role Queue ruleset insofar as team composition.
If these players are genuinely confused - should they really play Competitive to begin with?
If you want to talk about confusion, what about the fact that players will be confused by three separate roles that Role Queue introduced in the first place, having a separate SR for each of them, not knowing which one is the most important or “endgame”, and the fact that 10 minute queue times for one particular role is very consumer-unfriendly and off-putting to players?
According to Jeff Kaplan it didn’t.
Rather than ask me to provide a source for my statement as a reasonable person might have done you simply ignore this.
Indeed I have no obligation whatsoever to explain a theory of yours that has already been discredited by the lead developer.
Which QP mode do i click? Which one does the DEVS want you to click?
What about the differences between the heroes? How do you explain that in QP?
What if i like a hero in one mode, but that hero plays completely differently in another mode?
Which button do the devs want players to pick first? How does that affect the UI? How does that affect user flow and analytics?
How will a new game mode affect 222 players?
How are competitive points distributed?
How does this affect the SR system? How do the devs maintain 2 completely separate SR systems at the same time? How is that affected by analytics?
How does this affect level design? Systems design? Social design?
How does it affect Overwatch 2? How does it affect PVE and new game modes?
That’s just a quick sample of a few questions that would need to be answered. Go for it dude
RE: 222 balance futureproofing. Just because Jeff didnt explicitly call out an easily proven fact doesnt mean its not true. It is true, and its mathmatically provable. A theory is not discredited just because its hasnt been specifically mentioned (hint - they wont, because any hint of weakness would be like throwing yourself to the forum wolves).
“2 modes would confuse players”
What is confusing? if you want to play 222 you pick this comp mode… if you prefer the game without role q then pick an another… not that hard…
“222 balance futureproofing, easier to balance”
Fine! Delete every hero and keep soldier only for example… would be a dream to balance that
OW’s marketing back then: “you can change to every hero ingame”… now it’s not true anymore… as the time passes we are more limited and we are getting less content… even the content we have now they just remove it (see map pools)… idk what are u doing ACTIVISIONBLIZZARD…
Honestly, it would be better to just revert QP to solve queue times and keep comp 222. Splitting the comp playerbase is just not a great idea. I already think we are spreading everything thin as is.
I’m not asking for YOUR opinion, i’m asking which mode is the best for everyone? One has to be the better of the two, so which one? And how do you communicate that to players without upsetting them or making them feel like they’re playing a lesser mode?
Question dodging again eh? You have 1 more reply, you dodge, i stop.
No, there are 2 options. Players will see 2 and want to play the best one. Which is it?
Presenting them a choice doesn’t stop them from realising one mode is better and has more resources being spent in it than the other, how do you make them feel like they’re not playing a lesser mode?
Ok, cool - well done, you answered a question. Do that again and i’ll keep answering (although answer them ALL next time, not just the one you like). While you’re wrong (for various reasons i’ve repeatedly told you), we can now move on.
So, lets say that QPCC is the best game mode, what happens with the other one? As a dev you want people playing the mode you’re supporting the most - how do you funnel people into it without lessening the other one? How do you make other people feel like they’re not playing a bad mode? How do you stop the community splitting between the 2 modes?
How do you get support from your bosses at the game company to justify having 2 separate game modes that split your playerbase and your workforce (engineers, game designers, data analysts, everyone involved with OWL etc etc)?
