I do have an equal opinion on their lore. Its a slight backstory for each character to give them some type of personality and explain who they are or why they do what they do.
If Cassidy or torb were bisexual it would add nothing to their character and just be there as a useless addition so players can feel represented or relatable. Its just unnecessary.
I mean honestly outside of close relationships I just don’t think it matters. It’s one of these things that really only needs to come up when it’s friends having conversations about relationships/sexual preferences, or obviously when someone is looking for more than that. The last thing I care to know about the dude waiting my table at a restaurant is he was born a woman. I just want to know when he’s going to refill my drink.
I have pretty much the same thought about gaming. If the storyline of the game is about relationships and sex, the personal lives of the characters, or it has real plot relevance then by all means go into that level of detail. I just don’t see a reason to force it into games where robots, monkeys, dwarves, and ninjas are running in circles trying to kill each other.
Because there’s no reason to force anything. You’re spot on there. Like I said, I’m trans myself and I don’t want it to be forced in.
If it fits the character, their story and their overall feel? Sure, I’m all for it. But I don’t want to see it just so they can tick off another option in the “diversity checklist”
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Alright, so, we’re good with backstory being small or not significant because it just builds an overall idea of who they are. Torb being a straight and married builds a bit about him in the background. I’m on board.
And then you lose me completely. Why is being bi or gay or trans unnecessary but being straight is just some type of personality? If your argument is it would be clunky to just be like “Announcing today! Lucio is FtM!” Yeah, unnecessary, not great. But if we got say a deep background comic into Genji and we see some childhood where Genji was originally female and it’s just there as part of Genji’s childhood without being forced. I don’t see how that’s a big deal (Not suggesting changes to either Lucio or Genji, just examples).
It’s like with Tracer. Her being a lesbian is NOT necessary to the plot, but it also wasn’t presented as a big deal, just part of who she is.
Absolutely this. Just gotta think about the setting of overwatch. Its a utopian world that has moved on from primitive mentalities centuries ago. Religion, sexuality, and gender feel like unnecessary information to add to a character if it truly doesnt affect the main lore of the game. Not like i expect to see any christian heroes in this game and it sure doesnt bother me at all.
Being straight is completely unnecessary information idk what you mean. Sexuality in general seems like unnecessary information to add to a character if it doesnt affect the lore of the main game. Brigitte is torbs daughter. Thats why they include his wife into his lore. To explain how she is his daughter. Reaper is a shell of who he was. Thats why they bring HIS wife into his lore. Shes a symbol of his past. And the whole cassidy and ashe thing is a story in itself. If they are trans or cis or whatever, how does it affect the lore i just said in ANY way?
Like I’ve said for years. Don’t make gay/trans characters so you can tell a story about them. Make stories where some of the characters just happen to be gay/trans.
Put thought into their environment, their childhoods, troubles they may have had along the way, and the good things that happened in their lives and how they dealt with it all.
Now when you make that story have those things influence their characters behavior. Don’t just have them running around preaching a message as a plot device. They are people, have them act like people.
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Ye, this.
The little christmas scene with Tracer and her GF was cute and very well done. But if they tried to shoehorn and force it in by having Tracer talk about her GF all the time, that’d just be pandering and annoying AF.
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pretty much this. i feel like coming to this discussion with the pretense of “they haven’t done enough” in a game that currently boasts one of the most diverse character rosters in the genre is a surefire way to shut people off to the conversation. while good representation has borne out to be an incredible motivator for cultural change, when we’re talking about a company that has “diversity charts” it’s challenging to think of a scenario in which a trans character would be added that isn’t just a bumbling attempt to relate to our experiences as a caricature at best.
trans representation, especially in sci-fi, is a pretty good vector for worldbuilding outside of commentary on our modern sociopolitical climate, so while i think that a medium like overwatch is a fantastic place for that representation to potentially exist, i would hold it to higher standards and hope that it bears out from a place of authenticity on the part of the writers, artists etc rather than another emotionally detached corporate infusion of marketable “woke” features crammed into a new character to appease outcry
…and realistically, trans discourse, both anti and pro, has elevated to unprecedented and incredibly dangerous levels over the past few years, and i could see that bearing out terribly in a company like blizzard that doesn’t really push boundaries with its media and seeks to retain the most number of people by pandering selectively to the right causes. it’s just a great way to get a character that’s painstakingly designed to be the least offensive manifestation of trans stereotypes possible, which is too much corporate overhead for me tbh
on the other hand, never let the enemy team forget who emily is. you take that spray and you meleecombo it onto every other wall you can find. that’s basic tracer maining
“Recognizing that the game industry has had certain skews — male-dominated is one obvious one, especially in design — we need to work harder to build and find the qualified candidates who are out there. We can’t just open up a position, take the first couple dozen resumes, look through them, and pick someone out of that pile, because we may just get a couple dozen white male resumes.”
