As a Genji One-Trick, these buffs hurt me

General Discussion
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Okay, i’m not fully a Genji One-Trick.
Well i’d say that’s not true with my hours on Genji, and if at all these hours don’t give me the right to say what’s good or not since i’m not that high of a ranking.

Though this chaotic construction of what the developers would call a healthy change for this game:

https://imgur.com/a/kifKxSn

Does not feel well imo at all.

Yeah sure, people can call Genji bad.
Many High SR Genji players have stopped playing him because he was trash, though this was done before his previous buffs were live correct?

Knowing he was already a middle pick after these buffs would have said enough that he’s fine.

He was always a top pick, right?
Many players disliked how well he could be used to overturn a fight.

Sure sure, he got tuned down too much though now he’s fine.

This buff practically changes the whole meta around.

Now this hero has:

  • High Damage output
  • Kit is extremely forgiving
  • High mobility
  • Fast ult charge.

Now let’s see.

An extremely mobile hero should not have this much damage, this literally means he’d be a fly annoying everyone and just shredding damage.

A hero with high mobility should rather have more strategy so players play more carefully with him to get more value.
Though now you can shred tanks.

Now that you can cancel deflect it seems too forgiving.
You could already cancel deflect with the use of wallclimb yes, so technically thats a clever gameplay element.

True, you can’t use this everywhere. Though that’s what makes it fair right?

Deflecting also mainly relied on predicting, which now is less hard due to the time of deflect being extended.

The worst part of this change

Really i thought the rest would be bad, but now because of his damage tune-up he can gain his ult much much faster.

If they were to keep this change, then they should at least make the Ultimate cost a little bit higher since he can literally stay in back and poke damage much much faster.

We’re looking to strengthen Genji’s close-range combat effectiveness to help solidify his viability as a mobile burst-damage hero. We’ll keep a close eye on his overall power as we’re increasing both the flexibility of Deflect and improving the shuriken damage consistency at the same time.

Come on, is this really a good reason now?

Anyhow, what do you all think of it being live?
Would you want to keep the changes like this, or would you add/change or revert this patch?

Also this damage change does not throw me off with my dash at all.

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[Album] imgur.com
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The powercreep keeps going

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I don’t think he’s going to be that great TBH

I can see below diamond he improves, but in Masters/GM I doubt his pick rate will budge much.

That being said, I wouldn’t buff him anymore I think the overall power level of the game needs to be reduced a bit.

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The complaints will hopefully land him some nerfs and/or reverts. Until then, I’d recommend dusting off your Torbs, Sombras, and Winstons. Of those, Sombra is my best, so I plan to make some weeb lives hell as much as possible.

Alas, poor Doomfist is now in the gutter, otherwise he’s great. Punching a weeb sword guy into a crater feels very satisfying.

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We’ll see.

Of course i could be kind of exaggerating here.
Genji always has been greatly reliant on the changes of other heroes, though i feel the recent patches have quite changed this up to not be like this anymore.

I’d say we can keep this patch for now, though i think we must act on what kind of data it produces.

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True, but the Canceling deflect prematurely is not a good idea imo

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When strategy involves waiting for the rest of your team to do something because you can’t, there’s a problem.

There is nothing wrong with wanting Tracer levels of agency during a fight.

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So because we have low skill DPS players we must re-adjust to them?

Wrong way to think imo, because if you want better DPS then you got to pick your teammates a bit more carefully.

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I haven’t played against the changes yet, so I’ll reserve most judgment for now, but I will say it gives me some second thoughts about playing supports rn.

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Every DPS has their own merits, in this case Genji is extremely mobile.

Though if a tank is constantly being healed, then that would be free ult charge for the DPS so it’s actually helpful.

The point is that they shouldn’t go againt these tanks?
That’s just dumb buffing a hero because of a clear scenario that can be resolved.

And just as i mentined, everyone their own merits.
If this isn’t the thing where Genji performs strongly, then you should switch DPS.
Not make one single DPS hero able to function with alot of these merits so you don’t need to choose other DPS heroes.
Because hey, we already have enough of these DPS heroes right?
Why not put them to use like… you know by adding variety to their kits so they can be good in different types of scenarios which enable players to strategize using these heroes by considering the possibilities.

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I think its funny that they’ve decided to basically target buffs on his right click spam (the lowest skill part of Genji play) + making deflect more forgiving for poor executions instead of something higher skilled Genjis could use for more impressive plays, like increased shuriken speed. I think it was very intentionally made to benefit Genjis at the lower levels of play.

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Assuming devs don’t lean in hard on Dive buffs, as a counter to DoubleBarrier.

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They want their golden goose back in action on owl screens 24/7. Whatya expect?

