After Reading the Brigette Hate I've Decided

General Discussion
#317

That is false, I too despise dive, but think it foolish to simply embrace a clearly broken hero on the premise that it is a potential solution to dive.

To counter dive, all that is required is to facilitate surviving the impact and making it not worth the risk. What we ended up with is much worse, we ended up with a must pick hero that takes 5 minutes to master, and that includes the time it takes to remap your keys.

You also introduce chaos into the ranking system by artificially elevating people who cannot choose other characters and play at their expected level.

You create an environment in the game where legitimately people are packing up and going elsewhere as a direct result of the massive impact the introduction of a single hero has had on the game.

This is not the right way to fix dive comp, and it still needs fixing.

1 Like
#318

you’re literally silver. flankers are absolute troll picks at your elo, and they NEVER “obliterate the backline with no contest” in ANY rank.
if countering her was SOOO easy surely the gms and top500 players would be able to do it without running a brig themselves right?
it’s quite simply not possible because she is absolutely the most overpowered hero in the history of the game.
and don’t complain about dive either, winston is only picked more than reinhardt in masters and above, literally only the top 3% of overwatch players are playing “dive meta”

1 Like
#319

I can’t speak for everyone but I definitely don’t fit into your idea of the type of people who hate Brigitte.

I’m unflinchingly positive in all my games. I flex when necessary. And most of all - I play a lot of Overwatch in a Competitive 6-stack environment. I’m competing in the Open Division with a team and I play in scrims with friends via Discord.

I play this game with a very high degree of coordination and cooperation. And so far I really dislike Brigitte.

Why do I dislike Brigitte?

  • She brings entirely too much value for her low skill requirements (similar to pre-nerf Mercy)
  • She adds a TON more loss-of-control effects to a game that didn’t need them (juggle, stun AND knockback in one hero on short cooldowns)
  • She incentivizes a brawly style of play that results in a particle-effect-ridden supernova in every fight, making aiming difficult if not impossible
  • She greatly nullifies high-projectile-count heroes AND heroes that need to be in close quarters
  • She is a terrifying offensive threat while being able to play from a defensive position (shield bash while shield is up)
  • She retains the effects of her ultimate between and across fights, meaning she and her team can benefit from her ultimate while she charges up a second ultimate
  • She has 250-300 effective HP + a 600 HP shield and a tiny hitbox making her incredibly difficult to kill
  • She turns Zenyatta and Zarya into unkillable monsters

None of the things above is game-breaking in isolation but together they make her both unfun to play with/against as well as oppressive.

3 Likes
#320

You completely washed away the rest of your post with this one line. Mercy 2.0 was head and shoulders more OP than Brig, and that lasted 8+ months.

Also this devalues your comment a bit too. You realize that at that level the only counter for a widow, is another widow. And for tracer, another tracer? Should we nerf them too?

1 Like
#321

valk mercy had a much lower winrate (53%) and a slightly lower pickrate than brig.
if she was picked less and won less often how was mercy stronger? oh that’s your opinion when numbers stated otherwise.

actually in comp play, team coordinated dives destroy enemy widowmakers without running one themselves. also tank heavy comps and shields in general counter widow.
and tracer is only an “issue” above gm. she does have counter play through teamwork but i will admit in pro play and top500 elo, dive maps counter tracer by running another one.

#322

Just a heads up, Jeff has commented on the topic of Brigitte:

2 Likes
#323

Can I get a source here?

#324

It isn’t true. Mercy’s pickrate was so high that overbuff recorded the trend in GM as being above the theoretical maximum of 16.67%. You can compare the two trends by going here:

#325

overbuff
during the first week of november (valk mercy), she had an average pickrate of 15.6 and a winrate of 53% (similar in gm level play but a 54% winrate instead).

brigitte 15.85% pickrate and 57% winrate.

#326

Ok but, that’s not a source, that’s saying where you got it from. Can I get a link?

#327

h ttps://imgur.com/a/dQDdz9w
if i could highlight her pickrate too i would have but it was where i stated it was.

#328

I don’t know why you keep ignoring junkrat. Pick any comp you want that counters the other comp and replace brig with junkrat - done. You’re acting like its absolutely impossible to counter brig and that’s unequivocally false. I win most of my games in both QP and in comp against brig, with or without one on my team. Junkrat is a hard counter. Stop ignoring that.

1 Like
#329

So what we are seeing here, is a reworked old character, vs a brand new character that has never been played in competitive before.

And you don’t think that, that would have any bearing on pick rate or win rate?

People are more excited to play Brig in comp as she just released, she’s also brand new so there have been no strategies or counters fleshed out vs her inflating her win rate.

Not to mention mercy is just in general boring to play, I feel we can all agree with that. Much less fun than Brig, thus further inflating her pick rate.

And low and behold, in one day, Brig has lost an entire percentage point of her win rate, and it will continue to settle down. Which again makes me raise the same point yet again. We are 2/3 days into her release. These stats are meaningless.

#330

Also, as of right now, mercy has a 57% win rate in GM. Should we nerf her again?
And since you want to keep using GM as a baseline, currently her winrate is 54.5%. That’s lower than mercy.

#331

dont give me the “new hero fallacy”
sombra was a troll pick right off the bat, doomfist was never statistically op, just annoying, orisa was a semi weak pick at first, moira is easy to pickup and play, strong but not quite op. you get the point

and mercy is still quite a strong pick, a tier pick in high elo and pro play (rez on cooldown). but there’s more than 1 hero that needs more attention than mercy.
and don’t call me surprised if mercy gets a rework to make her “more fun” but weaker overall.

issue with your logic.
brigitte is on both teams almost every game, so one brigitte wins and one loses meaning brig’s winrate for the match is 50% despite being op. so her having a positive winrate anyway means she curb stomps teams without one

#332

Then explain brigs 54.5% win rate in GM. Which is a full 2.5% lower than Mercy.

#333

ive literally stated the meta includes junkrat over and over again.

#334

Brig is more often on both sides, thus pulling the win rate down. :stuck_out_tongue:

#335

Cool, so when I post a theory, it’s a fallacy. Yet when you do it’s fact.

Gotcha.

MB not you, was someone else that made the statement.

#336

it’s true though.
when a hero is picked so often that they end up on both teams one wins one loses, so the hero’s winrate for the match is 50%.
the closer a hero’s pickrate is to 100% (16.67 on overbuff) the closer their winrate HAS to be to 50%. brigitte is hovering between 85-95% pickrate in all elo’s yet has a winrate over 54% in all elo’s meaning she curb stomps any team without a brig.