I mostly play Scatter build, but sometimes I feel like I should go AA vs some tanky teams. But since I have to stay closer to enemy for the sake of stacking AA quest, I am often getting bursted or cc’ed, which results in dying and losing stacks.
The same problem arises when the quest is completed, because I still have to be close to enemies to get value from AA build, and I am still losing stacks from dying, which need to be regained in order to make value from the build. And the longer the game goes on, the harder to get enough aa’s for Redemption.
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Use it when you have the frontline to protect you, and when the enemy has one too. Its a lot easier to get stacks off the enemy frontline then it is to get them off the enemy Li Ming. Your AA’s can be talented to reduce armor which is good for bursting down enemies, even those beefy tanks.
Also I’d just work on positioning. Hanzo’s positioning is very important. And also, Hanzo’s range can be extended so I don’t feel like you need to be up close to get value from AA build.
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Scatter build with Q at 4 (W on BoE) is the most consistent build you can pick on Hanzo tbh.
AA build can be good if you have lots of space to AA safely, but even then W build will still do more damage since you will be getting those W resets from your AAs post 7.
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AA build is alot of damage but requires alot of safety sense it takes time to build up the stacks (especially in ranked).
AA hanzo is really scary stimmed or with the attack speed hat.
Q and W are the over all more consistent talents but with some coordination I think AA can be just as good.
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Thanks you all for the answers!
So, if my positioning sucks and I do not believe in my frontline then most of the times I should go usual Scatter build, picking Giant Slayer when I need to deal with tanks like Cho’Gall, Diablo or Stiches.
AA + scatter lvl7 has overall highest dps. aa-aa-W-aa-aa-W, 1 cycle takes just 2 seconds with completed quest. Very powerful with giant slayer vs tanky targets (if you hit all 5 scatter shots and both aa’s consistently, that’s 7% dmg/sec just from this one talent).
P.S. For comparison, playing W quest lvl1, 1 cycle takes 3 seconds (you still need 2 aa’s), so you get only 6% dmg/sec if you hit all 7 scatter shots. Base dps is also 20% lower for W vs mixed build.
I usually go Redemption when the opponents doesn’t have alot of dangerous dives, throws, burst combos in combination with my team having a couple of heroes that could benefit from the -Armor reduction effect (lvl7 talent). It’s fun to play and you can dish out alot of damage with the right positioning.
But since many setups have those bursty dive setups Redemption is always a risky talent. I personally mainly use Q and W build. It’s safer and more flexible against many setups.
Q build is good too but sometimes against certain setups you will feel like you’re doing close to no damage pre-16.
After 16 that build (Redemption with armor reducing aa’s + Giant Killer) rips even full souls Diablo to half health as fast as Tychus. I take it if enemy has 2 heavy tanks. Otherwise W.
It is also a bit dependent on decent allies, as dying is a setback (you go to 9 stacks and need to attack heroes 6x to regain lv1 talent).
By far worst build to take against two heavies (Like Stitches + Muradin) is Q build, it wont make even a scratch if you need to drive them away from an objective like Braxxis beacon.
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Without lvl7 W talent, that gives only 2%/second. Not really tychus level anti-tankiness (10%/second, 14%/s with sizzling).
With the lvl7 W it does come close enough (7%/s). The lvl7 W talent is really critical for the antitank aa hanzo build. And even though everything still revolves around fast aa’s, the real damage comes from the W’s.
I have no idea what you’re trying to say with this.
“Never Outmatched” has zero synergy with Redemption build if you are going full AA.
Redemption’s quest reward is increasing his AA speed. Hitting W is also very dependent on terrain angles, it can do nothing against a tank like Stitches who is not close to terrain.
Basic Attacks against Heroes lower the cooldown of Scatter Arrow by 3 seconds.
The synergy is very straightforward. Faster aa = faster cdr. It also puts it into perfect timeframe as 2 aa’s take exactly 2 seconds with completed redemtion and you get 6 sec reduction on W from them, bringing it to exactly 0 = W every 2 seconds.