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That’s just strategizing,

Utilizing tanks like this is fine, it works well.
That’s fine, this doesn’t indicate that you can’t use DPS to counter this.

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I wouldn’t call Genji easy to play in the slightest
Also, his mobility will never be on the level of Tracer or Echo or Doomfist.
I think these changes are alot, but Genji’s been power crept out of the meta for the last 3 years

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I think this reaction is over the top. IMO he still wont even be the best flanker, let alone game breaking. Tracer is monsterous and synergises better with brig. Echo still has better mobility, ult, and tank matchups. All of his counters still work the same. Give it 2 weeks, people will remember how to counter Genji.

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No, genji has spent the last 3 years throwing games, ask anyone who is worth anything with genji and they’ll tell you to swap off genji because he’s trash.

He has been an ULTIMATE bot for the longest time now. This way he can contribute when he doesn’t have blade and a nano to make it not trash.

It’s complete bs to say he was even healthy, let alone a top pick.

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Tanks and healers are a reaction to the overall damage. You can’t just keep trying to fix tanks and healers when the meta will always be the same till overall burst and cc are not the be all end all of what tanks absolutely must shield otherwise your teammates evaporate randomly and those include your healers and when they’re dead you’re on death row as a tank hero. It is in the tanks best interests to shield those healers, and that is ONLY because burst damage is too damn dangerous left unchecked in this game, and non burst damage is permanently absolute TRASH comparatively so the tank line never has to spec otherwise.

You can rework the tanks and healers, but the new tanks and healers will be what best emulates the same crap weve been playing until you rebalance what tanks and healers are there to NULLIFY. We’ve just been anti burst metas ever since they killed dive, everything has just been to defend against burst, and ironically even then, with anti burst metas, burst is still the best in slot because the burst heroes also for some insane odd reason rock the dps of non burst heroes being same or greater than in most cases, and armor only destroys non burst damage and burst only loses 5 total damage against armor at all times, while non burst loses 25-50% of their damage per shot so you get why tanks and supports aren’t trying to defend against what just isn’t a threat.

Oh and burst doesn’t have to fight the rate of incoming healing while non burst has to fight it the whole way, because you can’t heal one shots, but you can heal non burst easy, yet the overall dps on burst to non burst is the same? That has never made any sense, if you have a burster, you don’t have a shieldbreaker - No no no wait I have a great idea letsjustputalltheburstheroesconsistentdpsuptothelevelofeveryoneelsesbecausetheycan’tbreakshields - god forbid they tell you guys you should swap to more suitable heroes, instead they trashed it and every meta has been to stop it ever since dive got stabbed in the eyesocket.

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He is though.

Look, some heroes have a slightly longer learning curve. And yes, Genji has that because of all his movement. But lets be really honest here, the difference in time to learn is not that large even from the highest to the smallest. And, while Genji is on the higher side, he is not even the highest.

But, the real question of how ‘hard’ a hero is comes down to how powerful their kit is. Once you have learned a hero (again, not a real long time) it really only matters if that hero’s kit is stronger or weaker than the majority of who he is fighting. And Genji’s kit is stronger than the majority of heroes. This means that if he goes into a fight with a equal skilled opponent on a different hero, he will have the advantage more often than not. As long as he has the advantage in an equal skill match-up, he will have an easier time winning. If he has the easier time winning, he is the easier hero.

Here is my challenge to that. Genji is still the 3rd most played character. More played than the heroes that ‘power crept him out.’ He may not be part of the “meta” ideal team, but he is not out.

No, they don’t. The longer and controllable deflect is a HUGE deal against some of his “counters.” Like it means he now has the advantage over McCree.

Also, the biggest issue is that it forces you to play into heroes that are stronger against him. These buffs take some of his interactions from strongly favoring Genji to pointless for the other hero to even try. What these buffs do is drop the viable hero choices through the floor anytime Genji is on the other side. And, he is already the 3rd most played. After this I honestly expect him to be the 2nd or very likely most played.

You just don’t get it. It means that your don’t have a choice but to play the few heroes that stand a chance against him. For healers Zen is out, Baptist is pointless, Ana is just asking to die. For dps, either have to play a beam hero or one that can run away from him. That is it. Projectile heroes are going to get smoked. Hit scan are going to be at a disadvantage. When a hero is so strong your only good choice is to play a handful of heroes that have a chance you have a broken design.

You don’t have the evidence on your side. We have the stats. He is a solid hero, and has been for a LONG time. He is used to a great deal of success by a lot of people. He is one of the strongest heroes in the game. People need to stop this idiotic pretense that he is bad. You will never see a trash hero with his play time.

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