-World of Warcraft director Ion Hazzikostas
You mean this? Yeah. That’s just straight up bigotry. I don’t care if the 12 best people you could hire were all trans half black half Asian women. Just hire the best people for the job. Skin color and sexuality have NO place in the work force.
Again, I’d argue if it’s not significant but also not propped up or focused there’s nothing wrong. Soldier 76 is Catholic, or was at least. Doesn’t bother me, also doesn’t feel forced. Like Avengers when Captain America says “There’s only one god and he doesn’t dress like that.” Alright, we establish Cap is some path of Christianity. It never comes up again to my knowledge, but I wasn’t suddenly bothered that Cap had a different faith than me and it wasn’t something harped or obsessed over.
So your argument is that it needs to have a purpose. But what do you define that purpose as? Tracer’s time with her girlfriend establishes what her home life is and that she has one and has things she fights for outside of the mission. But it’s not a huge beat in the story. May I assume you’d be perfectly fine with someone being transgender if it was treated in a similar casual way?
Jhaerik says it well, make characters. I 90% agree with this only diverging in that I do think you can end up with a good character starting from some basic idea. To use a non gender and sexuality example. Batman Beyond is an amazing show. The entire thing did NOT spring from someone coming up with Terry as an interesting character. The entire thing sprung up because the people with the money said “Do Highschool Batman!” Well, in a vacuum, that’s a dumb idea, Bruce didn’t go to Highschool with his villains, there’s no plot there and it involves reworking the character entirely if you wanted to force that story point. So they wrote a character around the idea (Because they said Highschool Batman, not Bruce) and away we go.
“We hate tokenism, make original transgender characters instead of changing established ones.”
Capitol saltines to initially trans characters 
Psychological warfare is effective.
Yep. After reading that, I just realized another reason I don’t want a trans character. If they shoehorn it in more than just a side-note in a cinematic (like Tracer), I don’t want to be attacked for playing that character. People already do that enough about the characters we already have… don’t wanna give them more ammo lol
At the very, very most I’d accept for “trans representation” in the lore would be just happening to see a couple of photos from childhood before their transition, or a one time situation of said character meeting someone else after a long time and being “Oh, no. It’s [Current name] now” and both of them moving on from there.
Anything else is too much, imo.
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If tracer had a boyfriend and wasnt gay, it wouldnt make a difference. I guess what I’m trying to say is why is it important for sexuality or gender being in this game? I didnt even know tracer was gay because its not important that she is.
Oddly enough, I wasn’t bothered by Pelagos, but I also walked in having played Dragon Age Inquisition and the Qunari addressed transgender in a really good way despite them being a really crappy people. Qunari lean HARD into gender roles existing but then completely ignore any tie to biological sex. So if an assigned male Qunari identified as female and did tasks that Qunari women take care of, the society just goes “Yep, that’s what you are now, off you go.” Because the whole thing is regimented into your responsibilities and duties. It only comes up in plot because they have one Transgender male character who is done tastefully and because the Qunari party member is initially a bit confused by a female warrior Inquisitor. Not bothered, just confused. (Boils down to, you’re doing guy stuff, so why do you identify as a woman still?)
Yes and no, there needs to be more context. In a vacuum, yes, best for the job is best for the job. But, to give an example, Wizards of the Coast put out a campaign book that was all stories tying into cultures and ideas that are not mainstream Europe/US Caucasian. For that project they deliberately sought people with those backgrounds so as to have work more grounded in what they were going for. I can’t say that’s wrong of them.
The importance is in not marginalizing or pretending LGBTQIA+ don’t exist. Tracer being gay is not important. That there are gay characters, that it’s not a big deal, and that they have their own lives without it being some huge thing, that’s what’s important.
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This post proves that you should never post anything that makes gamerboys uncomfy on “gaming” related forums
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Seeing things like The Wheel of Time get PC-culture-a-fied really annoyed me personally. They really need to start making new stories instead of reworking older ones to fit some narrative that was never there. It just feels so tacky and forced when they do it that way.
Well, yeah. Nerd communities are filled with some of the worst degenerates. Im surprised this thread hasnt been yeeted out of existence yet.
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Having representation in a video game is not important. Not in any way, shape, or form. The setting of OW is that its a utopian society that includes everyone and everything, no matter who you are. Thats inclusion and representation enough.
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