Without the quest, you still need to do 2 aa’s to get the next W, which then takes 3 seconds. Ergo, with the redemption quest completed, you get 50% more W’s.
And then comes that:
Giant Slayer: Enemy Heroes hit by Scatter Arrow and Basic Attacks take a bonus 2% of their maximum Health as damage.
5 scatter particles = 10% dmg per use of W. 1 W every 2 seconds = 5%/second.
And you still have the 2%/second from the aa’s, giving a total of 7%/s (or 14% per aa-aa-W 2 second cycle).
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Never seen that build. There’s only one active build played at all in master+dia with Redemption, in last 5 patches. All AA with GS.
(HP doesn’t list builds played less than 10 times)
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It’s a monster build. Don’t sleep on it when you actually need antitank. It’s particularly amazing vs DW or any other fatties that are super easy to hit with all scatter shots. But ppl who play scatter build normally shouldn’t have trouble hitting it on any target.
As for terrain dependability, that’s hanzo in general. No matter what build you play, hanzo NEEDS to hit the scatter shots to reach his full potential. If you think you won’t be hitting scatters at all (wrong map, wrong comp or whatever reason), don’t pick hanzo.
That’s like taking tele build Ming, but instead of Illusionist you completely break the synergy of the kit by taking Glass Cannon 
I don’t really play Redemption but if I do, it’s to hit a tank who is close to you regardless of whether you can reliably bounce arrows on him or not, which is highly conditional
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Actually I don’t recommend giant slayer and the armor reduction at 7 that much. Even if you want a more AA centered build, go the spell power at level 7 and the increased damage on Q and AA when you hit AA/Q. You can do a REALLY big damage with this. I’ve seen Hanzos basically one shotting backliners with this, while still doing really big damage to tanks.
Armor reduction has no synergy with the build. It’s just a small (very) raw dmg buff. The better comparison would be the opposite: taking glass cannon (that’s the armor red talent equivalent for ming) over illusionist just for the raw damage.
Wat? He hits 50% faster and can take someone to -20% armor very fast = more aa damage.
Not to mention the target takes +20% damage from all sources including your teammates. I’ve never seen someone play that build without AA armor reduction.
I wonder if you played sl…
Even if you just hit the scatter arrow directly without splitting, that will be more dps vs a tank than with fully stacked 20 armor red (and 10 seconds to get to that 20 red is NOT really that fast).
Just for simplicity, using lvl1 hp/dmg values, while attacking non-avatar muradin with giant slayer:
aa-aa with armor red lvl7: 198x2x1.2 + 2765x0.04 = 586
aa-aa-W with W lvl7, hitting just initial W: 198x2 + 88 + 2765x0.06 = 650
aa-aa-W, hitting full 5 scatters: 198x2 + 88x5 + 2765x0.14 = 1223
So even worst case scenario (hitting W’s directly without splitting) favors the W talent with giant killer.
Sure, in reality, your team will also do some damage on that armor red, but you will also at least sometimes hit a full scatter instead of just shooting it directly (and as you can see from the numbers, that’s a massive difference).
If ppl are sleeping on this build, it’s really their problem. The build is incredible and really the ONLY way to play giant slayer on hanzo.
Hitting full 5 scatters on a tank is highly, higly conditional, plus you forgot Sharpened Arrowheads grants armor reduction on both Q and AA hits, which with finished redemption quest will allow him to get the full 20% reduction much faster than 10 seconds.
So even a slight one millimeter miscalculation = no 5 hits, or if it’s body blocked, no hits at all.
And it’s kinda unrealistic to expect you always hit full arrows on every target. If they aren’t close to a wall that’ll never happen.
If they’re being blocked by minions/monsters, like on Infernal Shrines or Braxxis, good luck getting even a single hit.
Vs autoing the tank constantly and watching their HP bar melt unless they charge straight at you.
I’ll take my chances…